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Old 06-05-2019, 12:42 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Unhappy Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

So this winter I had a variegated TaNee about 8ft in a 55+ gal pot all summer. After cutting, it was about 5ft in a 55+ gal pot. It was kept indoors at 70F, but I let it dry out too much and it lost 2 pups due to rot. It's back outside right now and the mother stem has only pushed out a fraction of a leaf about 1 foot long. I'm assuming the roots are f***** up. So, should I sever all roots to the corm and replant, or leave as is? "As is" means little to no growth. Something is clearly wrong. Maybe just dig up to see what's going on with the corm? Please let me know. Thank you! I feel like I could be wasting time by doing nothing.
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Seeking: Musa Itinerans var. xishuanbannaensis, French Red Plantain, Peekeli, and Ensete ventricosum.

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Old 06-05-2019, 05:18 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Smile Re: Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

Quote:
Originally Posted by nealnick5 View Post
So this winter I had a variegated nana Thai/Namwa/TaNee about 8ft in a 55+ gal pot all summer. After cutting, it was about 5ft in a 55+ gal pot. It was kept indoors at 70F, but I let it dry out too much and it lost 2 pups due to rot. It's back outside right now and the mother stem has only pushed out a fraction of a leaf about 1 foot long. I'm assuming the roots are f***** up. So, should I sever all roots to the corm and replant, or leave as is? "As is" means little to no growth. Something is clearly wrong. Maybe just dig up to see what's going on with the corm? Please let me know. Thank you! I feel like I could be wasting time by doing nothing.
It is still early in the season....I would inspect those roots and soil.
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Old 06-05-2019, 02:17 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

Well I dug it up.. tons of rotten roots and part of the corm bottom rotted. I'm assuming it was still recovering, so I removed the dead roots. Soil is fine.. there were a few mealworms in it though.. maybe they were only eating the dead parts. I also removed the pups since it was out of the soil anyways. Hopefully this will force it to grow new roots from the main corm again.
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Old 06-05-2019, 04:18 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

Nick,



If you didn’t do it yet, cut and eliminate the part of the corm that is rotted!....Do it but with small cuts, until you eliminate all the mush and rotted part of the corm!....Nothing will grow from the rotted part!....The corm will have more chances to grow new roots when it’s completely clean!....Also, make sure the soil is completely clean!.....No mealworms!.....







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Old 06-05-2019, 11:13 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

Exactly as Hector says! And don’t sweat it! These variegated plants can be picky! Always have a backup on standby because they do have problems now and then!

Keep it on the dry side and hopefully get some new roots to take and regrow!
Good luck!
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Old 06-06-2019, 06:37 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

OK so I examined it. I meant to specify that the rot had calloused over and hardened. Still cut it off or leave it? Also, I soaked it in a bucket of water for 3 hours to kill any mealworms that may be inside still. Now it's in full sun in a big planter pot with dry potting soil, and a tarp over the soil. Will this suffice until it regrows roots or do I need to remove the calloused bit? Also, thank you so much for your help. I have backup pups now in case all goes to s*** haha
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Old 06-07-2019, 05:05 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

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OK so I examined it. I meant to specify that the rot had calloused over and hardened. Still cut it off or leave it? Also, I soaked it in a bucket of water for 3 hours to kill any mealworms that may be inside still. Now it's in full sun in a big planter pot with dry potting soil, and a tarp over the soil. Will this suffice until it regrows roots or do I need to remove the calloused bit? Also, thank you so much for your help. I have backup pups now in case all goes to s*** haha


Nick,


You welcome!......Remove the calloused!......Next time add a teaspoon of bleach to the bucket of water for 30 minutes!....That should be enough time!....Bleach or boil water has been using on the corms in commercial plantations for years!.....





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Old 06-07-2019, 05:07 AM   #8 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

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Originally Posted by nealnick5 View Post
OK so I examined it. I meant to specify that the rot had calloused over and hardened. Still cut it off or leave it? Also, I soaked it in a bucket of water for 3 hours to kill any mealworms that may be inside still. Now it's in full sun in a big planter pot with dry potting soil, and a tarp over the soil. Will this suffice until it regrows roots or do I need to remove the calloused bit? Also, thank you so much for your help. I have backup pups now in case all goes to s*** haha

Be careful of the tarp over the soil. It can cause the soil to heat up in the sun and trap moisture from the corm. ... I suggest removing the tarp for good air circulation and set the pot in a shaded area.
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Old 06-07-2019, 06:42 AM   #9 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

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Nick,


You welcome!......Remove the calloused!......Next time add a teaspoon of bleach to the bucket of water for 30 minutes!....That should be enough time!....Bleach or boil water has been using on the corms in commercial plantations for years!.....








Hahaha ... I nearly got banned from the forum when I mentioned using bleach to clean & sterilize corms about 2 years ago. hahaha ... man how times change and we learn on the forum.
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Old 06-07-2019, 09:11 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

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Hahaha ... I nearly got banned from the forum when I mentioned using bleach to clean & sterilize corms about 2 years ago. hahaha ... man how times change and we learn on the forum.
LETS SEE JUST HOW FAST YOU CAN GET KICKED OUT OF THE FORUM WITH THIS ONE!!!!!!!

my buddy on the gulf got a banana from a friend, [gran nain] pretty nice sized one. put it in the canal because he didn't have time to plant it right away. said it turned to mush with a quickness. bananas like water right. so the longer you soak it in water the corm soaks it up but cant get rid of it.

with that said here is the part about BLEACH I have been keeping my mouth SHUT.

one of the many degrees/certifications/trainings I have is the schooling that a firefighter gets on hazardous wastes/chemicals and the handling whereov. over 30 years of recertification! check the handbooks of NIOSH and DOT on hazardous chemicals. BLEACH IS SOME NASTY S...! I wouldn't soak a corm for ONE minute much less 30. and 300 ppm where do people get that from? who has a PID or a FID in their pocket.?

NIOSH says; the exposure limit for chlorine is 0.5 ppm for 15 minutes is dangerous to life and health.

OSHA says; 1 ppm

and NIOSH SAYS; the IDLH [immediately dangerous to LIFE and HEALTH] is 10 PPM !!!!!



now I am thinking that; my skin is ALLOT tougher than a corm. and 300 ppm for 30 minutes .? rubber gloves anybody?



and before you a go tellin me I'm wrong look up; the NIOSH pocket guide for chemical hazards or the DOT pocket guide.
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Old 06-07-2019, 11:46 AM   #11 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

You are comparing industrial strength products to a Household product. Household bleach (NaOCl) is 5% to 8%.
Quote:
... Household bleach (sodium hydroxide) is not, technically speaking, considered corrosive or toxic, even if ingested. However, bleach exposure can cause irritation in the eyes, mouth, lungs and on skin. Individuals with asthma or other breathing problems are particularly susceptible. ...


And is regularly used:
  • Some water systems still use bleach injected into the water for disinfection. If you taste chlorine in drinking water, you are drinking bleach. This is the CDC instructions to disinfect drinking water: https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/pr...prayer-5302938
  • Restaurants are required by their local Health Departments to disinfect all utensils and reusable serving ware with rinse water with 200 ppm of bleach.
I agree with what you said about industrial strength bleach products; but household bleach used within reason is not a problem. Even if household bleach is used at full 8% strength. ... And I have poured full strength household bleach on corms. They are growing just fine.
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Old 06-07-2019, 11:59 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

told you I could start stir up some crap with that one.

evidently didn't check out niosh.

bleach is watered down and drinking water...well....

dare say I do not drink to much chlorinated water.

BUT YOU TELL PEOPLE TO USE BLEACH and how many say more and longer is better.
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Old 06-07-2019, 12:57 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

Wait am I the only one here who drinks bleach from the bottle? But anyways, thank you all for your help! I cut off the callous and soaked in water with a small amount of bleach for 30 min. I hope the corm did not soak up too much water. I now have it in the shaded garage in new, dry potting mix. Will it grow roots without moisture or should I water it in a few days? This poor plant probably wishes it had never belonged to me haha

Also saved the callous because it had 2 pups forming on it. Now up to 6 pups/corms (2 pups 4 corms). So if anything goes wrong, I still have plenty of backup! Thank you again for all of your help.
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Seeking: Musa Itinerans var. xishuanbannaensis, French Red Plantain, Peekeli, and Ensete ventricosum.
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Old 06-07-2019, 01:14 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

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Wait am I the only one here who drinks bleach from the bottle? But anyways, thank you all for your help! I cut off the callous and soaked in water with a small amount of bleach for 30 min. I hope the corm did not soak up too much water. I now have it in the shaded garage in new, dry potting mix. Will it grow roots without moisture or should I water it in a few days? This poor plant probably wishes it had never belonged to me haha

Also saved the callous because it had 2 pups forming on it. Now up to 6 pups/corms (2 pups 4 corms). So if anything goes wrong, I still have plenty of backup! Thank you again for all of your help.
whaaat little old pot stirrer me? poor max.
the point was be careful. I often use some different types of acids [used some today as a matter of fact]. but then knowing what you are doing with them and knowing what you know about them are 2 distinct different animals.

dry is good, shaded is good. good luck

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Old 06-07-2019, 06:20 PM   #15 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

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Originally Posted by nealnick5 View Post
Wait am I the only one here who drinks bleach from the bottle? But anyways, thank you all for your help! I cut off the callous and soaked in water with a small amount of bleach for 30 min. I hope the corm did not soak up too much water. I now have it in the shaded garage in new, dry potting mix. Will it grow roots without moisture or should I water it in a few days? This poor plant probably wishes it had never belonged to me haha

Also saved the callous because it had 2 pups forming on it. Now up to 6 pups/corms (2 pups 4 corms). So if anything goes wrong, I still have plenty of backup! Thank you again for all of your help.

Well, if you drink bleach straight, then your internal track should be clean & devoid of any small critters. ... I give the chickens a dose of bleach in their drinking water a couple of times a year.


Bac to the Nana ... I you haven't already clean the callous piece. Remove any soft black rot and plant it in course sand. May be the little pups or new ones will grow.
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Old 06-07-2019, 11:59 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

The pups/corms/corm callous are all in WET (from rain) potting soil, and the mother (5ft pseudo) is in dry potting soil in the garage. Are you saying I should plant them all in sand? I checked the Miracle Grow potting mix today after much rain, and it seemed very dry inside (AKA well-draining). I usually plant with potting mix/sand/pearlite/native dirt but got lazy. Should I do this for them, even if the potting mix seemed fairly dry in full rain? I really don't want to lose them as i paid a lot for the mother corm. The mother corm currently has no callous or dead roots.. no rot anymore... only the exposed fresh corm after cutting/soaking. I soaked it in low quantity bleach in water for 30 mins and not the mama plant is in dry potting mix in the garage. The children are in wet potting mix. I soaked them in the same mixture. Usually with nanas they heal (in my experience), but i paid $150 for the mother corm last year and can't afford to lose it. The babies are backups but are you saying I still need to redo the soil? The potting mix seemed fairly dry after major rain, but I can't take chances. I seemed to drain better than the potting mix from Brian's botanicals and from Ken's nursery. My kudzu is doing fine after all the rain in those same mixtures, consisting mostly of bark chips ("tree/shrub mixture") as Brian's and Ken's. I just don't want to lose anything and now I'm utterly paranoid haha just want the plants to survive. And about the kudzu... I know... but it's only going to be a bonsai so no worries lol I won't plant it anywhere except your backyard! All jokes aside, I just want what's best for my plants. Thank you for any help!
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Seeking: Musa Itinerans var. xishuanbannaensis, French Red Plantain, Peekeli, and Ensete ventricosum.

Last edited by nealnick5 : 06-08-2019 at 12:30 AM.
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Old 06-08-2019, 12:29 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

Nick,



As Max (edwmax) mentioned, and if you can, transplant them using coarse sand!.....I always used coarse sand and lots of perlite mix as medium for Nanas in pots!....Trust me works like a charm!....

Also, as the mother/main plant, keep the babies/nubs/pups in a dry location after transplanting them!....Initially, I always add water when transplanting Nanas to take out any air pockets traps within the transplanting medium.....Then I will add water every 6 to 7 days until I see new roots (rooting) and/or new leaves.....Then I will water normally every 2 to 3 days!....




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Old 06-08-2019, 12:50 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

Ok I will redo the potting mix! (Figured I couldn't get off so easily.. *sigh* lol) I will do this tomorrow morning. @Hmelendez how do you know when new plants are forming new roots though? Do you just lightly pull them from the soil? I'm paranoid about disturbing the roots as well. I will do whatever you guys say because I'm only a novice, accustomed to being rough when dealing with basjoos (that remain in the soil here in zone 7b). Once I learn these techniques for potted nanas, I will be the one of the ones informing other newbies of these practices! I thoroughly appreciate your help. Without you all I'd be just another gardener killing their plants! I am good with cold-hardy plants because my main trick is just excess sand.. some fertilizer.. but nanas require LOTS of nutrients.. and I have no idea how to "baby" nanas. This is really helpful as I just acquired saba, sikkimensis 'red tiger', thai black, and siam ruby. All 4-7 inch plants. I will do this for all of them. It's better to put in the work than have dead plants, so you have my blessings! Thank you so much.

Also, my zebrina suffered this same indoor drought as the TaNee, but I removed the dead earlier and have it in the shrub-tree mix. Now up to 5 pups. And I almost killed my dwarf cavendish by keeping it in the garage this winter.. recently learned it's only hardy to about 50F. The garage reached about 43-45F average. The corm is also in the tree/shrub mix and has 5 pups as well. I will do this for them too, as well as the kudzu! (God forbid I lose the kudzu.. the vine that ate the south lol)

And will keep them in the dryness until I see more signs of life. The zebrina, cavendish, and kudzu will probably be fine as is, but never hurts to be extra cautious. Thank you!!!
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Seeking: Musa Itinerans var. xishuanbannaensis, French Red Plantain, Peekeli, and Ensete ventricosum.
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Old 06-08-2019, 01:11 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

Nick,




Very simple!....Be very careful and gentle!....I start digging up, removing some of the transplanting medium (coarse sand and lots of perlite mix) around the corm/pup until I start seeing new roots!....You donít need to pull out and remove the whole plant!...Once you see any new roots formed just cover her up again!....Also, if you donít see any new roots formed yet, be patient!....Give the Nana plant more time!....Eventually she will be rooting!....

Usually I inspect the Nana corm/pup/plant for rooting (new roots formed) after 10 days from being transplanted!.....If I donít see any new roots, then I will inspect her between 8 to 10 days again!....





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Old 06-12-2019, 08:22 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nana super slow after roots dried out over winter

I followed all of your suggestions. Just waiting now. Thanks again so much. The pups are doing well outdoors and I replaced all banana plants with 50% sand, 25% pearlite, 25% potting soil *Mixed together*. And the corms have 50% sand 50% pearlite in the garage. I cannot thank you all enough. I will check the roots lightly in the next few days!!! Also passed on this knowledge to the FaceBook group Planet Musa! Just want to help other people prevent this mistake!!!
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Growing: Ensete ventricosum 'maurelli', Musa balbisiana 'Thai Black', bordelon, basjoo, Dwarf Cavendish, Dwarf Orinoco, itinerans var. itinerans, lasiocarpa, orinoco (tall), saba, Siam Ruby, sikkimensis 'Red Tiger', TaNee, zebrina, and zebrina var. gran nain.

Seeking: Musa Itinerans var. xishuanbannaensis, French Red Plantain, Peekeli, and Ensete ventricosum.

Last edited by nealnick5 : 06-12-2019 at 10:50 PM. Reason: Planet Musa, not Planet Bananas
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