hardboiled (deleted account)

Was just looking up some info before planting some seeds and found this piece of info that says seeds should NOT be soaked before planting.

Should I Soak a Banana Tree Plant Before Planting? | eHow.com

is this right or wrong? surely in the wilds they don't get soaked for 5 days naturally so why do we do it ?

I'm tempted to try planting 20 seeds (Enste(sp?)) 10 soaked and 10 unsoaked. I've had zero success so far in all banana planting attempts so far, but that may be due to the people I've brought from. This latest batch has come from recommendations on here.

Jananas Bananas

That link is talking about planting a banana sucker, not seeds.

Soaking the seeds kind of slaps them out of dormancy, and that is why we do it. Here is another eHow link referring to seeds (in general) that explains it better than I can:

Is it a Good Idea to Soak Seeds Before Planting? | eHow.com

One of our experts here just recently mentioned his way to seed success, which is nicking the hard coat of the seed (just until you see white) and soaking for two days in a Superthrive mixture then planting. He said if the seeds are viable they will sprout quickly with this method. I will be trying this with my next batch!

~JaNan

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Jananas Bananas

hardboiled (deleted account)

Whoops sorry. but what you said makes perfect sense.
I've tried for so long it's not true and got nothing following lots of advise.
This latest batch has been soak for 4 days which should be enough.
I'll try nicking around the eye of the seed in hope that this method works.

I'm absolutely determined to get this right.

Jananas Bananas

I don't think I would do it by the eye, that might damage the embryo. Just make the scratch around the belly. Don't give up on your seeds though. Some folks here have reported banana seeds taking up to two YEARS to sprout!

~J

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Jananas Bananas

hardboiled (deleted account)

Hey just found this... you're right about cutting

How to Grow Banana Plants From Seed | eHow.co.uk

hardboiled (deleted account)

2 years!!!! I gave up on ever batch after 3 months

natej740

Hang in there it took me 6 months to sprout Musa Velutina.

varig8

Here is an example of some germinating information I found while searching online recently about different Musa species. (Personally I think it is BS, but who knows?) You will find all sorts of opinions as to soak, or not to soak, to scarify, or not to scarify, to plant in this medium, or in that, it goes on and on. This says viable seed will float? Well, I cant ever really remember if I have actually done this with Musa seed, because I always scarify them first before soaking, and if when I break through the hull it is empty and dusty, then Id say theres a pretty good chance that this seed would have floated, and its not viable. Other than that I didnt use a heat mat or anything else special, just potted them up in a regular soil mix (I always use lots of perlite in whatever mix I use to provide good drainage). As long as the seed was viable, they've sprouted within a few weeks time. Seed that I have personally removed from fruit and planted seems to germinate within a few weeks time without soaking or scarifying-Ive also found seedlings germinating in the ground under Ornata mats that had just dropped by themselves. I figure it this way; Most hard shelled seed found in natural habitats is eaten and then passed through the digestive tracks of either birds or animals. The acid in their stomachs serves to somewhat break down the external husk of the seed. Its then dropped in the feces, which acts as a germinating material and fertilizer. So what we are doing by scarifying is hydrating the embryo to quicken this natural process. Ive read that you can also use a chlorox solution, but Ive never done this. You will notice that the following information says that Musa seed is viable for YEARS, and NOT to scarify them.......so maybe this growers feeling is to 'do it naturally'? The best way when in doubt is to attempt all the reasonable methods and see which works for you. Why not try to plant some as they are, and some soaked and scarified and see if there is any difference for yourself? If the scarified and soaked seed germinate within a few weeks and the others do not, you can always remove them and soak and cut!!
Just make sure that you do not disturb the 'belly button' on the seed-this is where the roots will emerge around the outer ring and the plantlet will emerge from the center of the ring. Just barely file through the outer hull until you can see the white meat inside. A metal fingernail file works just fine. Again, you will find out if your seed is any good once you file through the hull and see if it is empty or not.

Musa Seed Germinating Directions

Seeds that are dormant means that the oil / liquid chamber has dried up and they will float in water. The seeds remain viable for years. There are several methods for germination: First to soak the seeds 48 hours and let them absorb some moisture. Then the seeds should be sown into proper planting media which is then kept moist, but not water logged. Keep the media in light, warm place.

Another method is to put them into plastic (zip) bags with media / vermiculite or folded in a coffee filter. Again one should provide warm temperatures, light and moisture (not too damp).

Note: Do NOT scarify (break / scrape) the seed coat.

Media: A mix of perlite, vermiculite should work. For seeds like this I like to use 2 parts peat, 1 part perlite and 1 part vermiculite. Any well drained, sterile growing media should work. I usually add some mycorrhiza to my seed mixes - since these can take so long to germinate I may make a second application after 3 months or so. The pH tolerance seems to be good.

The germination is very irregular. It might take from one week up to two years for all the seeds to come up. Many of these seeds have been started in this way with good results.

hardboiled (deleted account)

Wow I feel like I'm back at college. This is science in the making....lol

varig8... I'm going to try everything and see what gives.
I've got some Ensete seeds and outer husks are as hard as hell ( they all sank in the floating experiment ).

I've just tried scarring a batch of 10 now going to plant 5 without soaking. Something has to work!

I'll do anything get a one these damn things to grow.

planetrj

just saw this thread.

If you want to try to speed up the process just use giberellic acid. I've used it to get Velutina and Violacea to germ in under 2 months. It also helps with rooting in the early stages.

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you will never have enough bananas ^_^

jmoore

Ok there is a lot of discussioin on this site about germinating seeds and there has been ever since this site was founded. Some of the early threads are the most informative.

The gibberillic acid route has been discussed, I've found it makes no difference and everything I've read seems to point to inhibiting germination of musa seeds.

Scarifying has also been discussed and again I've found it makes no difference other than to allow fungus to take hold of your precious seeds.

I've also read about soaking them in a mild acid to simulate transit through a digestive tracht. Seems to make no difference.

I've read about soaking and the length of time of soaking, it doesn't seem to make much difference.

I've read about soaking them in nitrozyme and now superthrive (same thing from what I understand)

This is my take on things:
Seeds are only viable for a long time if they are dried quickly after they are harvested, they need to be dried to about 5 or 10% moisture content, that goes for all seeds and not just banana seeds, if not they rot. The seeds also need to be from ripe fruit to be viable. You have to remember these seeds are collected by the thousand from unripe fruits and are treated badly. They certainly are not dried quickly which reduces their viability substantially and they probably are not ripe.

Musa seeds also have a natural dormancy, this prevents them all from germinating at once. Ensete seeds can lay dormant for up to 25 years and then suddenly pop up.

So if you buy a hundred seeds, even if they say they are fresh, you can assume that most of them are not viable because they are not ripe or have rotted due to poor storing. Then you have the natural dormancy to overcome which can take up to 2 years. So you are talking about a very small germination rate. In the wild only about 5% of seeds germinate. I've had about 10 or 20% germination.

You can try all the methods mentioned above, I've come up with a method that works for me after reading the threads and trial and error, but bare in mind what I've said here. Not every seed you buy will germinate, they may take a very long time and you have to be lucky. Patience is the key to the game.

Good luck

hardboiled (deleted account)

Yep, it's called sharing information because it generates ideas and saves time and money.
I've seen more information on scaring than anything else, it sounds legit, so I'll give it a ago while I'll I've got plenty of spare seeds.

nannerfunboi

im grateful to all posts.. this is my 1st time trying to germinate
banana seeds.. i think i got from good source..im sure this will test my
patience.. im in no hurry..
im trying 2 ways .. soakin both times.. using superthrive in soak..
1 i scared the seeds..other not.. 1 i have in paper(wet) in a plastic
bag.. the other is potted up..
temperature i have at same.. i think i need to buy more seed..and try
days with warm and cool ...
again..thanks to all..
back at my science projects..

hardboiled (deleted account)

I'm glad you're not in hurry
It's all good fun

I'm also trying germination experiments on giant Bamboo where I've had slightly more success from not following instruction given. Maybe that's the trick, don't follow instructions

hardboiled (deleted account)

and just ordered some ga3 to see if that works.