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Banana Plant Soil, Additives, and Fertilizer This forum is an area where you may discuss the soil to grow banana plants in, as well as soil additives such as teas, composts, manures, fertilizers and related topics.


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Old 05-12-2012, 08:35 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Default Re: Creating my own Fert

This might be of some help:

Guide to Micronutrients
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Old 06-07-2012, 02:33 PM   #22 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Creating my own Fert

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Mixing my own Fert is my newest idea.

After reading the forum, realizing that the best ratio of giving fert ist 4-1-6 NPK is I decided to create my own fert.

Another reason is, this way its cheaper than buying ready-fert, that has also not the perfect NPK-ratio for bananas.

The Fert I am feeding the bananas is 10-2,5-15, for creating this I use Ormin-k a organic-potas fert, with 30% K2O it has a ph of 5-7,

My second ingredient ist Urea (here its called Üre) has a N of 46 %.

My third ingredient is 18-46, it has 18%N and 46% 'Fosfor`.

So When I use two bags of Ormin-K I have 15 kg net K, when I use 5,4 kg 18-46 I have about 2,5 kg P,

Whats left is the N I need 10 kg, with the 18-46 I have already 972 gr, to complete the amount I have to add 9kg and 28gr,

I went out of Urea and bought amonyum sulfat today, in my next mix I will replace urea with amonyum sulfat,

amonyum sulfat has a content of 21% N, so I have to almost double the amount.

Richard, I heard amonyum sulfat has an acidic character drops the ph-value.

Do you recommend using amonyum sulfat?
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Old 06-08-2012, 02:09 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Default Re: Creating my own Fert

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I went out of Urea and bought amonyum sulfat today, in my next mix I will replace urea with amonyum sulfat,

amonyum sulfat has a content of 21% N, so I have to almost double the amount.

Richard, I heard amonyum sulfat has an acidic character drops the ph-value.

Do you recommend using amonyum sulfat?
It depends on what else is being used (and in what quantities) to provide P, K, Mg, Ca, Fe, Cu, Mn, Zn, B.
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Old 06-08-2012, 05:38 AM   #24 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Creating my own Fert

Have you considered Rock Dust for you minor and macro's? IDK if Azomite is available over there but you should be able to find something similar. Also I see Humic acid is mention but have you tried to use mycorrhizae as well? This will def help your plants and soil.
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Old 06-08-2012, 02:20 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Default Re: Creating my own Fert

Rock dust is not a viable source of micronutrients, but it is a very lucrative product for rock quarries that would otherwise have to pay to dispose of crusher dust.

Mycorrhizae are not beneficial to all plants; for example Brassicas. Further, some families of plants require special strains which are not commonly available; for example Rhododendrons, including Blueberries.

Azomite contains exceedingly high values of Aluminum Oxide, Silicon DiOxide, and Florine (Azomite Certificate Of Analysis). It is disingenuous for a knowledgeable farmer to apply this product to food crops.
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Old 06-09-2012, 01:03 PM   #26 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Creating my own Fert

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It depends on what else is being used (and in what quantities) to provide P, K, Mg, Ca, Fe, Cu, Mn, Zn, B.

I would like to use it with 18-46 and K20 (potasyum),the K2O contains about 25%Sulfur.

It would be a N-P-K Formula, would be 10-2,5-15.

The other micro-nutrients I give once a week according to your recommendations.

Greetings.
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Old 06-09-2012, 01:05 PM   #27 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Creating my own Fert

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Have you considered Rock Dust for you minor and macro's? IDK if Azomite is available over there but you should be able to find something similar. Also I see Humic acid is mention but have you tried to use mycorrhizae as well? This will def help your plants and soil.
Thanks,

today I used Mikoriza the first time, I used about 500 gr for 3 hectare, gave it through the sprinkler-system.

I am very curious about results, does it take a long time to take effect?

Any experiences with Mikoriza?

Greetings
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Old 06-09-2012, 01:20 PM   #28 (permalink)
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Default Re: Creating my own Fert

Go ahead and make a relatively small dry test mixture. Be sure to wear protective gloves and eye wear in case some reaction occurs.

After mixing well, add 1 level teaspoon to 1 gallon of clean water; or about 15.6 cc to 4 liters. Be careful of fumes. Mix, let sit for several hours, and mix again. Check the pH.

The desired pH range is 6 to 6.5. If it is between 5 and 6, then adding small amounts of Calcium Carbonate will raise the pH without significantly altering the nutrient properties.

If the pH is below 5 or above 7 (doubtful) then you'll need to rethink your mixture.

Mycorrhizae (Mikoriza) are fungal spores. They must come in contact with roots within a few hours of mix with water or soils. Application above ground by water or cultivator is not effective. Application to bare roots is the best method.
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Old 06-09-2012, 01:32 PM   #29 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Creating my own Fert

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Go ahead and make a relatively small dry test mixture. Be sure to wear protective gloves and eye wear in case some reaction occurs.

After mixing well, add 1 level teaspoon to 1 gallon of clean water; or about 15.6 cc to 4 liters. Be careful of fumes. Mix, let sit for several hours, and mix again. Check the pH.

The desired pH range is 6 to 6.5. If it is between 5 and 6, then adding small amounts of Calcium Carbonate will raise the pH without significantly altering the nutrient properties.

If the pH is below 5 or above 7 (doubtful) then you'll need to rethink your mixture.

Mycorrhizae (Mikoriza) are fungal spores. They must come in contact with roots within a few hours of mix with water or soils. Application above ground by water or cultivator is not effective. Application to bare roots is the best method.
Thank you Richard, I will use your method and check the ph-level,

about the Mikoriza-app, I am using mini-sprinklers that cover all the ground, there are many of them.

The roots are very close to the surface, I watered a lot and I suppose the application directly got to the roots. None of the watering-water gets lost.

Greetings
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Old 06-09-2012, 03:49 PM   #30 (permalink)
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Default Re: Creating my own Fert

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Thank you Richard, I will use your method and check the ph-level,

about the Mikoriza-app, I am using mini-sprinklers that cover all the ground, there are many of them.

The roots are very close to the surface, I watered a lot and I suppose the application directly got to the roots. None of the watering-water gets lost.

Greetings
That method does not work, regardless of what the advertisers will claim. The manufacturer of the powdered Mycorrhizae product I sell has run field tests and advises customers that application by soil drench is a waste of product. Mycorrhizae is not a fertilizer. It is a symbiotic organism that has to come in direct contact with the roots of host plants in order to survive.
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Old 06-09-2012, 04:09 PM   #31 (permalink)
 
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That method does not work, regardless of what the advertisers will claim. The manufacturer of the powdered Mycorrhizae product I sell has run field tests and advises customers that application by soil drench is a waste of product. Mycorrhizae is not a fertilizer. It is a symbiotic organism that has to come in direct contact with the roots of host plants in order to survive.

So the best method would be to put the plant into a bucket with mikoriza and then plant it into the soil?

I just can hope these tests are not valid for me, otherwise I wasted 500 g of Mikoriza, my hope is that I have many roots on the surface, just 1 cm under soil.

Yes you are right, the manufacturer of the powdered product says it is usable via sprinkler-system, as you said when it is not working they are lying.

So the Mikoriza dies before it gets to the roots, on the soil? Can it not get through it?

Another question would be , how long can Mikoriza live on a root, what happens after one year when there is new plant born from the old one, is Mikoriza spreading?
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Old 06-09-2012, 11:10 PM   #32 (permalink)
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Default Re: Creating my own Fert

What is sold are spores. To germinate they need to be in contact with the root of a compatible plant type and in favorable soil conditions. Once they propagate, they will grow a colony.

I apply the powder to bare roots prior to planting. You only need a sprinkle -- not a coating. For example when I was potting up bareroot fruit trees this winter, I used 1 tablespoon (15 mL) of powder to cover 10 root balls at a time. I treated 150 root balls with about 1/2 lb (225 grams).
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Old 06-10-2012, 10:22 AM   #33 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Creating my own Fert

if you want to fertilize proper, and grow organically, try growing in the High Brix method (lots of info on google)

this is what I do ...

when planting out, use a decent compost ... visit your nearest hydroponic store, or buy online ... I use plagron bat mix ...

quote from the internet:

If you are looking for a top quality soil to cultivate your plants with, look no further. Plagron Bat Mix is the finest highly fertilised soil that contains a generous amount of Bat Guano.

Plagron Bat Mix is a blend of the finest, carefully selected types of peat that contains various types of fibre and perlite which results in a light and airy mix. The abundant presence of unique Plagron worm compost ensures vigorous plant growth and increased water retention.

Plagron Bat Mix contains slow release nutrients that are released as and when the plant needs them and the main nutrient in Bat Mix is Bat Guano, which is naturally rich in phosphorus and potassium, making it the perfect formula for plants that bear flowers or fruits.


add a handful of volcanic rock dust (which supplies over 70 micronutrients), a bit extra worm humis (the best compost that you can ever use) , and I use rootgrow on the roots (Mycorrhizal Fungi)

after 2 weeks, start fertilizing .... I use advanced nutrients iguana juice grow, aswell as advanced biobizz fish mix ...

I use these as a soil drench and as a foliar feed ... I dont mix the 2, but apply one time with one, and the next watering with the other .... they dilute at 4ml per litre of water, so 1 litre of product makes 200 litres of organic fertilizer

The iguana juice grow has an NPK of 3-1-3 and the biobizz fish mix has an NPK of 6-3-4

I apply bat guano fertilizer (a tablespoon sprinkled around the base once in a while) ... I buy a 5kg bucket for under £20, and the one that I buy has an npk of 3-15-4 ... there are other types of bat guano with different NPK's

I brew my own actively aerated compost tea ... I use a 5 gallon bucket, rainwater, a strong aquarium airpump and an aquarium heater

I add worm humis, forest topsoil, home made compost, volcanic rock dust, seaweed extract and bat guano .... I then apply this with a watering can to all my plants and shrubs ...

I grow normal garden plants that grow twice in size to the same ones which are fertilized with synthetic fertilizers such as miracle grow etc

this year is the 1st time that I have planted musa basjoo, but it will be interesting to see the outcome with my fertilizing methods

watch this video:

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Old 06-10-2012, 11:10 AM   #34 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Creating my own Fert

Are you the guy in the video?
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Old 06-10-2012, 11:56 AM   #35 (permalink)
 
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Are you the guy in the video?


LOL .... no, but I can be anything or anyone you want me to ....

take my advice and research further ... I'm not selling anything ... am just giving good advice
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Old 06-10-2012, 12:17 PM   #36 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Creating my own Fert

here's a quick summary of high brix methods as taken off the internet:

There are four bases to achieving high brix soil:

1.)Foundational minerals. These are your rock powders, Limestone, Soft Rock Phosphate, Gypsum. Other things could conceivably be used as well, but those are cheap, reliable and available. The single most important mineral for High Brix is Calcium, followed by Phosphorus.

2.)Soil Energy. ERGS (Energy Released per Gram per Second). No energy in the soil, no growth of the plant. Fertilizers, organic material, salts....all increase ERGS.

3.)Soil Biology. These are the microbes, nematodes and fungi that inhabit the root zone and break down all the organic material and present it to the plant. We accomplish proper soil biology with humus and we boost it with microbial teas and root inoculates.

4.)Trace Elements. The "micro's." Magnesium, zinc, boron, iron, manganese, copper, molybdenum, sulfur, etc.

We don't put these things in the soil in the typical NPK ratio's that you see on plant food bottles. These things go into the soil in order to make the soil biology happy. For example, most of the phosphorus isn't available to the plant at all. Same with the calcium. But the microbes love it.

The plants, courtesy of the soil life, get anything they want, as much as they want. They never burn, they never lack.

That's the soil.

You supercharge the Brix in the plant tissue via Foliar Feeding. Phosphorus is the "shipping specialist" in the plant. Most things the plant needs come piggy backed as a phosphate, so increasing the phosphorus and calcium levels in the plant increases the sugar content in the leaves, which the plant sends down to the roots in the form of "root exudates." These root exudates feed and signal microbes and fungi that live on the roots, and they take the sugar and use it to form humic/fulvic acids so they can digest minerals and organic matter and feed the plant.

The foliar sprays act like a supercharger, while the soil acts like a gas tank. The microbes are the engine.....and the plants are the passengers who enjoy the ride.

That's High Brix.


--------------------------------------------

very important ... understand that, and you are on the road to success
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Old 06-10-2012, 06:20 PM   #37 (permalink)
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if you want to fertilize proper, and grow organically, try growing in the High Brix method (lots of info on google)
I'm outta here.
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Old 06-10-2012, 06:41 PM   #38 (permalink)
 
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I'm outta here.
I would be happy if you stay,

this thread is stil about fertilizer that is not organics, and your opinion is really leading the way here, you have a lot of experience in fertilizers and plants.

I learned a lot from you about fert. and its really great to have someone that can give good advise.

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Old 06-11-2012, 12:52 AM   #39 (permalink)
 
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I'm outta here.
it's hard to teach old dogs new tricks
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Old 06-11-2012, 05:20 AM   #40 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Creating my own Fert

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Rock dust is not a viable source of micronutrients, but it is a very lucrative product for rock quarries that would otherwise have to pay to dispose of crusher dust. .
rockdust contains over 70 different minerals and trace elements...:

SEER Rockdust
--------------------------------------------------------------------

Quote:
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Mycorrhizae are not beneficial to all plants; for example Brassicas. Further, some families of plants require special strains which are not commonly available; for example Rhododendrons, including Blueberries. .
FAQs

snip:

There are a number of other plant groups that we do not recommend using rootgrow on. If you do use rootgrow on these plants it will not harm then in any way, the fungi just will not colonise and break down in the soil. These plants are

Edible Brassica’s (Cabbage, Cauliflower, Broccoli, Turnip, Radishes and Brussel Sprouts) all have a natural anti-fungal compound present in their roots. This is a disease resistance mechanism that unfortunately prevents mycorrhizal fungi colonisation. It also offers no protection against the Brasica’s worst disease Club Root which is no longer considered part of the fungal kingdom, it is now considered a slime mould (Plasmodiophorids)

Another group of plants which we do not recommend you use rootgrow on is fast growing salad crops such as ‘cut and come again’ lettuce and salad leaves and spinach. Due to rootgrow taking 2-4 weeks to colonise plants these salad leave can germinate and be harvested in 4 weeks so the plant does not really have time to derive any benefit from the treatment.


for Rhododendrons use Ericoid mycorrhizal fungi ...

here is a list of some products giving the counts:
http://www.treebuzz.com/forum/images...Comparison.pdf


--------------------------------------------------------------------

There are several powdered forms of mycorrhizal fungi aswell as liquid forms ... old teachings said that the powdered form only workes if it was used at the time of planting and dusted on the roots of the plant

then, there was the method of 'injecting' it into the soil of established plants/trees so as to try and get it to make contact with the roots

another method is where you plant a host plant at the base of the target plant, and use rootgrow etc with that ... eventually, the fungi will target the roots of the target plant

however, there are newer liquid products on the market such as advanced nutrients voodoo juice:
FAQ on Voodoo Juice

advanced nutrients Piranha:
Piranha Beneficial Fungi | Piranha Beneficial Fungi Nutrint |Hydroponic Nutrient Piranha Beneficial Fungi

advanced nutrients Tarantula
Tarantula Beneficial Bacteria | Tarantula hydroponics Nutrients | Tarantula by Advanced Nutrients | Tarantula Nutrients

these products are diluted with water (preferably unchlorinated water) and used as a soil drench ... the fungi/bacteria seep into the soil and make contact with the roots

I emailed rootgrow to ask them if their product can be used in actively aerated compost tea ... I received a reply saying yes, however, it is added to the compost tea at the end of the brewing and just prior to applying it to the plants

I have tested this method on 2 alocasia Mayan Mask plants recently which were planted in 3 litre airpots ... I had amazing results

something else which I have learned, is that one should not use rootgrow (mycorrhizal fungi ) in combination with bone meal

another product which is exceptional, and which is said by many to be the very best is Roots Excelurator:
Products - Stimulators - Roots Excelurator : Premium Quality Dutch Plant Nutrients & Stimulants - House & Garden

I have not tried this (yet), but some people claim that the roots even grow out of the top of the pots when this is used

here is a link to different mycorrhizal fungi that were tested on musa (also using volcanic rock dust in the growing medium)
http://www.musalit.org/pdf/IN120019_en.pdf

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