How to breed (seedless) Bananas for Temperate climates - Page 2

SoCal2warm · 07-23-2019, 09:20 PM

Mississippi State Trial Gardens has Red Abyssinian, Bordelon, and Thai Black growing outside, USDA climate zone 8a.

(Cold Tolerant Bananas, MissStateExtension, YouTube video)

The following descriptions come from Dennis Carey of Plant Delights Nursery in North Carolina, which appears to be in zone 7b, looking at a climate zone map.

Musa sikkimensis 'Red Flash'
(Zone 7b-10)

Musa thomsonii (Thompson's edible banana)
This Himalayan species grows to 15 feet tall, but our plants have topped out with 12-foot glaucous grey stems. The new leaves often have a red flush on the reverse side. We have had our plants in the ground since 2007, and they have survived 9°F without mulch. (Zone 7b-10)

Musa velutina (pink velvet banana)
There's something mystical about a pink velvet banana that makes you want to start belting out Elvis tunes. M. velutina was our first introduction to hardy bananas and is still a favorite in our summer garden. Rarely exceeding 6 feet tall, M. velutina produces copious flower stalks near the top of the trunk, starting in late summer. Each stalk is soon home to clusters of small, pink velvet bananas. Don't plan on a snack from these seed-filled bananas unless you are exceedingly hungry or exceedingly drunk. Once established, they seem to be quite winter-hardy. Not all strains of M. velutina are equally winter hardy. (Zone 7b-10)

https://www.nurserymag.com/article/n...banana-plants/

Right now I have two seedlings of Helen's Hybrid and two of Musa thomsonii, so this information sounds very hopeful.
I'm not sure how well they can do in the Pacific Northwest climate though.

sirdoofus · 08-26-2019, 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoCal2warm

BananaJSSI on YouTube just posted a comment that his Helen's Hybrid he was growing on Salt Spring Island has rotted and doesn't look like it survived the Winter. It was a colder Winter than usual though this year.

Salt Spring Island is a small island, one of the Gulf Islands lying between Vancouver Island and mainland British Columbia (Canada), it's in zone 9a, despite the cool temperatures most of the year.

video title: How to Grow Cold Hardy Banana Plants, published June 8, 2019
comment posted by WesleyAPEX
"The Helens Hybrid died??"
reply posted by BananaJSSI , on June 2
"It looks like it rotted , so obviously not good here"

He had wrapped the trunk with insulation, as shown in another video, and it was under the cover of many tall surrounding Musa basjoo bananas in a virtual jungle, so it wasn't completely out in the open, but he did say they had some pretty strong Winter winds.

Just a note on hardiness zones here in Canada. I believe 9a on Saltspring would be an AgCan rating which in general, although not precise because we use a different system, is one zone-unit higher than the USDA rating. So AgCan 9a would be roughly equivalent to USDA 8a. If that helps anything

PR-Giants · 08-30-2019, 08:51 AM

This is good advice.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gabe15

Most of what you describe is rather unrealistic, I'm sorry to say, the end goal is probably possible, but it's likely not going to be obtainable by crossing those common cultivars. Additionally, anything with a B genome is very difficult to breed with due to eBSV (Banana Streak Virus).

As a banana breeder myself, I would recommend to start super super simple, and literally just try to cross anything and not get caught up in planning exactly what to cross and thinking about what the results will be. It can be quite a challenge to generate hybrid seedlings of any sort, let alone ones that will conform to your desires, and its a numbers game where you will need to generate and sort through hundreds to thousands of seedlings to get something that might resemble what you had in mind.

I would also recommend to read up on how edible bananas work. Simmonds' "Bananas" and "The Evolution of the Bananas" are essentials. Breeding edible bananas is not all about ploidy, and in fact, ploidy levels are not even that important to consider overall.

When I started I wanted to keep it as simple as possible and just try to cross anything in order to make a list of which crosses produced seeds easier and then which crosses produced seeds that germinated more often.

It's a long process so enjoy the journey.

Quote:

Originally Posted by PR-Giants

There is a very good chance that our largest bunch ever from a white Pisang Awak will be seeded. The inflorescence bloomed about 5 feet away from a seeded banana blooming during the same time. It has 15 hands and about 300 fingers.

We've gotten a bunch a interesting seedlings so far, but many seeds don't germinate or grow properly.

Here's 2 seedlings that seem to be growing well so far.

SoCal2warm · 09-04-2019, 09:57 PM

Here's a Helen's Hybrid seedling that I grew from seed

07-23-2019, 09:20 PM	#21 (permalink)
SoCal2warm Join Date: Sep 2018 Posts: 61 BananaBucks : 15,467 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 2 Times Was Thanked 64 Times in 33 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 0 Times	Re: How to breed (seedless) Bananas for Temperate climates Mississippi State Trial Gardens has Red Abyssinian, Bordelon, and Thai Black growing outside, USDA climate zone 8a. (Cold Tolerant Bananas, MissStateExtension, YouTube video) The following descriptions come from Dennis Carey of Plant Delights Nursery in North Carolina, which appears to be in zone 7b, looking at a climate zone map. Musa sikkimensis 'Red Flash' (Zone 7b-10) Musa thomsonii (Thompson's edible banana) This Himalayan species grows to 15 feet tall, but our plants have topped out with 12-foot glaucous grey stems. The new leaves often have a red flush on the reverse side. We have had our plants in the ground since 2007, and they have survived 9°F without mulch. (Zone 7b-10) Musa velutina (pink velvet banana) There's something mystical about a pink velvet banana that makes you want to start belting out Elvis tunes. M. velutina was our first introduction to hardy bananas and is still a favorite in our summer garden. Rarely exceeding 6 feet tall, M. velutina produces copious flower stalks near the top of the trunk, starting in late summer. Each stalk is soon home to clusters of small, pink velvet bananas. Don't plan on a snack from these seed-filled bananas unless you are exceedingly hungry or exceedingly drunk. Once established, they seem to be quite winter-hardy. Not all strains of M. velutina are equally winter hardy. (Zone 7b-10) https://www.nurserymag.com/article/n...banana-plants/ Right now I have two seedlings of Helen's Hybrid and two of Musa thomsonii, so this information sounds very hopeful. I'm not sure how well they can do in the Pacific Northwest climate though. Last edited by SoCal2warm : 07-23-2019 at 09:25 PM.

09-04-2019, 09:57 PM	#24 (permalink)
SoCal2warm Join Date: Sep 2018 Posts: 61 BananaBucks : 15,467 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 2 Times Was Thanked 64 Times in 33 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 0 Times	Re: How to breed (seedless) Bananas for Temperate climates Here's a Helen's Hybrid seedling that I grew from seed

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