Persimmon Tree question
 

Hello Folks:

I have a Persimmon tree that fruited well in 2008 and less in 2009. We did have a drought, but I watered it frequently. I am wondering if I should fertilize and if so with what? I would like it to use organics if possible.:2722:

Maybe bencelest can answer this. I noticed he has a nice one.

Re: Persimmon Tree question
 

I can answer you from my own experience only. I do not proclaim that it is the best method but this is just from my own experience.
I fertilize my persimmons with nothing but a cubic yard of steer manure at the beginning of the Spring and nothing else. When I see that new buds are starting to come out I spread a cubic yard of steer manure (cost $1.00) around the perimeter of the plant. Not only do I fertilize the persimmons but my other plants as well like my bananas, Fuji apples and citrus trees. So I spend perhaps $10 overall.
My problems are the bugs that are relentless eating the new buds of my plants. So I am forever busy killing them with my hands and other means.

Re: Persimmon Tree question
 

I did a little research and here's what I found out:

Commercial growers in Hawaii use either 16-16-16 or 10-20-20 N-P-K fertilizer, applied in February or March when new shoots emerge. Excessive nitrogen fertilization will force vegetative growth, so moderate fertilizer applications are desirable .

Re: Persimmon Tree question
 

Cool, thanks Benny!

Where do you get your steer manure from? A farmer? Craig's list? I can buy it by the bags.

Thanks for the help. I asked because I had heard fertilizin to much just encourages leaf growth.:bananas_b

Re: Persimmon Tree question
 

Thanks for looking. Now I'll have to find out where to get 16-16-16 or 10-20-20 N-P-K fertilizer.

Re: Persimmon Tree question
 

Home Depot, Wallmart, K-mart and Orchard Supply are your best bet. But any Nursery store should carry them.

Re: Persimmon Tree question
 

Persimmons are a fruiting member of the Ebony family, and one of the few that is not poisonous. The common "apple shaped" species is native to the Himalayan subtropical zone that stretches roughly from the Caspian Sea to east-central China.

Persimmons (and the Ebony family in general) are known for fussy young roots. A sure way to kill a young persimmon -- esp. bare-root is to over water it in a heavy soil.

The "apple" persimmons are not native to a nitrogen-rich environment. They do well with an N-P-K profile that is "medium-low-medium" or "medium-low-high" such as 15-5-15 or 20-5-30. Note that these are the same ratios that are recommended for bananas and pit fruits.

Re: Persimmon Tree question
 

Interesting, I wonder if my current soil contributes to fruit drop during ripening period. It seems an excess number drop from the tree. I felt at first the tree couldn't support them nutritionally or I was watering to much. But when I saw, Benny's, photo I was encouraged.

I have already ordered some banana fertilizer and will be applying it.

Thanks Richard!:bananas_b

Re: Persimmon Tree question
 

here's some post in another forum:

: Fertilizer for persimmons? clip this post email this post what is this?
see most clipped and recent clippings

Posted by juniorpilot USDA 10 Suns 20 (My Page) on Thu, Apr 10, 08 at 0:01

ruas:
Too much nitrogen fertilization is known to cause persimmon fruit drop.

I don't know what caused your persimmon fruit drop last winter. But two or three years is a bit young for a persimmon tree to hold its fruit to maturity. It may be that in this coming fourth year it will be old enough to hold its fruit to maturity. If you put any nitrogenous fertilizer on it in those first three years, I would suspect that MAYBE there was too much nitrogen also.

A certain amount of fruit drop is natural in persimmons. My Hachiya will drop quite a bit of fruit on its own, but I still have to manually thin the remaining fruitlets even more to prevent branches from breaking when the fruit mature. It started bearing in its third year.

Persimmons do well without too much fussing over fertilization and irrigation given that the soil is half-way decent. If it gets roughly 6 hours of sunlight and enough water that the soil doesn't dry out four inches down, you should get persimmons this coming winter. I would go very easy on the TLC. It's possible to kill fruit trees with too much TLC -- especially with too much water and especially for "newbies."

Hang-in there this fourth year. I sometimes think that the reason I'm so interested in home orcharding is that Somebody wants to teach me patience -- on which I am thin.

Your 12-5-8 formulation is "hot" in nitrogen which citrus and avocado can use. But I wouldn't put any on my persimmon tree without a soil test beforehand to know whether my soil was nitrogen deficient or not.

Tony

Re: Persimmon Tree question
 

And this is what I found in my research:
Note the fertilization at the end of the article.

PERSIMMON

Diospyros kaki Linn
Ebenaceae
Common Names: Persimmon, Oriental Persimmon, Japanese Persimmon, Kaki.
Related species: Black Sapote (Diospyros digyna), Mabolo, Velvet Apple (D. discolor), Date Plum (D. lotus), Texas Persimmon (D. texana), American Persimmon (D. virginiana).

Origin: The oriental persimmon is native to China, where it has been cultivated for centuries and more than two thousand different cultivars exist. It spread to Korea and Japan many years ago where additional cultivars were developed. The plant was introduced to California in the mid 1800's.

Adaptation: Persimmons do best in areas that have moderate winters and relatively mild summers--suitable for growing in USDA Hardiness Zones 7 to 10. It can tolerate temperatures of 0° F when fully dormant. However, because of its low chilling requirement (less than 100 hours), it may break dormancy during early warm spells only to be damaged by spring frosts later. The leaves are killed by 26° F when growing. Trees do not produce well in the high summer heat of desert regions, which may also sunburn the bark.

DESCRIPTION
Growth Habit: The persimmon is a multitrunked or single-stemmed deciduous tree to 25 ft. high and at least as wide. It is a handsome ornamental with drooping leaves and branches that give it a languid, rather tropical appearance. The branches are somewhat brittle and can be damaged in high winds.
Foliage: Persimmon leaves are alternate, simple, ovate and up to 7 inches long and 4 inches wide. They are often pale, slightly yellowish green in youth, turning a dark, glossy green as they age. Under mild autumn conditions the leaves often turn dramatic shades of yellow, orange and red. Tea can also be made from fresh or dried leaves.

Flowers: The inconspicuous flowers surrounded by a green calyx tube are borne in the leaf axils of new growth from one-year old wood. Female flowers are single and cream-colored while the pink-tinged male flowers are typically borne in threes. Commonly, 1 to 5 flowers per twig emerge as the new growth extends (typically March). Persimmon trees are usually either male or female, but some trees have both male and female flowers. On male plants, especially, occasional perfect (bisexual) flowers occur, producing an atypical fruit. A tree's sexual expression can vary from one year to the other. Many cultivars are parthenocarpic (setting seedless fruit without pollination), although some climates require pollination for adequate production. When plants not needing pollination are pollinated, they will produce fruits with seeds and may be larger and have a different flavor and texture than do their seedless counterparts.

Fruit: Persimmons can be classified into two general categories: those that bear astringent fruit until they are soft ripe and those that bear nonastringent fruits. Within each of these categories, there are cultivars whose fruits are influenced by pollination (pollination variant) and cultivars whose fruits are unaffected by pollination (pollination constant). Actually, it is the seeds, not pollination per se, that influences the fruit. An astringent cultivar must be jelly soft before it is fit to eat, and such cultivars are best adapted to cooler regions where persimmons can be grown. The flesh color of pollination-constant astringent cultivars is not influenced by pollination. Pollination-variant astringent cultivars have dark flesh around the seeds when pollinated. A nonastringent persimmon can be eaten when it is crisp as an apple. These cultivars need hot summers, and the fruit might retain some astringency when grown in cooler regions. Pollination-constant nonastringent (PCNA) persimmons are always edible when still firm; pollination-variant nonastringent (PVNA) fruit are edible when firm only if they have been pollinated.

The shape of the fruit varies by cultivar from spherical to acorn to flattened or squarish. The color of the fruit varies from light yellow-orange to dark orange-red. The size can be as little as a few ounces to more than a pound. The entire fruit is edible except for the seed and calyx. Alternate bearing is common. This can be partially overcome by thinning the fruit or moderately pruning after a light-crop year. Astringency can also be removed by treating with carbon dioxide or alcohol. Freezing the fruit overnight and then thawing softens the fruit and also removes the astringency. Unharvested fruit remaining on the tree after leaf fall creates a very decorative effect. It is common for many immature fruit to drop from May to September

CULTURE
Location: Full sun with some air movement is recommended for persimmon trees in inland areas, although they will tolerate some partial shade. Persimmons grown in cooler areas should have full sun with protection from cooling breezes. As an attractive ornamental the tree fits well in the landscape. It does not compete well with eucalyptus.
Soil: Persimmons can withstand a wide rage of conditions as long as the soil is not overly salty, but does best in deep, well drained loam. A pH range of 6.5 to 7.5 is preferred. The tree has a strong tap root which may mean digging a deeper hole than usual when planting (when on D. kaki stock).

Irrigation: Persimmon trees will withstand short periods of drought, but the fruit will be larger and of higher quality with regular watering. Extreme drought will cause the leaves and fruit to drop prematurely. Any fruit left on the tree will probably sunburn. Some 36 to 48 inches of water are needed annually, applied gradually in spring and tapering off in the fall. Hot inland areas may require 2 or 3 applications weekly, while coastal areas may need watering only once every 6 weeks, depending on the soil. If a drip system is is used, the emitters should be moved away from the trunk as the tree matures.

Fertilization: Most trees do well with a minimum of fertilizing. Excess nitrogen can cause fruit drop. If mature leaves are not deep green and shoot growth is less than a foot per year, apply a balanced fertilizer such as a 10-10-10 at a rate of l pound per inch of trunk diameter at ground level. Spread the fertilizer evenly under the canopy in late winter or early spring.

Re: Persimmon Tree question
 

Guess how mine died? :ha:

Re: Persimmon Tree question
 

Ha Ha! I may have already asked this question before and forgot. It seems it refreshes my memory now.

I think I may have very well have contributed to some of the problem. When I dug the hole it was deep enough and I even elevated the area a bit to improve on the slightly rocky clay soil.

However maybe it was last year that I grew some Mustard Greens in the area and threw around some higher nitrogen fertilizer. I felt I had kept it away from the tree's drip line. Though looking back now I may have been way to close. I'll be sure to stay away from excess nitrogen.

Thanks Benny!:bananas_b