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DIY - Gardening Do It Yourself Do you know a good gardening DIY plan? Are you in need for some good DIY ideas? This is the forum to discuss all Do It Yourself plans and questions. For example, learn about: The pipe work to support banana bunches, making pots out of newspaper, using plastic cups as pots, tips for building coverings for plants during winter, etc. If you know a good DIY plan, please share it here, and if you need one, please ask away!


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Old 04-04-2016, 07:21 PM   #1 (permalink)
 
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Default Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

I've been doing some reading and have seen packed dirt (probably costs most here than concrete) as an option but nowhere have I seen whether using an anchor in sand is the same as using one in clay/loam when it comes to real stability. I've taken out some posts that were coated heavily with concrete; it took some work but I did it. (I've never been able to budge one set likewise in real dirt.)

I ask because my neighbors, the hicks (and I use that term properly) next door, decided to insult me (yippee!) by installing a very pretty fence on their side of our chainlink which means I can take down the shabby garbage the former owners put up to fence in their wolf dogs. I plan to recycle it to the back of my lot line inside the existing chain link. I'll know if they used anything other than digging a hole when they set the poles when I remove it.

Know that I'm not expecting my fence to last for eternity and that if it's a bit wobbly it doesn't matter; I'm attempting to deter armadillos (stop laughing--I want to try) and perhaps other critters that sneak through the disappearing wires.

Before you giggle at a girl question like this know that I drove my truck in my backyard today where I slipped and slid in my "yard"...er, grass covered beach that I do mow as needed.
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Old 04-04-2016, 09:04 PM   #2 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

We only anchor our corner supports. Chain link we concrete all. For armadillos buy some castor oil and mix it with diomtemaceus earth and spread it around. Wont hurt them but drives them away.
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Old 04-04-2016, 10:24 PM   #3 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

How the heck do you pull back and keep sand away to even pour concrete? Digging a hole for planting 1 gallon pot entails scraping away a 3' wide sliding mess and quick work to set it for me.

For basically a "not forever" wood privacy linear fence (standard section width) about 75' long how many posts can I skip with concrete or could I skip that mess altogether?

Where do you purchase industrial strength castor oil? The refined stuff doesn't work from what I've read. A nice woman in Aldi told me to put used kitty litter in the holes. Um, no. I don't have cats now but, when I did, I didn't buy kitty litter because they were indoor/outdoor pets. They had their own outdoor potty which I set up for them and they never used my garden areas. Some animal waste doesn't belong in a garden IMO.
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Old 04-05-2016, 03:23 AM   #4 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

I've used regular castor oil just fine but if you need you can get the thick sticky stuff at farm and feed as a repellent that goes on the hose. There are also mole and gopher repellents already with it in. Just read the ingredients to be sure. For wood panel fence i would concrete all the posts. I have seen them with only some concreted. Only the top layer of sand should be loose. Even in the extreme sandhills that is how it is. Remove the loose layer with a shovel then use the post hole digger or auger.
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Old 04-05-2016, 03:26 AM   #5 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

Cat waste does not repell. Armadillos dug in our cat sand. Sometimes maybe it works. Not for us.
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Old 04-05-2016, 06:56 PM   #6 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

Darn I was just at my local feed store earlier. Will have to check about castor oil later this week. It appears this place is owned by a woman with a wicked sense of humor: fun place to shop.

I spoke with someone who has done fences here and he says to skip only 1 at most; a bag of Sakrete is cheap and does 2. Oh, well, I guess when the fence rots away the treated posts will remain in perpetuity.

Glad KL isn't the answer. I'd have to beg some nasty stuff from a neighbor. Beg? Nah. She'd probably gladly deliver it...
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Old 04-05-2016, 07:07 PM   #7 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

I also suggest getting hog or cattle panels with the smaller holes and cutting it in wide strips then nail it below soil level to keep out diggers. Other fence types rust and bend much easier and armadillos can at some point tear through.
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Old 04-05-2016, 07:09 PM   #8 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

Hog panel strips should be 2 x 16 after you cut them.
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Old 04-05-2016, 07:11 PM   #9 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

Hi Kat,

wooden posts should never be placed directly into concrete, but you should use a post
bracket as intermediary like the ones shown here:
Materials - Posts, Spikes and Supports: Post Bases and Brackets | RONA
concrete attracts moisture and wood in direct contact with it will accordingly rot a lot
faster. If you have a carport or if there is one in your neighbourhood, check them out
and you will see, that the wooden posts are separated from the concrete.

It is the same principle, why we do not store bananas on concrete floors when wintering
them bare root indoors, unless we cover the concrete first with plastic and then with
cardboard, before we lay down the banana stems.

Now to your crack "Before you giggle at a girl question like this...", let me assure you,
that 1/3rd to 1/2 of the guys here would have called that stuff 'cement' instead of
'concrete', as you did correctly, so kudos for that!

Good luck,
Olaf
PS: Don't be put off by the prices in that site. They are in CAD these things should be
a lot cheaper in USDs




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Old 04-05-2016, 08:07 PM   #10 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

By golly, you're right about the wood and concrete issue; I knew that once upon a time but forgot. (I know about Rona because I belong to a board of old ladies like me with members from Canada. Except we have one brave male member who supplies concrete statues and such to them.)

I'm old; this fence isn't meant to outlive me since it's just reusing some old stuff the prior owner put in place. Badly. I can take it to the dump, sell it cheap on CL or find a use here; I'm trying to do the latter.

Thanks for all of the advice thus far. I'll give this a lot of thought, present it to the "committee" but ultimately decide what I think is best. Being able at long last to make my own decisions--good, bad or neutral--is delightful.
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Old 04-17-2016, 09:18 AM   #11 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kat2 View Post
How the heck do you pull back and keep sand away to even pour concrete? Digging a hole for planting 1 gallon pot entails scraping away a 3' wide sliding mess and quick work to set it for me.
Have you tried wetting the sand before you dig the hole?

I've been digging up ugly landscaper oaks in the front yard (1st spring in a new house) and the sand around the original potted dirt tends to be a tiny bit damp and still clumps heavily. Its like making a sand castle, you need wet sand for it to keep any shape.
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Old 04-17-2016, 01:51 PM   #12 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Olafhenny View Post
Hi Kat,

wooden posts should never be placed directly into concrete, but you should use a post
bracket as intermediary like the ones shown here:
Materials - Posts, Spikes and Supports: Post Bases and Brackets | RONA
concrete attracts moisture and wood in direct contact with it will accordingly rot a lot
faster. If you have a carport or if there is one in your neighbourhood, check them out
and you will see, that the wooden posts are separated from the concrete.

It is the same principle, why we do not store bananas on concrete floors when wintering
them bare root indoors, unless we cover the concrete first with plastic and then with
cardboard, before we lay down the banana stems.

Now to your crack "Before you giggle at a girl question like this...", let me assure you,
that 1/3rd to 1/2 of the guys here would have called that stuff 'cement' instead of
'concrete', as you did correctly, so kudos for that!

Good luck,
Olaf
PS: Don't be put off by the prices in that site. They are in CAD these things should be
a lot cheaper in USDs




Using treated posts, as you should, will ensure they won't rot until your fence needs replacing anyway. (You could paint them before using if it makes you feel better.) And, the post brackets you showed are a nice idea, but will not hold up in much wind. They have no leverage to hold a 6 foot tall fence upright on a windy day or especially in a storm. (Plus, the base will hold moisture on the wood, also causing more rapid rotting of the wood.) If you want it to last, use a larger post, such as 4x6 or 6x6, and definitely use cement. For a fence I didn't want to repair, ever, I would use a whole bag of cement each and 4x6 pressure treated posts put in the ground at least 30 inches. Use 6x6 posts and you will be able to replace the fence panels once without replacing the posts. I have built lots of fence as well as replaced a lot of improperly built fence.
Hope it helps. Steve.
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Old 04-17-2016, 02:09 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Olafhenny View Post
Hi Kat,

wooden posts should never be placed directly into concrete, but you should use a post
bracket as intermediary like the ones shown here:
Materials - Posts, Spikes and Supports: Post Bases and Brackets | RONA
concrete attracts moisture and wood in direct contact with it will accordingly rot a lot
faster. If you have a carport or if there is one in your neighbourhood, check them out
and you will see, that the wooden posts are separated from the concrete.

It is the same principle, why we do not store bananas on concrete floors when wintering
them bare root indoors, unless we cover the concrete first with plastic and then with
cardboard, before we lay down the banana stems.

Now to your crack "Before you giggle at a girl question like this...", let me assure you,
that 1/3rd to 1/2 of the guys here would have called that stuff 'cement' instead of
'concrete', as you did correctly, so kudos for that!

Good luck,
Olaf
PS: Don't be put off by the prices in that site. They are in CAD these things should be
a lot cheaper in USDs





I would do that too.

Why don't you catch the armadillos instead? Some eat them... Cook it properly though...
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Old 04-17-2016, 11:53 PM   #14 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

Quote:
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I would do that too.

Why don't you catch the armadillos instead? Some eat them... Cook it properly though...
How Armadillos Can Spread Leprosy


Quote:
...the easiest way to avoid contagion is to simply avoid unnecessary contact with the critters. And, of course, they advise not to go hunting, skinning or eating them
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Old 04-18-2016, 05:30 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

I read there's no problem as long as you cook it properly. I'd wear gloves too!
Honestly, I wouldn't eat it. It doesn't fly! I like my birds!!!
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Old 07-13-2016, 07:53 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Default Re: Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

Putting wood in concrete will cause it to rot. The alkalies in the cement will attack the wood, even it's pressure treated. If you must, than coat it heavily with tar first. This is why you never put the sill of your house directly on a concrete pad without using a barrier like Sill Seal.
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Old 07-13-2016, 07:00 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Default Re: Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Olafhenny View Post

Materials - Posts, Spikes and Supports: Post Bases and Brackets | RONA


let me assure you,
that 1/3rd to 1/2 of the guys here would have called that stuff 'cement' instead of
'concrete', as you did correctly, so kudos for that!
I haven't see a Rona in a looooong time. How far east do they go? I know I've seen them in BC, but they're in other provinces too.

Here in the South, we call anything that you mix up and pour, cement, and it's pronounced SEE-ment.
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Old 07-13-2016, 07:46 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Default Re: Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snarkie View Post
I haven't see a Rona in a looooong time. How far east do they go? I know I've seen them in BC, but they're in other provinces too.

Here in the South, we call anything that you mix up and pour, cement, and it's pronounced SEE-ment.
Well, Rona started in Quebec so if it's in BC, it should be everywhere else...

OK so Rona is everywhere except Nunavut, PEI, Northwest territories and Yukon.
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Old 07-26-2016, 07:43 AM   #19 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

rona has been bought by lowes
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Old 07-26-2016, 08:36 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Default Re: Is setting fenceposts in concrete necessary in sandy soil?

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rona has been bought by lowes
Why does that not surprise me?
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