Musa basjoo zone 4a

Montgg · 11-16-2013, 08:03 PM

Hello i was wondering if its possible. we get lows of -30 celcius or even -40 on rare occasions. we also get tons of snow........ Just spent 2 hours shoveling 2 feet of snow. i already brought my 6 foot musa basjoo in for the winter.. but i was wondering if i plant it soon enough in spring fertilize every other week, Water every day. when fall comes could i chop it down. put chicken wire fencing around the clump fill with straw and then put construction tarp over it. Come spring could it come back??

designshark · 11-16-2013, 09:27 PM

That would be a good experiment! I wonder if the heavy snow would insulate the ground some when it's covered. I've herd when you plant in the ground, plant the corm a foot deeper than recommended for extra protection. The straw would be good and maybe some heat tape and keep it dry. I believe it could make it. That's pretty cold!

scottu · 11-17-2013, 06:29 PM

I think you could keep it alive over winter, especially with lots of snow to insulate but, i'm not sure if the short growing season would allow it to grow and gain enough energy to get over the yearly winter drain! Good luck and lets find out!

Montgg · 11-17-2013, 06:36 PM

Do you think i would need artificial heat? if i use 2-3 feet of mulch and tarp

Olafhenny · 11-17-2013, 07:01 PM

Man (do you have a first name?),

would I love to see you carry through that experiment. Here are my thoughts for next winter:

You do not say, if you did bring it in in pots or bare root. If in pots you might get a couple of pups by
next spring, thus you might have at least one to experiment with. If not: The HZ4 suggests, that you
might live in Canada. If that is so, then I am prepared to sent you one of my own next spring, at my
expense, for the cause, providing:
• you look through this thread:
• Permanent banana shelter for winter and spring
• you decide to build that contraption, or another version of it. You can build one 48 inches high from
two sheets of polystyrene

That shelter will give you better protection than straw in a chicken wire cage, because it provides almost
assuredly better insulation as well as harvest some of the residual warmth of the soil below. And add at
least one month to the next growing season. You can still do the chicken wire and straw thing at the
outside of the shelter, if you want some extra insurance.

By next spring we should also have the results of my wintering experiments. I will send you more
information, if you are interested

Good luck,
Olaf
PS: you might also want to read through:
where are you - Bananas.org

Montgg · 11-17-2013, 07:06 PM

Thank you, My first name is Montgomery.

Montgg · 11-17-2013, 08:51 PM

I brought them in bareroot put a plasitic bag or the root ball. Im in Edmonton, Alberta

cincinnana · 11-17-2013, 10:10 PM

I looked up your average temp is it really below 32 degrees year round.
Thats pretty chilly........BRRRR

Olafhenny · 11-17-2013, 10:44 PM

Hi Montgomery,

if you live in Edmonton my offer is valid. I cannot send any plants to the US. They are afraid
it would destroy their flourishing banana industry.

Seriously, I believe the concern is about
contamination through any soil, which may still adhere to the roots. They do not seem to be
concerned about contaminated Canadian soil on my car tires, when I cross the border.

Now to bare root wintering: Do not let any part of the plant come into direct contact with concrete
(garage or basement floor). If you store them lying down, make sure, that you first place some
plastic (garbage bags are fine) on the concrete and top those with cardboard, before you place
the plants on top. Concrete promotes rot. Plastic is also not desirable. Standing up, I would
place them into a high box with semi dry peat moss to prevent them from drying out too much.
Ideal temperature is between 5 and 10^C degrees. Cooler is okay with basjoos, as long as it
does not reach 0^C. above 10^C the cold, dry outside air will be made even drier by heating it
and convert your plants to hay.

If you have some soil left around the roots in plastic bags, that will mitigate some of the ill
effects of the plastic, especially if you also add some peat moss.

All of these problems you will be able to avoid, with simply protecting them outside sufficiently
next year. The roots will supply just the right amount of moisture to the stump of the PS and
a rain cover above, already part of the shelter, will keep out excess moisture.

Good luck,
Olaf

Montgg · 11-18-2013, 06:12 PM

Heres some pictures of my Musa basjoo it only has like 2 pups this was late in the year. its grown 8 leaves in 3 and a half months. considering when i got it i chopped it in half because it had rotted... Sorry for not using gallery it says that i have no images in it even tho i did it 3 times and uploaded it to members gallery. its stored in a unheated basement. stays around 4-10 celcius in there. hopefully i will successfully overwinter it outdoors.

Montgg · 11-18-2013, 06:22 PM

Will only let me upload the bad image ...........

Olafhenny · 11-18-2013, 07:45 PM

Hi Montgomery,

this is a nice looking couple of basjoos!

That pup looks quite ready to make it on its own. But I left #1, 2 and 4 of the first 4 pups
attached to make a pad and used #3 for transplanting and propagation I like them better
in a group, than looking at single stalks.

Here is a picture of my original pad:

As far as uploading photos is concerned, maybe this repeat of one of my previous
posts will help:

Here is a repeat of another post of mine elsewhere in this forum, of a step by step
procedure of uploading photos:

1. Go to: bananas.org/gallery/uploadphoto.php?cat=500
2. click on ‘Browse’ or ’Chose File’ (depending on your browser)
3. Go to your folder, where the picture is located
4. Double click on the photo. That will transfer the location of the photo in your computer to the
Bananas upload site. You can do that with 4 pictures at the time
5. Click on the red Process window. That will put the photo into your Gallery or if you don’t
have one yet, will open one up for you (if I remember correctly)
6. Double click on the photo. That will open up a condensed version of the photo (about post
card size). If you want to post the original size, click anywhere on the image.
7. Left click on “Code for bulletin boards:” at the bottom of the image
8. Then right click on it again
9. In the dialogue box click on “Copy” that will copy the Banana.Org address of the image
10. Go to your post and paste it, where you want it to appear.
That sounds a lot more
complex, than it really is. After the first few hundred photos it will come quite fluently :h:

Come think of it I did have some problems uploading with my default browser,
Firefox. I fixed that by using Google Chrome exclusively for uploading photos into
bananas.org.

Good luck!
Olaf
PS: If you have other uploading problems see here: Can't upload any pictures

Montgg · 11-18-2013, 07:56 PM

Is it okay that i left the pup with the mother plant in dry storage?

Olafhenny · 11-18-2013, 08:13 PM

I really do not have any experience with dry root storage of my own, because I have wintered
all my basjoos outside, from the start, as long as they were at least as big as your bigger pup.
Anything smaller and my ornatas I have potted up and placed them near a south facing window.

But to answer you question, As long as they are attached to the main corm, they will survive with
it. As an alternative you can separate the bigger one, pot it and place it near a window.

Montgg · 11-19-2013, 07:28 PM

Ive seen some stuff about musa sikimensis. Some people say its hardier some say not so much. I would like to experiment sikimensis as well with basjoo together and see which one comes back from the winter.

Olafhenny · 11-19-2013, 07:45 PM

I know nothing about the sikimensis. The conventional wisdom around here appears to
be, that the basjoo is about as hardy as bananas get. Though it may have some equals.

cincinnana · 11-19-2013, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Montgg

Ive seen some stuff about musa sikimensis. Some people say its hardier some say not so much. I would like to experiment sikimensis as well with basjoo together and see which one comes back from the winter.

Basjoos .....hands down, especially in your area.

I have not had experience with sikimensis........I do not know.

However with Basjoos in my zone 6/5 I know hands down that these plants are very, very forgiving.

Even inside my home in the winter Basjoos in containers fair much better than ALL of my plants......even though they are somewhat dormant.

Sounds like a good test though

Olafhenny · 11-19-2013, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cincinnana

Even inside my home in the winter Basjoos in containers fair much better than ALL of my plants......even though they are somewhat dormant.

Hi Mike,

I surmise, that you have not tried a musa ornata indoors. Mine seem to suffer setbacks whenever
I plant them outside, but thrive during the winter by the window. They do not even blink, when I
bring them inside in fall and keep right on growing despite the lesser light.

By contrast when I first moved them outside last spring, they shriveled, I presume from light shock,
recovered, only to fold up again, when the weather got hot and the sun shone on the pot. After I
moved them into the shade, they picked up again

The beauty about them is, that they are small enough to attain full maturity even in a small
apartment.

Best,
Olaf

cincinnana · 11-19-2013, 09:04 PM

HI Olaf

Ornatas are on my wish.
I have no experience with them.
I love the compact size.
They sound like a must have........maybe in the spring I can pick one up.
I have seen your posts about them and have found them interesting.
Maybe I can trade some Cincinnati Style Chili with cheese for some......

kaczercat · 11-21-2013, 02:59 PM

was just checking out the zones for up there
Alberta - Veseys

says you're in 3a, ahh thats cold!! never heard of someone way up there trying this. I think you'd need some lights near the base. it says they are only hardy to zone 5 but you never know unless you try, hope it turns out well for ya, good luck!

11-16-2013, 08:03 PM	#1 (permalink)
Montgg Location: Edmonton, Alberta Zone: 3b-4a Name: Monty Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 24 BananaBucks : 9,412 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 3 Times Was Thanked 12 Times in 7 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 0 Times	Musa basjoo zone 4a Hello i was wondering if its possible. we get lows of -30 celcius or even -40 on rare occasions. we also get tons of snow........ Just spent 2 hours shoveling 2 feet of snow. i already brought my 6 foot musa basjoo in for the winter.. but i was wondering if i plant it soon enough in spring fertilize every other week, Water every day. when fall comes could i chop it down. put chicken wire fencing around the clump fill with straw and then put construction tarp over it. Come spring could it come back??

11-16-2013, 09:27 PM	#2 (permalink)
designshark Location: Anderson, Indiana Find me on the map! Zone: 5-6 Name: Tim Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 223 BananaBucks : 27,572 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 66 Times Was Thanked 148 Times in 94 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 154 Times	Re: Musa basjoo zone 4a That would be a good experiment! I wonder if the heavy snow would insulate the ground some when it's covered. I've herd when you plant in the ground, plant the corm a foot deeper than recommended for extra protection. The straw would be good and maybe some heat tape and keep it dry. I believe it could make it. That's pretty cold!

11-17-2013, 06:29 PM	#3 (permalink)
scottu <div style="font-weight: bold;"><div style="font-weight: bold;">&lt;div style=&quot;font-weight: bold;&quot;&gt;&amp;lt;di v style=&amp;quot;font-weight: bold;&amp;quot;&amp;gt;&a mp;amp;lt;di v sty scottu's Photo Gallery Location: Bethlehem,Pa. Find me on the map! Zone: 6 Name: scott Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 1,192 BananaBucks : 23,978 Feedback: 1 / 100% Said "Thanks" 3,595 Times Was Thanked 857 Times in 368 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 3,323 Times	Re: Musa basjoo zone 4a I think you could keep it alive over winter, especially with lots of snow to insulate but, i'm not sure if the short growing season would allow it to grow and gain enough energy to get over the yearly winter drain! Good luck and lets find out! __________________ Viva La Banana

11-17-2013, 06:36 PM	#4 (permalink)
Montgg Location: Edmonton, Alberta Zone: 3b-4a Name: Monty Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 24 BananaBucks : 9,412 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 3 Times Was Thanked 12 Times in 7 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 0 Times	Re: Musa basjoo zone 4a Do you think i would need artificial heat? if i use 2-3 feet of mulch and tarp

11-17-2013, 07:01 PM	#5 (permalink)
Olafhenny Olafhenny's Photo Gallery Location: Penticton, BC, Okanagan Valley, Canada Find me on the map! Zone: Hardiness Zone 6 Name: Olaf Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,705 BananaBucks : 297,528 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 2,050 Times Was Thanked 2,012 Times in 876 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 77 Times	Re: Musa basjoo zone 4a Man (do you have a first name?), would I love to see you carry through that experiment. Here are my thoughts for next winter: You do not say, if you did bring it in in pots or bare root. If in pots you might get a couple of pups by next spring, thus you might have at least one to experiment with. If not: The HZ4 suggests, that you might live in Canada. If that is so, then I am prepared to sent you one of my own next spring, at my expense, for the cause, providing: • you look through this thread: • Permanent banana shelter for winter and spring • you decide to build that contraption, or another version of it. You can build one 48 inches high from two sheets of polystyrene That shelter will give you better protection than straw in a chicken wire cage, because it provides almost assuredly better insulation as well as harvest some of the residual warmth of the soil below. And add at least one month to the next growing season. You can still do the chicken wire and straw thing at the outside of the shelter, if you want some extra insurance. By next spring we should also have the results of my wintering experiments. I will send you more information, if you are interested Good luck, Olaf PS: you might also want to read through: where are you - Bananas.org __________________ The reason I joined this forum was to share experiences, my own and those of others and to learn from them.

Members currently in the chatroom: 0
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11-17-2013, 07:06 PM	#6 (permalink)
Montgg Location: Edmonton, Alberta Zone: 3b-4a Name: Monty Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 24 BananaBucks : 9,412 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 3 Times Was Thanked 12 Times in 7 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 0 Times	Re: Musa basjoo zone 4a Thank you, My first name is Montgomery.

11-17-2013, 08:51 PM	#7 (permalink)
Montgg Location: Edmonton, Alberta Zone: 3b-4a Name: Monty Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 24 BananaBucks : 9,412 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 3 Times Was Thanked 12 Times in 7 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 0 Times	Re: Musa basjoo zone 4a I brought them in bareroot put a plasitic bag or the root ball. Im in Edmonton, Alberta

11-17-2013, 10:10 PM	#8 (permalink)
cincinnana container grower Location: Southwest Ohio U.S.A.🇺🇸 Find me on the map! Zone: HZ 6/5 Microclimate - Elevation 750 feet- 228.60 meters Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 8,885 BananaBucks : 15 Feedback: 7 / 100% Said "Thanks" 3,924 Times Was Thanked 11,800 Times in 4,918 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 1,959 Times	Re: Musa basjoo zone 4a I looked up your average temp is it really below 32 degrees year round. Thats pretty chilly........BRRRR __________________ Cincinnana/Hostafarians Photo Gallery 🌴 Last edited by cincinnana : 11-18-2013 at 07:01 AM. Reason: BRRRR

11-17-2013, 10:44 PM	#9 (permalink)
Olafhenny Olafhenny's Photo Gallery Location: Penticton, BC, Okanagan Valley, Canada Find me on the map! Zone: Hardiness Zone 6 Name: Olaf Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,705 BananaBucks : 297,528 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 2,050 Times Was Thanked 2,012 Times in 876 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 77 Times	Re: Musa basjoo zone 4a Hi Montgomery, if you live in Edmonton my offer is valid. I cannot send any plants to the US. They are afraid it would destroy their flourishing banana industry. Seriously, I believe the concern is about contamination through any soil, which may still adhere to the roots. They do not seem to be concerned about contaminated Canadian soil on my car tires, when I cross the border. Now to bare root wintering: Do not let any part of the plant come into direct contact with concrete (garage or basement floor). If you store them lying down, make sure, that you first place some plastic (garbage bags are fine) on the concrete and top those with cardboard, before you place the plants on top. Concrete promotes rot. Plastic is also not desirable. Standing up, I would place them into a high box with semi dry peat moss to prevent them from drying out too much. Ideal temperature is between 5 and 10^C degrees. Cooler is okay with basjoos, as long as it does not reach 0^C. above 10^C the cold, dry outside air will be made even drier by heating it and convert your plants to hay. If you have some soil left around the roots in plastic bags, that will mitigate some of the ill effects of the plastic, especially if you also add some peat moss. All of these problems you will be able to avoid, with simply protecting them outside sufficiently next year. The roots will supply just the right amount of moisture to the stump of the PS and a rain cover above, already part of the shelter, will keep out excess moisture. Good luck, Olaf __________________ The reason I joined this forum was to share experiences, my own and those of others and to learn from them.

11-18-2013, 06:22 PM	#11 (permalink)
Montgg Location: Edmonton, Alberta Zone: 3b-4a Name: Monty Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 24 BananaBucks : 9,412 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 3 Times Was Thanked 12 Times in 7 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 0 Times	Re: Musa basjoo zone 4a Will only let me upload the bad image ...........

11-18-2013, 07:45 PM	#12 (permalink)
Olafhenny Olafhenny's Photo Gallery Location: Penticton, BC, Okanagan Valley, Canada Find me on the map! Zone: Hardiness Zone 6 Name: Olaf Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,705 BananaBucks : 297,528 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 2,050 Times Was Thanked 2,012 Times in 876 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 77 Times	Re: Musa basjoo zone 4a Hi Montgomery, this is a nice looking couple of basjoos! That pup looks quite ready to make it on its own. But I left #1, 2 and 4 of the first 4 pups attached to make a pad and used #3 for transplanting and propagation I like them better in a group, than looking at single stalks. Here is a picture of my original pad: As far as uploading photos is concerned, maybe this repeat of one of my previous posts will help: Here is a repeat of another post of mine elsewhere in this forum, of a step by step procedure of uploading photos: 1. Go to: bananas.org/gallery/uploadphoto.php?cat=500 2. click on ‘Browse’ or ’Chose File’ (depending on your browser) 3. Go to your folder, where the picture is located 4. Double click on the photo. That will transfer the location of the photo in your computer to the Bananas upload site. You can do that with 4 pictures at the time 5. Click on the red Process window. That will put the photo into your Gallery or if you don’t have one yet, will open one up for you (if I remember correctly) 6. Double click on the photo. That will open up a condensed version of the photo (about post card size). If you want to post the original size, click anywhere on the image. 7. Left click on “Code for bulletin boards:” at the bottom of the image 8. Then right click on it again 9. In the dialogue box click on “Copy” that will copy the Banana.Org address of the image 10. Go to your post and paste it, where you want it to appear. That sounds a lot more complex, than it really is. After the first few hundred photos it will come quite fluently :h: Come think of it I did have some problems uploading with my default browser, Firefox. I fixed that by using Google Chrome exclusively for uploading photos into bananas.org. Good luck! Olaf PS: If you have other uploading problems see here: Can't upload any pictures __________________ The reason I joined this forum was to share experiences, my own and those of others and to learn from them.

11-18-2013, 07:56 PM	#13 (permalink)
Montgg Location: Edmonton, Alberta Zone: 3b-4a Name: Monty Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 24 BananaBucks : 9,412 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 3 Times Was Thanked 12 Times in 7 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 0 Times	Re: Musa basjoo zone 4a Is it okay that i left the pup with the mother plant in dry storage?

11-18-2013, 08:13 PM	#14 (permalink)
Olafhenny Olafhenny's Photo Gallery Location: Penticton, BC, Okanagan Valley, Canada Find me on the map! Zone: Hardiness Zone 6 Name: Olaf Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,705 BananaBucks : 297,528 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 2,050 Times Was Thanked 2,012 Times in 876 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 77 Times	Re: Musa basjoo zone 4a I really do not have any experience with dry root storage of my own, because I have wintered all my basjoos outside, from the start, as long as they were at least as big as your bigger pup. Anything smaller and my ornatas I have potted up and placed them near a south facing window. But to answer you question, As long as they are attached to the main corm, they will survive with it. As an alternative you can separate the bigger one, pot it and place it near a window. __________________ The reason I joined this forum was to share experiences, my own and those of others and to learn from them.

11-19-2013, 07:28 PM	#15 (permalink)
Montgg Location: Edmonton, Alberta Zone: 3b-4a Name: Monty Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 24 BananaBucks : 9,412 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 3 Times Was Thanked 12 Times in 7 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 0 Times	Re: Musa basjoo zone 4a Ive seen some stuff about musa sikimensis. Some people say its hardier some say not so much. I would like to experiment sikimensis as well with basjoo together and see which one comes back from the winter.

11-19-2013, 07:45 PM	#16 (permalink)
Olafhenny Olafhenny's Photo Gallery Location: Penticton, BC, Okanagan Valley, Canada Find me on the map! Zone: Hardiness Zone 6 Name: Olaf Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,705 BananaBucks : 297,528 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 2,050 Times Was Thanked 2,012 Times in 876 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 77 Times	Re: Musa basjoo zone 4a I know nothing about the sikimensis. The conventional wisdom around here appears to be, that the basjoo is about as hardy as bananas get. Though it may have some equals. __________________ The reason I joined this forum was to share experiences, my own and those of others and to learn from them.

11-19-2013, 09:04 PM	#19 (permalink)
cincinnana container grower Location: Southwest Ohio U.S.A.🇺🇸 Find me on the map! Zone: HZ 6/5 Microclimate - Elevation 750 feet- 228.60 meters Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 8,885 BananaBucks : 15 Feedback: 7 / 100% Said "Thanks" 3,924 Times Was Thanked 11,800 Times in 4,918 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 1,959 Times	Re: Musa basjoo zone 4a HI Olaf Ornatas are on my wish. I have no experience with them. I love the compact size. They sound like a must have........maybe in the spring I can pick one up. I have seen your posts about them and have found them interesting. Maybe I can trade some Cincinnati Style Chili with cheese for some...... __________________ Cincinnana/Hostafarians Photo Gallery 🌴 Last edited by cincinnana : 11-19-2013 at 09:06 PM. Reason: Added cheese.........

11-21-2013, 02:59 PM	#20 (permalink)
kaczercat kaczercat's Photo Gallery Location: Southern ON Find me on the map! Zone: 5b 9b Name: Matt Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 1,874 BananaBucks : 282,711 Feedback: 3 / 100% Said "Thanks" 3,116 Times Was Thanked 2,111 Times in 750 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 11 Times	Re: Musa basjoo zone 4a was just checking out the zones for up there Alberta - Veseys says you're in 3a, ahh thats cold!! never heard of someone way up there trying this. I think you'd need some lights near the base. it says they are only hardy to zone 5 but you never know unless you try, hope it turns out well for ya, good luck! __________________ Matt

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