GreenFin

I feel your pain on the cold snap. Forecast here called for a low of 6F Saturday night, with some other nights in the teens.

I was in the greenhouse when the sun went down Saturday, and I've gotta say, it was pretty interesting watching the ceiling quickly freeze. Took maybe 10 minutes to go from wet to frozen and frosty. Air temp got down to a low of about 40F inside. Cavendishes are yellowing, but the Dwarf Namwah and Raja Puri are still all green and are trying to push out buds.

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Set out runnin', but I'll take my time; a friend of bananas is a friend of mine.

www.GreenFinGardens.com

jbyrd88888

I think mother nature has been raping my lil babies at night
It is obvious when a banana plants center leaf STOPS growing and surgery is necessary. Well I got tired of loosing leafs so here is what is being currently implemented.

No fire hazard here, whatcha talkin'bout?

I realize grow will cease and start deterioration under 50° Plastic is to trap the warm air being directed from two available 700watt heaters. Heat-mat temp has performed right so far.

We live and learn. Tomatoes are toast but I got a few good ones.

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■□■ J-Bert's Nana Grow Log ○●○
●○● UPDATED 6-21-2015 ■□■

GreenFin

It's a real challenge for zone-pushers to create an environment that bananas can flourish in at this time of year. Yours are lucky to be in the hands of a Man of Action* with a can-do attitude!

(*hopefully those actions won't include "electrocution" or "fire-starting" lol)

__________________
Set out runnin', but I'll take my time; a friend of bananas is a friend of mine.

www.GreenFinGardens.com

Snookie

LOL 10-4 Hope that isn't kerosene in those plastic jugs ? :}

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Mayor of Lizard Creek

jbyrd88888

Only Kerosene I have EVER seen is red? Plenty of water in 'em milk jugs
So I saw my chance at opportunity and the BLACK FRIDAY special was Irresistible.
I will test this on its Lowest setting sometime.

He said it was okay and offered to put it together for me. We left out an extension that added height.

We had trouble understanding the English so we just flipped it to the Spanish and looked at the pictures Legos rock

He couldn't use the tools really good but he cleans up nice.

If anything this now provides me with a second backup just in-case of electrical failure.
I have never owned one of these any precautions? I might read the instructions later...

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■□■ J-Bert's Nana Grow Log ○●○
●○● UPDATED 6-21-2015 ■□■

Snookie

10-4

Thanks for the tip on the heater on sale:]

PS I like your help with assembly of the heater, I got a helper just like dat:}



Only this stuff down south:

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Mayor of Lizard Creek

ez

Propane patio heaters produce carbon monoxide please be careful. Maybe you should buy a carbon monoxide detector.


• CARBON MONOXIDE HAZARD

• This heater is a combustion appliance. All combustion appliances produce carbon monoxide (CO) during the combustion process. This product is designed to produce extremely minute, non-hazardous amounts of CO if used and maintained in accordance with all warnings and instructions. Do not block air flow into or out of the heater.

• Carbon Monoxide (CO) poisoning produces flu-like symptoms, watery eyes, headaches, dizziness, fatigue and possibly death. You can't see it and you can't smell it. It's an invisible killer. If these symptoms are present during operation of this product get fresh air immediately!

• For outdoor use only .

• Never use inside house, or other unventilated or enclosed areas.

• This heater consumes air (oxygen). Do not use in unventilated or enclosed areas to avoid endangering your life.

Propane patio heater/pdfImages/9b/9b3f184b-8a2a-40ea-996e-f9b14048b281.pdf

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Abnshrek

CO2 feed them plants, just stay out... unless your airing it out.. :^)

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I'm a Nannerhead :^)

ez

This is true, don't close the door behind you and stay inside for long periods of time while the heater is turned on. Carbon Monoxide (CO) in concentrations as low as 700ppm can be life-threatening and Carbon Dioxide (CO2) is less dangerous but at 80,000ppm (8%) Carbon Dioxide can kill you.

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GreenFin

I've thought a lot about this, and I've got a cool solution, but I'm concerned about the legality of offering advice, especially if you were to have an accident.

I think I'm alright so long as I just tell you what I would do, but even so I want to beg you to please be safe! I recommend getting professional safety advice, and I must strongly stress that I am not advising you and am merely saying what I would do/have done.
________________________________________________________________ ___________


Here's what I'd do:

Use 2 of the cheap $13 wading pools (5' diameter). Set them up side by side (just a few inches apart) on a leveled surface. Connect the wading pools with two separate 1" tubes by cutting two 1" holes, side by side, into each wading pool about 80% of the way to the top (make holes large enough for tubing but small enough to hold it snugly). One of these will carry water from pool1 to pool2, the other will return it. This circulation will be constant and will be powered by mere air.

The first tube should be shaped like a horizontal capital L, like this:

**|***|**
*

Those vertical bars in the diagram represent the edges of the wading pools (the 3 asterisks in the middle are between the pools). The 'downturn' on the far left is because you're creating an airlift: you'll run your bubbler's air hose into the bottom of that 'L' leg, where the air will rise, pushing some of pool1's water up and across the tube into pool2. When that happens, the rising water level in pool2 will instantly cause an equal amount of water to be pushed through the 2nd tube (a.k.a. the 'return tube') back into pool1, thereby creating a constant cycle powered entirely by your aerator. The 2nd tube can be totally horizontal (no need for the laying down L shape because no need to create a 2nd airlift) and would look like this:

**|***|**


I would take all the tropical plants and put them into pool2. I'd buy a $35 Allied 1000W bucket heater and safely secure it in pool1 (after they're both filled with water). To keep the pots from flooding, put them in individual waterproof plastic trash bags before setting them into the pool. I'd want the water to cover as much of the side area of the pots as possible.

I'd then set up a short plastic tent (much like you did) over these pools. Covered at night, uncovered during day (don't want to cook them, plus want them to get full light).

I would turn the bucket heater on at night and turn it off during the day, which should allow me to keep the water around 80F all the time. That 80F water would keep the roots of the potted plants at almost 80F all the time. The hottest water molecules would evaporate off the tubs as a nice warm steam that would rise up, enveloping the stems and leaves of the plants. The tent would create a sauna effect by trapping the steam.

Why 2 pools? First, I've done something like this before, and I think the bucket heater would heat up 1 pool too much if left on overnight (especially in a cramped pool with little water since the pots have displaced most of it). You could solve that by using a timer to cycle the heater on and off throughout the night, or you could add enough extra water mass that the heater just can't manage to overheat it in a night of constant use. IMO that would require 2 of these 5' wading pools (might turn out to be 3 in your environment, but I'd start with 2). Second, you may have enough plants that they won't all fit in just one pool, and may need to set some in pool1 as well as pool2.

Note that these bucket heaters are not designed for this purpose. When used long-term (weeks straight), they'll accumulate lime deposits. If those deposits are not regularly cleaned (by chiseling or dissolving in some sort of lime-away solution), the heating element can and will overheat and rupture, thereby releasing electric current directly into the water. That's extremely hazardous and has happened to me 3 times (mainly because I did a poor job of maintenance). Twice I noticed because the fish got stunned; once I got zapped myself. I would not recommend zapping oneself!!

I'd take the patio heater back for a refund and take the air heaters out.

With this method, the plants should be able to not just survive, but flourish all winter long

__________________
Set out runnin', but I'll take my time; a friend of bananas is a friend of mine.

www.GreenFinGardens.com

ez

There was an article I've read were they have used basically the same technique the only difference is no tubing they used a 500 Watt aquarium heater and a power head (submersible pump) for water circulation.

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GreenFin

Nice, a 500W heater would probably allow for pool2 to be eliminated, since the heater may not overheat the water.

I'd then use the aerator to create circulation within the one pool; using multiple bubble stones should be good enough.

__________________
Set out runnin', but I'll take my time; a friend of bananas is a friend of mine.

www.GreenFinGardens.com

stevelau1911

Last night my greenhouse got down to 23.8F while the outdoor temperature was 10.1F, and I usually don't heat it at all. I do however grow strictly temperate plants, mostly bamboos in there so I don't turn on my paraffin lamps unless it can get below 14F in there. Last year, I never had to turn on any heat. I don't have that many bananas so I store them right in the attic which never gets below 40F.

One thing I like about my unheated greenhouse is the a majority of the time, the temperatures get stuck in the 32-55F range which is fairly idea for vernalization which usually gets them taking off much quicker in the spring.

Here are some pictures of it.



I solarize the floor too so it can get warmer during the winter.






Here's the exterior.

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I'm in zone 6 upstate NY, specialize in growing temperate cold hardy bamboos(mainly phyllostachys) and starting to get into bananas.

my picture website is http://www.flickr.com/photos/31489820@N02/

http://stevespeonygarden.blogspot.com/

GreenFin

Awesome, Steve! Great job with your greenhouse, and thanks for sharing the pics

__________________
Set out runnin', but I'll take my time; a friend of bananas is a friend of mine.

www.GreenFinGardens.com

sunfish

Whats wrong with a good elec. heater w/fan and a thermostat.45f in the night is plenty warm for tropicals

jbyrd88888

I think Ima try to do something to keep at least 50 degrees.

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■□■ J-Bert's Nana Grow Log ○●○
●○● UPDATED 6-21-2015 ■□■

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Abnshrek

So whatcha going to do? or what's on the table for possibilities? Welcome back.. :^)

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I'm a Nannerhead :^)

Richard

Justin - its looking good!

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RyanL

Jbyrd-
You should really think about adding bubble wrap to the walls. It really helps with insulation. You still get good light transmission and the heat from the sun during the day. One of your issues is heat is being lost so quickly on freezing nights, your heaters cant keep up. The bubble side faces the greenhouse plastic creating airspace between 2 layers of plastic. You want the largest bubble size for maximum effect.Here is what it looks like installed.


Also heating pads to warm the roots are a good idea, My temperature drops to 40F but the heating pads come on below 60F, this allows just the roots of the bananas to remain warm while the ambient temperature inside is much lower. My greenhouse has gotten to 38F while I have observed no damage and they are continuing to push out new healthy leaves. The one on the left raja puri, is epically vigorous and pushing out a new leaf(slower, but still growing and healthy)


This image shows the heating pad below the plants, the pup just started coming up from my Williams a few days ago.