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STEELVIPER
10-11-2006, 06:17 PM
Hello all. Anybody grow gingers? Has anyone grown Nicolaia elatior < Red Torch Ginger> If so how has your plants done? Flower? i have 7 seedlings growing at the moment. All about 3 inches tall. Any tips or info would be
appreciated.

thanks

Steelviper<mark>

MediaHound
10-11-2006, 06:38 PM
I'm growing Tapeinochilus ananassae (Indonesian Wax Ginger), Costus woodsonii (Red Button) (not a true ginger anymore), and another that I need a positive ID on.

Steve L has over 50 ginger varieties at his place. I'd say he's one of the resident ginger experts.

Steve L
10-11-2006, 08:16 PM
Steelviper,

The name of red torch ginger has changed from Nicolaia Eliator to Etlingera Eliator and I am trying to container grow this ginger. I am close friends with the owners of Stokes Tropicals in New Iberia, LA, the home of Tabasco. It is near Lake Charles where I live. They used to sell this ginger but stopped. They had a pot or two left over and since I visit them several times a year (you can pick up large plants that can't be shipped), they offered me a small piece. I have been told by several people that it might bloom in a 15 gal. container so I am going to try it. It will probably take a couple of years to get it to bloom size if it makes it since I've been told it's extremely cold sensitive but I'm growing Alpinia Purpurata and blooming it in a pot so I'm going to try. I know Alpinia Purpurata won't make it in your area without protection (croaks below 50 F) so you will have to protect the torch ginger since it's at least as cold sensitive as the AP, maybe more. Keep me posted.

Steve

STEELVIPER
10-11-2006, 08:39 PM
Steve L

Yeah im going to trasplant the seedings i have here in a week or two. I will be putting these guys in a very large pot in the spring. <if they make it> I have 7 3 inch seedlings that are growing very fast. Ill be keeping these babies inside at night. Ive heard about there cold sensitivity. Will keep you up to date.thanks for your info

Steelviper<mark>

Steve L
10-11-2006, 08:45 PM
Good luck. As with all tropicals kept indoors you need to supply them with humidity so mist them regularly or put them on a tray of gravel with water in the tray but not touching the botton of the pot. Keep an eye out for the mites also.

Steve

STEELVIPER
10-20-2006, 06:43 PM
Hey steve L how are things going? I got a question about about shell gingers.<ALPINIA ZERUMBET> I know these guys like shade. But is it true that they do need some sun to bloom? I have been told both yes and no. I have a 6 month old plant. She is doing real well, and gets about 70/30 shade to sun. Sorry to bother with the questions. thanks

mark<steelviper>:2715:

Taylor
10-20-2006, 07:09 PM
I have seeds from Alpinia Zerumbet from Bananaswap. but no luck as of now. What should I expect of germination time and what conditions should the seeds be in to be able to sprout????

Thanks!!

jnstropic
10-20-2006, 08:16 PM
I have never seen the red torch ginger bloom in south Florida. Some people have tried it and it did grow. Now with warmer winter weather it may be the time to try to flower this heat lover.

Tapeinochilus ananassae is a better ginger to grow. It is not a spectacular as the torch but it blooms in in zone 9, and it is easy to get. If you googleTapeinochilus ananassae you might find two different plants with the same name. I have both of them and the one that flowers at the top of the growth is Costus barbatus.

Another plant that you might try is Alpinia purpurata (Red ginger). Twenty years ago it would grow in south Florida but the cold winters kept it from flowering. Now it is a very popular flowering landscape plant in red, pink or white.

Steve L
10-23-2006, 07:37 AM
Steelviper,

I tried to post over the weekend but I couldn't log on. I have my Alpinia Zerumbet in almost full sun and in south Louisiana, full sun is tough. The leaves will fold up during the hottest part of the day but generally do not burn. Unfortunately, the location is not ideal during the winter as they get frosted frequently. Since they only bloom on old growth; I only get blooms following a mild winter like this past one. They will eat up your yard and I have to dig up huge clumps every other year to reclaim my yard. The variegated form needs more shade.

Steve

STEELVIPER
11-08-2006, 02:44 PM
My friend just got some Zingiber spectabile <SHAMPOO GINGER> seeds. He gave me about a dozen. Im going to give it a shot,and try to germinate them. Any advice on the best way to get them to germinate?:skateboardnana:

Steve L
11-08-2006, 03:22 PM
Mark,

Sorry, but I've never tried to germinate that ginger or any ginger from seed. I'm afraid I'm much to impatient. When I decide I want a plant, I look for the biggest one I can find at nurseries or over the internet. I want blooms fast. If your seeds don't germinate for you, look me up in the spring, I have that ginger and could probably dig you a few rhizomes. It's getting ready to go dormant now. If fact, in the spring, if you want to try some ginger, I will send you a list of what I have excess of and maybe we can arrange a swap.

Steve

STEELVIPER
11-08-2006, 03:52 PM
Excellent! Im like you Steve L. I go for the best plant i can get.Sometimes i want a challenge, so ill buy or acquire seeds to germinate. So i'll give the shampoo ginger seeds a shot. I figure ill use a heating pad and a gro-lux bulb to start. I'll post any pics, if they germinate for me. That would be great if you can send me a list of what you have and what you will sell or trade for next spring/summer. I'll keep that in mind over the winter.How well does this type of ginger do for you? thanks again steve L for you help and info.

Steve L
11-08-2006, 04:15 PM
I'm sure there are a lot of people who will think I'm crazy for saying this but I'm lucky to live in Louisiana, especially so near the Gulf Coast. I know what most of the rest of the country thinks of us but I would not want to live anywhere else for a lot of reasons, gardening, food and waterfowl hunting are at the top of my list. With that being said, our climate is very successful for most gingers. The only gingers that we can't grow in the ground are the true tropical Zone 10 varieties. I have a friend in Los Angeles that has tried to grow Curcumas to absolutely no success. I think it's because of the low humidity. I have a dozen or so and they do great here as do all Hedychiums, lots of Alpinias, some Costus, Globbas, Kaempferias, and Zingibers.

Steve

STEELVIPER
11-08-2006, 07:52 PM
When you got it good, you got it good. Seems to me Steve you got it real good. LOL. I can say that you can grow most Gingers or Heliconias out here in Riverside, Ca. But!!! from my experience they have to be grown in large pots.Are soil is just no good for Tropicals of these types. Its true are air out here is dry,but i combat that with frequent dousing of the leaves<when the humdity is below 30%>I move the pots to a wind protected are of my yard when the Santa Ana winds blow.I have noticed that are summers are becoming more and more humid.I remove the bottoms of the pots for better drainage, and in the winter i have a large insulated shed that i put my plants in when the temps dip below 45Fdegrees.So far so good for me.Its alot of work,but when you see the blooms of these plants, its so worth it.:giveflowersnana:

Steve L
11-09-2006, 08:23 AM
Hey, I'm a container grower as well. Most of my heliconia are grown in containers and a few tender gingers as well. Our soil is perfect, rich and on the acid side. The problem is a few weeks during the late weeks of Dec., Jan. and Feb when we can, and often do, get a Canadian blast of cold air. Those fronts kill the old growth on the heliconias. Most times, the plants grow back from the roots starting in the spring but since most heliconia bloom on old (second year) growth, the blooms are lost. So into the greenhouse they go for the winter to be fair game for spider mites and mealy bugs. It can get frustrating. But also often during the winter are numerous days when the night time temps are in the 50's and our days are in the low
70's so out the containers go to soak up some nice fresh air. I still have Rostrata, Golden Torch, Hirsuta, and Latispatha Distans blooming. Red Angusta is just starting to show blooms and I have two pots of Alpinia Purpurata in bloom. This has been an especially good year for my tropicals. We had a mild winter last year and everything got off to a quick start in the spring.

Steve

bigdog
11-09-2006, 10:50 PM
Hey Steve, you being a Louisiana guy and all...and into gingers...any idea as to what happened to Tim Chapman (Gingerwood Nursery)? It's one of the most bizzare stories. A well-respected plantsman and nurseryman, up and disappears for no apparent reason.

Steve L
11-10-2006, 08:50 AM
Hi Bigdog,

I have asked everyone I know what happened to Tim. I did talk to a good friend of his from Lafayette, LA and he told me he has lost contact with him as well but thought something happened to his parents and maybe he moved out west. It's a real shame. I bought a lot of gingers and ornamental bananas from Tim and he was always right on about their growing preferences and hardiness. He really knew his stuff.

Steve

STEELVIPER
11-20-2006, 05:22 PM
Hey Steve! i got a question. Have you or do you overwinter any of your ginger Rhizomes?Can Zingiber rhizome's be overwintered out of the ground. Say in a box or bag stored in a cool place? Or something to that matter?

mark

Steve L
11-21-2006, 08:37 AM
Mark,

I don't dig up any of my ginger rhizomes in the winter. They stay in the ground or in a pot if they are not Zone 9 hardy in the ground. Which Zingiber are you asking about? I am currently growing 6 Zingibers: Citriadora "Chaing Mai Princess", Jewel Pagoda, Collinsii "Silver Streaks", Corallinum, Spectabile, and Midnight. Midnight is in a pot and gets protected from the cold. The other 5 go dormant and reappear in the spring and bloom reliably for me in the summer.

Steve

STEELVIPER
11-21-2006, 12:24 PM
Steve,

I bought a "Jewel Pagoda" rhizome from a man who grows tropicals. He lives down the street from me and is moving. He had a yard sale and was selling some of his plants.Paid 10 dollars for a huge rhizome. I was wondering if i should go ahead and plant it, or store it away as is till spring? I never got around to asking the guy. He is gone now.

Steve L
11-21-2006, 02:25 PM
Jewel Pagoda is pretty hardy. Stokes lists it as Zone 8 and higher. It is a real good looking bloom. I don't know what your winters are like but if they are extremely wet, planting it in the ground might not be the ideal thing to do. I would store it in a paper bag inside in a closet until spring. You will really like this ginger. I think I posted a picture of mine in my gallery from this year. Good luck.

Steve

STEELVIPER
11-21-2006, 02:37 PM
Hey steve,

yeah i looked up this ginger on the web<google> and the blooms are incredible! The guy who sold me this ginger said i would be amazed. The weather here has been very warm<high 80's>. Are winters can be very dry. So far this fall it has been dry.But it can rain up to 20 inches in a year here.That is alot of rain for us. Never know what we are going to get. But the avg. rainfall for us here is about 11 inches of rain a year. I may just plant it in a large pot.But i do like the idea of storing it.What would you recommend for a soil mix? will it need some sun to bloom? Thanks again for your knowledge.

mark

Steve L
11-21-2006, 03:04 PM
Mark,

For my potted tropicals, I have been using Miracle Gro potting mix for years and have had good success. It drains very well.

Mine is planted in partial shade and has bloomed every summer since planting. It probably would be larger if it got a little more sun but it's done well where it is. I might dig up a small rhizome is the spring and try it in another location because I like it so much.

Steve

STEELVIPER
11-21-2006, 08:31 PM
Thanks again for the info Steve. Going to pot the ginger for the winter. Ill be keeping an eye on it over the winter. Make sure it does not rot. So many gingers not enough land!! LOL

simon_c
11-22-2006, 12:25 AM
I'm growing the pink colored torch ginger and its flowering.
Ocassionally we do cut the edible flowers to eat. Its used extensively in South East Asian cooking.

-Simon

Steve L
11-22-2006, 08:12 AM
Mark,

Don't overwater. Give it a good drink after you pot it up and then wait for some sign of growth. Put the pot on concrete where the sun will heat it up. The warmth from the concrete should help stimulate new growth. At this point, you could probably put it in full sun until you see new shoots.

simon c,

I'll be fortunate to get my red torch to bloom since I have to grow it in a container in my zone and it's reputed to be difficult to bloom in a pot. I'm giving it a try.

Steve

STEELVIPER
11-22-2006, 05:46 PM
Will do steve. Thanks again. Hope all my questions do not bug you.

mark:2738:

simon_c
12-05-2006, 07:48 PM
Here are some pictures of the pink torch ginger I am growing.

http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=1751&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=1751)
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=1749&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=1749)
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=1748&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=1748)

Steve L
12-07-2006, 08:49 AM
Very nice Simon c. Maybe one day mine will bloom.

Steve

Lilith
12-13-2006, 08:25 AM
I currently am growing 2 Etlingeras. I used to have 4 different ones but I took 2 of them out of the greenhouse because they are such space hogs. I have bloomed all 4 types of mine: Pink, Red, Yamamoto and Hieroglyphica.
It is VERY HARD to bloom the pink and red in containers. I won't say its IMPOSSIBLE, but these plants are not a small growing species. My greenhouse has a 20 ft ceiling, and in the ground, the pink torch (which seems more robust than the red) grew stalks that were in excess of 20 feet. Some were more on the scale of 25-26 feet. The blooms are basilar and held on stalks that can be between 3-5 ft tall. The blooms on the pink and red are the size of softballs.
These gingers are cold sensitive. I know of one person in South FL that has bloomed Red Torch in 10A but he described it as difficult. It will bloom better and more reliably outdoors in 10B.
Its my own opinion that unless you have a VERY LARGE CONTAINER that will allow the plant to reach a critical mass (the stalks on these plants when blooming size can have a diameter in excess of 10 inches) you may grow a very nice ginger plant but get no blooms. By big container I mean 30+ gallons, with overwintering practises that keep the plant above 40F.
I'd post a photo of some of my blooms, but I can't seem to figure out the photo posting function on this forum

Lilith
12-13-2006, 08:27 AM
One other note: Simon's plant looks like a variety of Etlingera called a "tulip torch". Yamamoto is a tulip torch. These have smaller stalks and much smaller blooms than the regular Pink and Red torch and are a lot harder to find starts of in the US

estan
01-11-2007, 06:28 PM
I've been interested in the torch gingers too. A year ago in Honduras I got to see lots of them - the pink right outside my dorm and the red across the Lancetilla botanical garden mixed in with heliconias and Musa coccinea on a steep bank. The pink was never as tall as Lilith's - more like 10'-12' but the red was bigger. New leaves on the red were flushed red purple. I also saw the red in two enclosed courtyards in Copan where they did grow to 20' . I swear the one flower last year was as big as my head. I would gather bouquets of these and theheliconias from the trash piles in the gardenafter the clearing crews made their rounds. Musa balbisiana constituted much of the offending undergrowth they cut down. "Slaughter of the Innocents" to me. but when I opened the first fruit with 200 seeds I understood why they are trying to control it. I have 6 seedlings in the house and am ready to plant the rest of my seeds (36). Can you soak seeds too long? I recently read "at least two days"

I've bought the ginger plants and never got them through the winter in the house. I now have two little pink seedlings 3" on heating pad, under lights in a south window. In my cool (50 deg.) greenhouse I have pots of A. zerumbet and the variegated form which also makes a good house plant here.
also several other gingers. Is there a dwarf variegated zerumbet? Liner farm offered it some time ago. I have bought a few small plants Walmart Lowe's but expect they will grow larger.

I remember Red torch blooming at Selby in Sarasota but it was in a greenhouse.

One other question: What is the Ace of Hearts? Is it the red thai banana? and is Agri-Starts already propagating it?

simon_c
01-12-2007, 03:33 AM
Hi guys,

Found this site selling all types of tropical gingers. Has lots of pictures too.
http://www.alohatropicals.com/Gingers.html

island cassie
02-27-2007, 10:59 PM
I planted etlingera eliator in the ground in September as a small plant with 1 leaf. Now it is 15ft tall with 16+ leaves and what I hope are flowering shoots. It is in light semi-shade with high humidity. As soon as it flowers I will post pictures.

http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=2105&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=2105&ppuser=628)

On the right hand side, this is how it looked in late December at 8 ft tall while it was still under the shade netting - it is much bigger now.

The red thing hanging in the background is a hummingbird feeder.

Cassie

Lilith
02-28-2007, 08:09 AM
These are mine, #1 is tulip torch E. "Heiroglyphica":http://www.photobucket.com/albums/v466/Bihai/DSCN3901.jpg

Lilith
02-28-2007, 08:15 AM
Red Torchhttp://www.photobucket.com/albums/v466/Bihai/eBayRedTorch.jpg

Lilith
02-28-2007, 08:16 AM
Pink Torchhttp://www.photobucket.com/albums/v466/Bihai/PinkTorchmulti.jpg

island cassie
02-28-2007, 08:17 AM
Beautiful pictures - these certainly are gorgeous plants. I can't wait for mine to flower.

jnstropic
02-28-2007, 08:21 AM
Fantastic! It's hard to believe that it is finally blooming in Florida. Congratulations. It must be the warming and a good grower.