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Old 09-03-2010, 09:16 AM   #1 (permalink)
 
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Default Coconut, seeds ofdifferent varieties/hybrids?

Hi,

I was wondering if anybody of you guys is growing special varieties of Cocos nucifera, such as 'Fiji Dwarf' or 'Red Spicata Dwarf' or any other interessting vaiety which start to flower very young and don't get to tall.
I want to try out to germinate them. Seedling may be a little problem, due to regulations, but seeds are save to ship to Europe and there's no certificate required as long as it is private and only a small amount of seeds.
But any way, I would also take seedlings, because customs in Greece are not very much checking the content. I haven't had any problems with banans in the past.

Also any information on the different varieties is appreciated.

Thanks

Bernd
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Old 09-03-2010, 12:08 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Coconut, seeds ofdifferent varieties/hybrids?

I was, but it rotted a long time ago.
They are difficult to grow here in winter, because the central heating dries up the air in the room. They need high air humidity.
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Old 09-03-2010, 12:56 PM   #3 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Coconut, seeds ofdifferent varieties/hybrids?

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I was, but it rotted a long time ago.
They are difficult to grow here in winter, because the central heating dries up the air in the room. They need high air humidity.
Many, many years ago I succeded to germinate an ordinary supermarket coconut. I had a heatmat during germination and it was in humid place.
But for (today) unknown reasons it died soon after the first roots came out of the nut. I was kid these days and just tried...

Now, I want to try again.

If anybody knows a nursery who offers different varieties of coconut palms, please let me know.
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Old 09-03-2010, 02:26 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Many, many years ago I succeded to germinate an ordinary supermarket coconut. I had a heatmat during germination and it was in humid place.
But for (today) unknown reasons it died soon after the first roots came out of the nut. I was kid these days and just tried...

Now, I want to try again.

If anybody knows a nursery who offers different varieties of coconut palms, please let me know.
Yup, I too germinate them from the supermarket bought seeds. Sometimes even the cultivar's name is included, but most of the rarer seeds are difficult to obtain.
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Old 09-05-2010, 04:04 PM   #5 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Coconut, seeds ofdifferent varieties/hybrids?

Just found a shop! They would ship me two fresh Samoan (Fiji) Dwarf coconut seeds!
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Old 09-05-2010, 04:18 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Just found a shop! They would ship me two fresh Samoan (Fiji) Dwarf coconut seeds!
Provided that you give them big and wide enough pot, they could even reach optimal size in your climate... I wonder if they could fruit though.
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Old 09-05-2010, 05:19 PM   #7 (permalink)
 
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Provided that you give them big and wide enough pot, they could even reach optimal size in your climate... I wonder if they could fruit though.
They grow on the Canary Islands at various beaches, but nearly never fruit there (as I read on the web), so I doubt that my climate will be ideal. The Canary Islands have much warmer winters. Lows are around 15 °C there. So this makes at least zone 10 - 11. I'm in 9 and we get some freezes and at least three months with 'cold' weather in total.

But it'll make a nice plant in a pot for the summer on the balcony. May - Sept. should be fine for growing it outdoors and maybe it'll survive a few years.
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Old 09-05-2010, 06:51 PM   #8 (permalink)
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They grow on the Canary Islands at various beaches, but nearly never fruit there (as I read on the web), so I doubt that my climate will be ideal. The Canary Islands have much warmer winters. Lows are around 15 °C there. So this makes at least zone 10 - 11. I'm in 9 and we get some freezes and at least three months with 'cold' weather in total.

But it'll make a nice plant in a pot for the summer on the balcony. May - Sept. should be fine for growing it outdoors and maybe it'll survive a few years.
Yup, I've read about the Canary Islands coco palms too. Shame that they can't fruit, but it's surprising they can grow there at all. Those islands are not what I would call humid subtropical climate, it's rather dry there.
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Old 09-06-2010, 12:45 AM   #9 (permalink)
 
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Yup, I've read about the Canary Islands coco palms too. Shame that they can't fruit, but it's surprising they can grow there at all. Those islands are not what I would call humid subtropical climate, it's rather dry there.
Not all of them are dry. Lanzerote (135 mm annual prec.) and Fuerteventura are very dry, but going further west, they get greener, especially on the North-East coasts due to the Trade Winds.
La Palma, the westermost islands is also called the 'green island'. It get's almost 600 mm annual rain. Some parts of this island get up to 1000 mm annualy.

But most of the rain is falling in winter, so they're at least summer dry. My place in Thessaloniki gets about 450 mm annual rain.
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Old 09-06-2010, 02:07 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Not all of them are dry. Lanzerote (135 mm annual prec.) and Fuerteventura are very dry, but going further west, they get greener, especially on the North-East coasts due to the Trade Winds.
La Palma, the westermost islands is also called the 'green island'. It get's almost 600 mm annual rain. Some parts of this island get up to 1000 mm annualy.

But most of the rain is falling in winter, so they're at least summer dry. My place in Thessaloniki gets about 450 mm annual rain.
I read some time ago in one of Gabe15's links to tropical agroforestry, that coco palms are best utilized in climates with annual precipitation exceeding 1000mm. They even like much more humid and wet conditions, so that's why I guessed that Grand Canaria was a dry place to choose.
Prolonged drought is less of a problem for coco palms than prolonged cold.
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Old 09-06-2010, 02:22 AM   #11 (permalink)
 
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Prolonged drought is less of a problem for coco palms than prolonged cold.
Yes, that's what I heard, too. Heat seems to be more important than the rain to coconut palms.
We'll see. The variety I ordered is not any different to the others regarding temperatures and water demand, but it should grow slower, flower earlier (if possible here anyway) and just reach a maximum height of 30 ft, but usually less, not even 20 ft. That's still to big for a potted plant in normal home, but maybe I can keep it for a longer time...
And they'll love the summers here. A lot of heat!
My mean minimum temperatures from May - Sept. are usually high enough, above 18°C, with just a few exceptions at the beginning of May and the end of Sept.. Only a few times, and usually just for a few hours the temperatures can drop lower than 15 °C at the start or end of summer period. Mean max. temps are over 25°C in May/Sept. and more of course in between.
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Old 09-06-2010, 04:15 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Yes, that's what I heard, too. Heat seems to be more important than the rain to coconut palms.
We'll see. The variety I ordered is not any different to the others regarding temperatures and water demand, but it should grow slower, flower earlier (if possible here anyway) and just reach a maximum height of 30 ft, but usually less, not even 20 ft. That's still to big for a potted plant in normal home, but maybe I can keep it for a longer time...
And they'll love the summers here. A lot of heat!
My mean minimum temperatures from May - Sept. are usually high enough, above 18°C, with just a few exceptions at the beginning of May and the end of Sept.. Only a few times, and usually just for a few hours the temperatures can drop lower than 15 °C at the start or end of summer period. Mean max. temps are over 25°C in May/Sept. and more of course in between.
Not in the continental Greece, but on the islands, people are trying different coco varieties even know. You can find more info by searching the palmtalk.org site... lots of great articles and info...

Coco is the holy grail of palms, so people are pushing palms' limits...
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Old 09-06-2010, 05:22 AM   #13 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Coconut, seeds ofdifferent varieties/hybrids?

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Not in the continental Greece, but on the islands, people are trying different coco varieties even know. You can find more info by searching the palmtalk.org site... lots of great articles and info...

Coco is the holy grail of palms, so people are pushing palms' limits...
I'll do some more research and thanks for poining out to palmtalk.org.

Pushing plant's limits is always dangerous and may (often) result in death - especially if you push the holy grail.
And the recent crosses of Cocos haven't brought much experience so far. If I remember right there's a Butia x Cocos or Cocos x Butia, but the plants are still small. The real holy grail would be cold hardy coconut palm
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Old 09-06-2010, 06:04 AM   #14 (permalink)
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I'll do some more research and thanks for poining out to palmtalk.org.

Pushing plant's limits is always dangerous and may (often) result in death - especially if you push the holy grail.
And the recent crosses of Cocos haven't brought much experience so far. If I remember right there's a Butia x Cocos or Cocos x Butia, but the plants are still small. The real holy grail would be cold hardy coconut palm
Yes, it is among the newest threads... this cross. Also, somebody suggested that cross with Syagrus might be more viable.

I googled back Gabe's link and found for you this website he posted here some time ago.
It's a very nice reference site for any (sub)tropical horticulturalist.
Scroll down and find Cocos nucifera. There's lots of info in a very aesthetically and informationally pleasing way.
Also citruses...

www.traditionaltree.org
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Old 09-06-2010, 11:33 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: Coconut, seeds ofdifferent varieties/hybrids?

Maybe to effectively conclude the information and links in this thread, I should also give link to this interesting image. It's not 100% right, but can be used as a reference... natural coconut distribution map

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Old 09-06-2010, 03:59 PM   #16 (permalink)
 
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Good luck to you, Bernd. Wish I could try that here in zone 7! Sigh.... And thanks for the map, Jack.
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Old 09-06-2010, 04:25 PM   #17 (permalink)
 
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Good luck to you, Bernd. Wish I could try that here in zone 7! Sigh.... And thanks for the map, Jack.
I'll keep you guys posted as soon as I receive the nuts and - more important - there is some success!!!
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