More female, Less male flowers?

proletariatcsp · 05-15-2009, 01:38 AM

Has anyone experimented with a product called Dutch Master 'Reverse'? I came across this at an online hydro store, very interesting concept.

Quote:

Increases female flower formation! Dutch Master! REVERSE is a powerful tool for increasing the set of female flowers in your garden. Our unique "Phospholipids" technology not only stops unwanted flowers dead but also dramatically increases the number and set of female flowers. So put an end to all of your unwanted flower worries and get back in control with REVERSE! Part of the "Clinically Proven" program of the Dutch Master foliar sprays!
NPK: 0.007-0.018-0.02

It says that it is most usefull on dual-sex plants. The first thing that came to mind were all the fruitless males.

Patty in Wisc · 05-15-2009, 02:58 PM

"Fruitless males"

Gabe15 · 05-15-2009, 03:08 PM

Never heard of it. Sounds kinda like snake oil to me but if you want to experiment, go for it. One thing to keep in mind would be that bananas develop the flowers way before you see them, so you would need to apply it 3-6months before you are anticipating a bunch. Bananas are not like some plants whose flower sex functionality can be changed quickly, which I think this product is targeted at. Some plants that produce hermaphrodite flowers which are either only functionally male or female can be sprayed with various concoctions to turn on the functionality of the other sex (such as an increase in male flowers which in turn yields an increase in available pollen and thus more pollinated female flowers), but this type of function is not needed in bananas since pollen flow is not an issue. My suggestion for increasing the number of female flowers would be to have the plant in the ground and begin a heavy fertilizing regiment as soon as it starts growing after planting and manage the suckers and keep them to a minimum, if you really want to push them you can remove all the suckers as soon as you see them, this has the potential to create huge bunches but you sacrifice the bunch frequency since you have to wait much longer between bunches each time, but I have heard of it being done.

alpha010 · 05-15-2009, 03:09 PM

Not goin there Patty......Seems we could have the possibility of higher bunch production on edible nanners if the male sets were less.....sounds interesting and would love to see if anyone tests this out.

Shaggy

proletariatcsp · 05-16-2009, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gabe15

Never heard of it. Sounds kinda like snake oil to me but if you want to experiment, go for it. One thing to keep in mind would be that bananas develop the flowers way before you see them, so you would need to apply it 3-6months before you are anticipating a bunch. Bananas are not like some plants whose flower sex functionality can be changed quickly, which I think this product is targeted at. Some plants that produce hermaphrodite flowers which are either only functionally male or female can be sprayed with various concoctions to turn on the functionality of the other sex (such as an increase in male flowers which in turn yields an increase in available pollen and thus more pollinated female flowers), but this type of function is not needed in bananas since pollen flow is not an issue. My suggestion for increasing the number of female flowers would be to have the plant in the ground and begin a heavy fertilizing regiment as soon as it starts growing after planting and manage the suckers and keep them to a minimum, if you really want to push them you can remove all the suckers as soon as you see them, this has the potential to create huge bunches but you sacrifice the bunch frequency since you have to wait much longer between bunches each time, but I have heard of it being done.

Gabe, you make some very good points about the reality of banana genetics. I also have to agree with you on the snake oil comment as far as bunch production, but than again, the product may have some benefit for reducing heavily seeded banana fruit.

The plants probably could be genetically altered in order to produce more female flowers--even with a foliar treament--however. I know it would be more substantiated if the commercial crop industry experimented with the stuff in the field, but a couple two-or-three more hands of fruit may not justify spending more time and money applying the chemicals. In other words, it would just be interesting to see what would happen, and if for nothing else, at the least it might limit seed production?

Chris in FL.

Gabe15 · 05-16-2009, 12:01 PM

There is no need to "limit" seed production as you will not find seeds in edible bananas anyways.

alpha010 · 05-16-2009, 12:32 PM

I think Chris may mean to possibly make fruits that are inedible because of the high seed content to become edible on an acute fashion.

Gabe15 · 05-16-2009, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alpha010

I think Chris may mean to possibly make fruits that are inedible because of the high seed content to become edible on an acute fashion.

You could do something like that but adding more female flowers or taking away male flowers wouldn't do anything. The best way to a get seeded bananas to form a possibly edible fruit would be to try spraying the young developing fruits with an auxin. This has been done before to induce pulp growth in normally non-edible bananas.

alpha010 · 05-16-2009, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gabe15

You could do something like that but adding more female flowers or taking away male flowers wouldn't do anything. The best way to a get seeded bananas to form a possibly edible fruit would be to try spraying the young developing fruits with an auxin. This has been done before to induce pulp growth in normally non-edible bananas.

And how well does that work Gabe? That would be awesome......even though there are just as many edibles as "inedibles".

proletariatcsp · 05-16-2009, 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gabe15

You could do something like that but adding more female flowers or taking away male flowers wouldn't do anything. The best way to a get seeded bananas to form a possibly edible fruit would be to try spraying the young developing fruits with an auxin. This has been done before to induce pulp growth in normally non-edible bananas.

Bob, absolutely what I meant. Something in the way of Banksii I suppose, although i have only heard of that cultivar here on the forums. I'd also like to add a better description of the "Reverse" product. I am still looking for credible research, however. But I think this info will aid my exposition.

Quote:

Dutch Master Reverse uses Phospholipids that have been shown to stop male flower maturity. Dutch Master Reverse is engineered in a unique way so that is can, in most cases, stop hermaphroditic plants from exhibiting male traits and flowers.

Reverse has a fast knockdown action against already existing male flowers in addition to the prevention of male flowers forming. You can use Reverse when you want continuous flowering. Once a female flower is polinated it sets fruit or seed and the blooming stage of the plant is slowed or ended.

What does this mean? By eliminating males flowers you are eliminating seeds? By using Dutch Master Reverse you don't have to reduce your nutrient strength substantially like other products or experience the severity of plant drop that can often occur. This type of product is responsible for the marketed "seedless" varieties of cucumbers, watermelons, and other curcubitz.

ChrisP

P.S. Seedless watermelons huh? I have always wondered. But its like I asked before, just what kind of toxins are we consuming with our fruits and vegs from the grocery store? Seriously, I want to still be able to have kids one day!

05-15-2009, 02:58 PM	#2 (permalink)
Patty in Wisc tropical nut Patty in Wisc's Photo Gallery Zone: 5 Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 3,115 BananaBucks : 337,592 Feedback: 1 / 100% Said "Thanks" 2,946 Times Was Thanked 2,510 Times in 1,203 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 69 Times	Re: More female, Less male flowers? "Fruitless males" __________________ Got a lite? Patty ____ Patty in Wisc has sadly passed away 9/05/11. We will miss you Patty.

05-15-2009, 03:08 PM	#3 (permalink)
Gabe15 Moderator Gabe15's Photo Gallery Location: Oahu, Hawaii Find me on the map! Zone: 12 Name: Gabe Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 3,892 BananaBucks : 13,339,811 Feedback: 5 / 100% Said "Thanks" 1 Times Was Thanked 8,237 Times in 2,200 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 8 Times	Re: More female, Less male flowers? Never heard of it. Sounds kinda like snake oil to me but if you want to experiment, go for it. One thing to keep in mind would be that bananas develop the flowers way before you see them, so you would need to apply it 3-6months before you are anticipating a bunch. Bananas are not like some plants whose flower sex functionality can be changed quickly, which I think this product is targeted at. Some plants that produce hermaphrodite flowers which are either only functionally male or female can be sprayed with various concoctions to turn on the functionality of the other sex (such as an increase in male flowers which in turn yields an increase in available pollen and thus more pollinated female flowers), but this type of function is not needed in bananas since pollen flow is not an issue. My suggestion for increasing the number of female flowers would be to have the plant in the ground and begin a heavy fertilizing regiment as soon as it starts growing after planting and manage the suckers and keep them to a minimum, if you really want to push them you can remove all the suckers as soon as you see them, this has the potential to create huge bunches but you sacrifice the bunch frequency since you have to wait much longer between bunches each time, but I have heard of it being done. __________________ Growing bananas in Colorado, Washington, Hawaii since 2004. Commercial banana farmer, 200+ varieties.

05-15-2009, 03:09 PM	#4 (permalink)
alpha010 Metal Nanners!! alpha010 's Photo Gallery Location: Mineral Ridge, Ohio Find me on the map! Zone: 6 on arborday 5b on USDA Name: Bob aka Shaggy Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 470 BananaBucks : 136,667 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 121 Times Was Thanked 238 Times in 148 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 11 Times	Re: More female, Less male flowers? Not goin there Patty......Seems we could have the possibility of higher bunch production on edible nanners if the male sets were less.....sounds interesting and would love to see if anyone tests this out. Shaggy __________________ LOL! My house doesnt exist on the member map! Get a little Love in your life. Jump in a Mosh Pit! The only place where every emotion one person can feel will join together and express all at once.

05-16-2009, 12:01 PM	#6 (permalink)
Gabe15 Moderator Gabe15's Photo Gallery Location: Oahu, Hawaii Find me on the map! Zone: 12 Name: Gabe Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 3,892 BananaBucks : 13,339,811 Feedback: 5 / 100% Said "Thanks" 1 Times Was Thanked 8,237 Times in 2,200 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 8 Times	Re: More female, Less male flowers? There is no need to "limit" seed production as you will not find seeds in edible bananas anyways. __________________ Growing bananas in Colorado, Washington, Hawaii since 2004. Commercial banana farmer, 200+ varieties.

05-16-2009, 12:32 PM	#7 (permalink)
alpha010 Metal Nanners!! alpha010 's Photo Gallery Location: Mineral Ridge, Ohio Find me on the map! Zone: 6 on arborday 5b on USDA Name: Bob aka Shaggy Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 470 BananaBucks : 136,667 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 121 Times Was Thanked 238 Times in 148 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 11 Times	Re: More female, Less male flowers? I think Chris may mean to possibly make fruits that are inedible because of the high seed content to become edible on an acute fashion. __________________ LOL! My house doesnt exist on the member map! Get a little Love in your life. Jump in a Mosh Pit! The only place where every emotion one person can feel will join together and express all at once.

Members currently in the chatroom: 0
	The most chatters online in one day was 17, 09-06-2009. No one is currently using the chat.

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)