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Old 09-12-2006, 07:17 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Mail what are you using for potting soil?

Hi, I have been using Miracle-Gro potting soil for allmy plants. The palms and cannas seem to thrive in it, but it seems to dry right up Quickly with my potted basjoos. I think It is making me overwater them. What are you using for a potting soil formula? All help apreciated!
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Old 09-12-2006, 07:23 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: what are you using for potting soil?

I use Miracle-Gro potting mix too and I do not think you can over water them. I have mine outdoors right now, though they'll come in for winter.

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Old 09-12-2006, 11:30 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: what are you using for potting soil?

I use nothing but Miracle-Grow also!! I agree with Zac, I don't believe you can overwater them, when you have a real porous soil mixture like M-G.

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Old 09-13-2006, 07:03 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Smile Re: what are you using for potting soil?

THanks for your advice guys, I will continue to use it.
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Old 09-13-2006, 08:55 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: what are you using for potting soil?

I have been invited to post my comment about miracle gro potting soil, so please don't think I am being disagreeable. I am just speaking from my own experience in central Florida. And maybe some of you are in Florida, too, and your experience has been great using miracle gro. I would advise anyone to keep using what works for them. My experience has been just the opposite. I also admit I have not used it in at least 3 years. I have a nursery and have never used it on the business side of my property. I did use it for some personal plantings. Most notable was the rose bushes I had great hopes for. They already looked great. I repotted them in miracle gro and within a month they were all dead. I also used it on some gingers and some ground orchids with the same results. If that was not enough, there were dead plants brought back to the nursery. They left here healthy. The common denominator in every case was miracle gro potting soil. So my personal experience has turned me completely against it. But I love and use the liquid fertilize by miracle gro.

And just on the side, I noted later that the pictures of the plants on the bag and in the ads were of annuals. So rightly or wrongly I concluded I was using it for the wrong plants. But it just doesn't work for me.

I use the commercial soilless mix now with no fertilize added for all my plants, not just those in the nursery. And I add fertilize after they have time to settle in. But if I were buying a potting soil from the store I would probably amend it with compost, vermiculite, wood chips or whatever it needed to be arable, fast draining, but hold enough moisture for the plants.
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Old 09-13-2006, 09:02 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Thumbs up Re: what are you using for potting soil?

Thank you TE, I have found all comments and opinions are welcome on this forum. Welcome t the forum, I am new here myself. It is a lively forum compared to most.
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Old 09-13-2006, 01:45 PM   #7 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: what are you using for potting soil?

I also use Miracle Gro potting soil, but do use the cheap walmart potting soil for those things that like to keep their feet wet.
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Old 09-13-2006, 02:14 PM   #8 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: what are you using for potting soil?

I have to agree with TE in the not using Miracle-Gro potting soil. I have never had any luck with anything I have used it for. I have never lost any plants, but they just never did very well. I use Fafard #2 and add hardwood bark fines to it if I want more drainage. Also like TE I love Miracle grow fertilizer and use it when I feed. I just donít like fertilizer in my soil as I like to decide when and how much fertilizer to use.

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Old 09-13-2006, 02:49 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: what are you using for potting soil?

I had not mentioned the potting soil I actually use, but it is not far from what Jane uses. I use Faford 3b. TE
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Old 09-13-2006, 03:00 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: what are you using for potting soil?

I make my own using a store bought organic compost, perlite, a small amount of chicken manure, and worm castings. I do this because it's cheaper, organic, and I control how well it drains or holds water. If you need you soil to hold water longer use more vermiculite and less Perlite. This combo has gotten all my freshly dug and potted pups through the rooting process and kept them organic along the way!
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Old 09-13-2006, 07:28 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: what are you using for potting soil?

I too had been warned against Miracle-Gro (too late since my first banana drowned in it). I currently use a mix that I believe was recommended to me on this forum: 1/3 potting soil, 1/3 perlite, and 1/3 peat moss. I've had nothing but great success and also use the same mix on all palms, bird of paradise, and other tropicals I'm growing. I'm using Scotts brand (all 3 parts) since it is readily available at Home Depot close to home.

Possibly next season I will mix up some of the organic ingredients that others are using to give the plants more nutrients, and do a side by side comparison with my current mix.

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Old 09-13-2006, 07:33 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: what are you using for potting soil?

I use Gabe's recipe he posted a cople years ago.
1/3 Peat
1/3 perlite
1/3 small pine bark mulch

I use it to pot my plants during the winter to keep them going.
It's worked well until last year when I lost 2 Basjoo, and 2 SDC to rot.

I think I'll continue with it again for another year.
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Old 09-13-2006, 07:38 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: what are you using for potting soil?

anyone know where to get large bags of pearlite?
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Old 09-13-2006, 08:17 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Unhappy Re: what are you using for potting soil?

I've had LOTS of customers call that has had problems with their tropicals, the first question I ask is are they using MG potting soil, 95% of the time their answer is yes! I do not down MG, however I personally do use the liquid fertilizer, just not the potting soil.
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Old 09-13-2006, 08:24 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: what are you using for potting soil?

You can get large bags of Perlite from any greenhouse/ nursery supplier.

I get my Fafard Pro mix and Perlite from

http://www.carlinsales.com/

BTW ....... the correct name for the Miracle grow and others is Potting Mix.

You do not want potting soil it is just about useless for fast growing tropical giants . The only thing worse is totally useless Top Soil.

Then you end up adding compost,bark,vermiculite etc to beef it up .
MG or other brands of potting MIX are made only from these additives to begin with.

If you want to lighten up your Potting Mix you can add some vermiculite or perlite. Be careful which you choose .
Verm holds water but Perlite does not.
These 2 additives will not change the nutritional profile of your chosen Potting Mix.
Adding peat, compost or composted manure will change the profile.
heeeeeeeeeee, fell off my soap-box ........... I'm outta here
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Old 09-13-2006, 09:37 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Default Re: what are you using for potting soil?

M M My Momma says, she says, Miracle Gro is of the Devil! But I gots some high quality H2O.

I custom mix what I use. Compost, vocanic sand, a smiggen of bentonite clay, perlite, composted manure, vermicompost, nosy people, etc... Since I stopped using MG, I stopped killing plants all the time. Funny, huh? Building up a soil foodweb in your soil whether in a container or in your garden makes for a far happier plant than some chemical salts that lack most of what plants need. This includes leveraging the strengths of helpers like mycorrhizal fungus, companions and mulch, even in containers. Peat is not a good choice either - lacks in nutrition seriously not to mention contributes to the destruction of our bogs. Even coir can be problematic - few coconut plantations are sustainable - they're planted at the expense of native jungles and are rarely organically cultivated. So - compost is king! Get a pile or bucket going!



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Old 09-13-2006, 10:31 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Default Re: what are you using for potting soil?

I have never had "Miracle Grow Potting Soil" to kill a Plant??? I have grew some Monster Banana Pups in nothing but MGPS!! I really like it alot myself. I have used it for about 10 years and to my knowledge it has never killed a plant or harmed one.

One of the top Banana Plant sellers(Ted Taylor, of GreenEarth Inc.) on Ebay, actually recommends you to use "Miracle Grow Potting Soil" to pot the plants he sends you!! Just my 2 cents worth.



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Old 09-14-2006, 01:41 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Default Re: what are you using for potting soil?

And one of the largest seed producers in the world recommends that you use GMO seeds and Roundup. Not my bag, personally. I'm sure Ted is a smart guy and all - he helped me with identification of one of my nanners after all. But I believe that MG fert is damaging to the ecosystem and largely ineffective and unnecessary in a good organic regimen, and I don't support MG by purchasing other products they produce like their soil, which I suspect, of course, is full of MG. They supposedly have an "organic" soil too, but trust is an issue there. I lost quite a few cacao trees to MG (used according to their instructions, naturally) before I stopped using it and used mycorrhizal fungus, molasses and fish emulsion and later repotted into rich compost based soil with remarkable and nearly miraculous results - which began my journey down the Organic Path (well, I believe the USDA screwed the pooch on the term "Organic", let's just say, Ecologically Friendly). No salt buildup problems, very happy and diverse soil - lotsa happy earthworms in it - and happy plants. I'll stick with DIY because it works for me, just as MG works for you.

Personal choice, mind you. No judgement. And... they're the Devil!!!!

Be well,
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Originally Posted by Frankallen View Post
I have never had "Miracle Grow Potting Soil" to kill a Plant??? I have grew some Monster Banana Pups in nothing but MGPS!! I really like it alot myself. I have used it for about 10 years and to my knowledge it has never killed a plant or harmed one.

One of the top Banana Plant sellers(Ted Taylor, of GreenEarth Inc.) on Ebay, actually recommends you to use "Miracle Grow Potting Soil" to pot the plants he sends you!! Just my 2 cents worth.



Frank
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Old 09-14-2006, 07:50 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Default Re: what are you using for potting soil?

ProMix HP is the best one I've found so far. It already has the increased perlite levels in it, so it drains well and doesn't hold too much moisture. It's balanced, doesn't compact easily over time, and it has a small starter charge of fertilizer, and ph balanced. The only complaint I have with it is that it's lightweight, so plants tend to get top heavy and tip easily.

Even with it, be careful how much you water a potted banana in the winter! and don't overpot, keep the roots crowded for winter so they dry out faster.

I agree that Miracle gro soil is worthless for aeration of roots. Once you wet it out, if you live in a humid climate, or have it in a humid greenhouse, it takes FOREVER to dry out. It's fine here for mid-summer potting of containers that are in full sun, but don't even think about using it in the fall or winter in Indiana unless you cut it 50/50 with perlite. Don't cut it with bark and then pot it up for a long term plant, because that changes the ph of your mix over time as the bark decomposes, it ties up the nitrogen and you'll end up with very light green, spindly thin weak growth, unless you change the ph of your watering/fertilizing water. If you have a lot of plants, unless you mixed all the soil at the same ratio with bark, then you have a lot of different ph levels to adjust. Too much work!

And I would love to go organic in my greenhouse. Just give me the name of a fertilizer that won't run off the customers with the smell, that I can apply in a convenient way (and that I can actually afford-that would be a nice bonus!), a soil that drains properly for long term production, and some pesticides that actually kill more bugs than leaves.

My 2 cents worth!
Sandy @ Northern Tropics
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Old 09-14-2006, 10:24 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Default Re: what are you using for potting soil?

Heh. Fish emulsion only stinks if you don't like the smell of rotting fish. Okay - the Alaska stuff smells for a couple of days - it can be applied Friday evening and should be okay by Monday morning. I have had critter problems when using it tho - seems like coons, possums, rats and mice like to root around in soil that's been freshly watered with the stuff, so make sure you've effectively excluded them.

Nevertheless, the best "fertilizer" is the soil you use. Nothing beats good compost for nutrient value to a plant. Lava sand contains trace amounts of iron (the red stuff) and potash and also functions similar to powderized charcoal by giving bacteria a place to hold onto while it's processing nutrients in the soil. A little rock phosphate, a bit of New Jersey greensand (the Texas stuff is worthless), and mycorrhizal fungus to start. Fish meal doesn't smell once it's mixed with the soil, and there's also blood meal and bone meal. Heck, coffee grounds and eggshells are actually good fertilizers! And there's the good ol diluted molasses! Boosts nitrogen levels in the soil, adds trace minerals and carbon and in at least one test in a Hawaiian papaya plantation reduced pathogenic nematode infection significantly. Don't over-apply, of course. And, did I say compost? Not that bark-filled garbage that Lowe's sells - but classic home-made stuff comprised of a good balance of greens and browns. Of kitchen scraps, yard clippings, manure, leaves, etc all mixed up and cooked real good. After using that stuff, you'll wonder why you ever used peat... I've also planted inoculated clover in with some of my containers. Can't say the results were spectacular, but it does diversify the soil foodweb somewhat. May try sugarsnap peas this winter - at the very least I'll get a nice harvest. And there's vermicompost. My plants go gaga over that stuff. It's especially easy if you live close to a Charbucks... oops, Starbucks too - redworms love coffee grounds. The resulting vermicompost is fairly nuetral too, interestingly. You can apply it as a topdressing and water it in, or you can use it to make an aerated humus tea - I use some fresh vermicompost and a bit of molasses and strongly aerate it for 24 hours and both drench the soil and apply as a foliar spray. If it smells like rotten fish, discard it - it went anearobic. Should smell like an earthy wine.

As to pest control - I see more warnings on non-organic labels about possible leaf damage than on organic solutions. Regardless, aphids and mites can be washed off with a regular spraying of water - something I do for my taro. Simple boric-acid soaked grits works great as a bait for ants. Caterpillars respond well to hand-picking. Grasshoppers too if you get them early in the morning. Haven't had any borer problems, but organic soaps are no worse than non-organic soaps. I also encourage the likes of spiders, mantids and other predators too. They work for you full time all the time. I'm always seeing a jumping spider with an insect - their ambush tactics must be seen to be believed. In the warm season, paper wasps are great for caterpillar problems. Not that all caterpillars are a problem in my view - I like butterflies. Chickens, guinea fowl and peafowl are excellent for grasshopper and cricket control and even snake control (tho I love my snakes). I have tried liquid seaweed on mites, but can't say whether it was the liquid seaweed or the moisture that drove them off. Plants didn't complain either way tho. Very effective solutions are there. It's better to target the pest than to carpet-bomb - helps make sure beneficials aren't killed in the process.

The biggest roadblock to going organic is personal preconceptions, I think. Standing on the precipice of the unknown when you're already comfortable with what you're currently using. Once the change is made, however, it's life as usual...

Be well,
Mike

Quote:
Originally Posted by sandy0225 View Post

And I would love to go organic in my greenhouse. Just give me the name of a fertilizer that won't run off the customers with the smell, that I can apply in a convenient way (and that I can actually afford-that would be a nice bonus!), a soil that drains properly for long term production, and some pesticides that actually kill more bugs than leaves.

My 2 cents worth!
Sandy @ Northern Tropics
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