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Ornamental Bananas This forum is for discussions of ornamental bananas. Ornate bananas are beautiful and a joy to grow. And there are so many types to discuss and learn about.


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Old 11-15-2013, 06:39 AM   #1 (permalink)
 
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Default A real beginner question

So what actually is the difference between ornamental, and not ornamental?

Is it seeds, simple as that?

Is it being edible or not? And are the non-edibles actually inedible (bad for you) or just uneatable (unpalatable)? or is that, again, about seeds?

Bear in mind I don't know anything about bananas. I once made a recipe and got mush, because I didn't know "banana" meant "plantain" given where the recipe came from (this was online). I'd heard the word plantain and just vaguely knew it was some kind of foreign foodstuff... this was many moons ago though. But my understanding of varieties of banana, ways of eating them etc, is narrow but widening rapidly since I found this forum. For instance I gather you have cookers and eaters, like apples...? That's a guess, I only saw a mention of them yesterday.

My only experience of bananas different from "normal" (= what Everyone Knows, = what the shops sell) was in Jordan when they were half the size we're used to and lovely n sweet, which we assumed was because fresher than we can buy here. I didn't know you got different colours (red etc) until this week.

Now what is this ignoramus doing on a banana forum anyway, eh.
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Old 11-15-2013, 08:36 AM   #2 (permalink)
░▒▓█ Јustin █▓▒░
 
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Default Re: A real beginner question

That was probably my first real question tooo..... I found all BBB/BB Genome species of bananas have seeds and some can still be ate....Some have small seed some have biggG.
AAAA/AAA/AA genome are bananas w/o seed, usually in stores
ABB/AAB/AABB/ABBB are plantains and have no seeds also but banana family.
ALLLLL bananas are considered edible because they contain nothing poison or toxic to humans....might not taste good. Banana allergy is related to avocado and latex somehow.
TASTE is my next question.
Keep up your research.
Plaintains and Bananas
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Old 11-15-2013, 10:08 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: A real beginner question

Banana Genome INFO
No offense intended Defined:
or·na·men·tal (ôrn-mntl)----just another word
adj.
Of, relating to, or serving as an ornament or decoration.
n.
Something that serves as ornamentation, especially a plant grown for its beauty.
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Old 11-15-2013, 04:13 PM   #4 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbyrd88888 View Post
Banana Genome INFO
No offense intended Defined:
or·na·men·tal (ôrn-mntl)----just another word
adj.
Of, relating to, or serving as an ornament or decoration.
n.
Something that serves as ornamentation, especially a plant grown for its beauty.
That's what I would have thought! But people seem to talk as if ornamentals were a clearly-defined subset of banana plants in general. If it just means growing them because they're pretty, I'll relax. Does the presence of seeds have nothing to do with it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jbyrd88888 View Post
That was probably my first real question tooo..... I found all BBB/BB Genome species of bananas have seeds and some can still be ate....Some have small seed some have biggG.
AAAA/AAA/AA genome are bananas w/o seed, usually in stores
ABB/AAB/AABB/ABBB are plantains and have no seeds also but banana family.
ALLLLL bananas are considered edible because they contain nothing poison or toxic to humans....might not taste good.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbyrd88888 View Post
Banana allergy is related to avocado and latex somehow.
I know about that; my eldest has a severe allergy to rubber latex. So I know a lot more than I'm happy to. It's a question of the proteins in the stuff; there are 14 or 16 in latex, and certain of the same ones are in banana, avocado, also sweet chestnuts and a horde of other things. Luckily he isn't allergic to any of the other foods known to be cross-reactive with latex. - or by now I'd have forgotten about liking to eat bananas! But allergy of course is quite separate from edibility.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jbyrd88888 View Post
TASTE is my next question.
Keep up your research.
Plaintains and Bananas
Genomes are a bit techy for me, for now anyway. That plantain pdf isn't opening (it might tomorrow) but I have now worked out that a plantain is a banana you can fry - at least that seems like the distinction.

ps. It did open. That's the level of detail I'll get into as the bananabug infects me more deeply - assuming this new passion doesn't flicker n fade (dare I think it? (fickle serial obsesser))... that's the level of detail I tend to get into with things sooner or later but not at the very beginning.

No offence taken by the way.
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Old 11-16-2013, 03:26 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: A real beginner question

[quote=mand;234075] ps. It did open. That's the level of detail I'll get into as the bananabug infects me more deeply - assuming this new passion doesn't flicker n fade (dare I think it? (fickle serial obsesser))... that's the level of detail I tend to get into with things sooner or later but not at the very beginning. QUOTE]

Living in Costa Rica we have plenty of experience with platanos (plantains).
They are for cooking and are two types we typically use here.

The first is of two types. When harvested before it is mature it is called Platano Verde (Green Plantain) and can be fried or boiled in soups and stews.
When it is harvested mature and yellow it is called Platano Maduro and is fried. It has a very sweet taste when cooked (I haven't tried them raw).

The second type is called cuadrado and is used in soups and stews when green and/or fried as it turns yellow. When completely mature it can be eaten out of hand but is not as sweet as the bananas you are used to.
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Old 11-16-2013, 05:24 PM   #6 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: A real beginner question

[quote=waggoner41;234146]
Quote:
Originally Posted by mand View Post
ps. It did open. That's the level of detail I'll get into as the bananabug infects me more deeply - assuming this new passion doesn't flicker n fade (dare I think it? (fickle serial obsesser))... that's the level of detail I tend to get into with things sooner or later but not at the very beginning. QUOTE]

Living in Costa Rica we have plenty of experience with platanos (plantains).
They are for cooking and are two types we typically use here.

The first is of two types. When harvested before it is mature it is called Platano Verde (Green Plantain) and can be fried or boiled in soups and stews.
When it is harvested mature and yellow it is called Platano Maduro and is fried. It has a very sweet taste when cooked (I haven't tried them raw).

The second type is called cuadrado and is used in soups and stews when green and/or fried as it turns yellow. When completely mature it can be eaten out of hand but is not as sweet as the bananas you are used to.
Hey, more and more! I don't think I've ever heard of the cuadrado (the word means "cooked"?) but the platano verde / maduro sound like the impression I've got.

About time I got over there to experience them properly. ... world travel is almost as unlikely as world domination in my future ... However I've done a lot of impossible things this last twelve months, so who knows.
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Old 11-22-2013, 02:07 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: A real beginner question

[quote=mand;234153]
Quote:
Originally Posted by waggoner41 View Post

Hey, more and more! I don't think I've ever heard of the cuadrado (the word means "cooked"?) but the platano verde / maduro sound like the impression I've got.

About time I got over there to experience them properly. ... world travel is almost as unlikely as world domination in my future ... However I've done a lot of impossible things this last twelve months, so who knows.
I apologize for taking so long to get back to you. I keep many irons in the fire and had to attend to other items.

In Costa Rica:



From the left are:
Ripe plantain and green plantain.
Platano Maduro (ripe plantain) Musa × paradisiaca is fried or baked with sugar, cinnamon, cheese, sour cream (cream) and butter, delicious!
Platano Verde, (green plantain) is minced, in ceviche or tostones (fried plantains).

Cavendish (Banano Enano in Costa Rica) is yellow, eaten uncooked, alone or with other fruits or cereal (English banana). Ripe bananas from an entire bunch are peeled and boiled slowly for hours to make a thick syrup which is called "honey".

Cuadrado (cuadrado means square), are other varieties that are eaten cooked (boiled or fried) and usually green. When mature and yellow they can be eaten out of hand but are not as sweet as the commercial bananas. The local variety in my area is referred to as “guineo cuadrado” or “square guinea” in English. They grow like weeds here, growing everywhere, and we take advantage.

Dwarf Cavendish that we call, interchangeably Banano Niño or Lady Finger although I am unsure if they are the variety known to all here. These are sweeter than the store bought bananas eaten out of hand.

I was introduced to a new variety that I had not seen before this week. It was brought from the province of Guanacaste. I do not know the name yet but it is similar to the cuadrado but does not have the pronounced angles of the cuadrado.

There may be as many as 50 varieties of banana that grow in Costa Rica, both seeded and unseeded. I will never see the vast majority of them.

As long as your interest holds there are many web sites that can overwhelm you with information. One such is on Purdue University web site, another is How to Grow a Banana Tree in a Temperate Zone or Banana Trees in a Temperate Climate.
Go here to find a Plant Hardiness Zone Map of the British Isles
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Old 11-22-2013, 04:18 PM   #8 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: A real beginner question

That's loads of information, Waggoner41, thank you for taking the trouble (and don't worry about time, we all have the many-irons thing or at least I do).

I'm so new to the subject that I'm still getting my head around the sheer number of varieties, so the thought of 50 or so in just your country is quite something. When I was in Jordan (I hope I'm not repeating myself) we had tiny bananas, tiny compared with what I'm used to, about 4-5 inches long if I remember right, very sweet. At the time I thought, oh, these were "real" bananas as opposed to the "bred for supermarket" kind we are sold, not thinking that the word "banana" might mean many things. You can now buy small bananas as well as "normal", which is a relief, the usual ones are bigger and more boring every year. I had just thought it went with the trend for straighter carrots and less knobbly potatoes etc.

I may try recipes designed for plantains and see if I can adapt them for the one-size-fits-all kind we have here.

Thanks for the British zone map, which I had seen ages ago but couldn't find when I was thinking about my zone when I joined this forum, so it's good to have it again. That in fact is where I learnt that our climate is unique - being at a high latitude compared with its temperatures, which means plants will die which would survive the same low temperatures if they haven't got to last the long winter. The map puts me in zone 8b but confirms my feeling that it's a bit colder, when you turn the colours off and I'm well away from the whiter, warmer areas. Plus I'm on a windy hill in the rain-swept west. The sunniest bits of the garden are the least protected from wind so... though on the other hand, there is a small sun trap near the front door, big enough for a potted dwarf, I think. Still I'm probably mad thinking about growing a banana!
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Old 01-06-2014, 06:37 PM   #9 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: A real beginner question

If your mad we all are because most of us are not where you would think of finding a banana plant of any kind. People all over the world enjoy this pastime. It is all about the Plant, weather fruit or ornamental Just keeping the plant going from year to year for looks or fruit we love the plant and the challenge. I will still send the ornamental when it pups this year. take care Happy new year.
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Old 01-08-2014, 07:31 AM   #10 (permalink)
 
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If your mad we all are because most of us are not where you would think of finding a banana plant of any kind. People all over the world enjoy this pastime. It is all about the Plant, weather fruit or ornamental Just keeping the plant going from year to year for looks or fruit we love the plant and the challenge. I will still send the ornamental when it pups this year. take care Happy new year.
Linda
Happy New Year! OK then, we a bunch of mad nanas.

Taking down the Christmas decorations, as the 6-foot plastic tree was dismantled it occurred to me that a dwarf banana which would be happy in that spot would be about that size... but I'd like to put the armchair back where the Xmas tree was... never mind, I've done madder things than this in my life.
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Old 01-10-2014, 12:34 PM   #11 (permalink)
 
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I move stuff around every winter to fit a coconut palm lemon trees pineapples and bananas. my hubby never knows where his chair will be. lol
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Old 01-10-2014, 01:56 PM   #12 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: A real beginner question

Quote:
Originally Posted by mand View Post
So what actually is the difference between ornamental, and not ornamental?

Is it seeds, simple as that?

Is it being edible or not? And are the non-edibles actually inedible (bad for you) or just uneatable (unpalatable)? or is that, again, about seeds?

Bear in mind I don't know anything about bananas. I once made a recipe and got mush, because I didn't know "banana" meant "plantain" given where the recipe came from (this was online). I'd heard the word plantain and just vaguely knew it was some kind of foreign foodstuff... this was many moons ago though. But my understanding of varieties of banana, ways of eating them etc, is narrow but widening rapidly since I found this forum. For instance I gather you have cookers and eaters, like apples...? That's a guess, I only saw a mention of them yesterday.

My only experience of bananas different from "normal" (= what Everyone Knows, = what the shops sell) was in Jordan when they were half the size we're used to and lovely n sweet, which we assumed was because fresher than we can buy here. I didn't know you got different colours (red etc) until this week.

Now what is this ignoramus doing on a banana forum anyway, eh.
edible vs. non-edible
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Old 01-11-2014, 02:56 PM   #13 (permalink)
 
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Thank you! That is SUCH a useful explanation that I've bookmarked it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabe15 View Post
Non-edible bananas have very little pulp in them because the condition which makes edible bananas have lots of pulp is not present. Non-edible seeded bananas are not like if you were to have a normal edible banana with seeds in it. Non-edible seeded bananas are usually very small, with very little pulp and with lots of seeds.
So... I haven't seen any. Sounds like they look rather like a pomegranate when cut open? (Different shape of course. )
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