Clean Coarse Sand

PR-Giants · 07-07-2015, 12:44 PM

The blocks and rock both protect the moisture at the surface under them and the roots will seek out that area.

Keys : air, temperature, and moisture.

DEFINITION IMPORTANT

First of all, clean sand, as described by soil scientists through a sieve analysis, is a soil texture composed by weight of at least 25 percent very coarse, coarse and medium sand varying in size from 2.0 to 0.25 mm (millimeters), less than 50 percent of fine or very fine sand ranging in size between 0.25 and 0.05 mm, and no more than 10 percent of particles smaller than 0.05 mm. This is technical, but is the definition soil scientists use to describe clean sand.

A sieve analysis is not really needed on the job, as the fruit jar test is a simple way for both the installer and the inspector to test the quality of the sand. Clean sand can easily be determined by placing exactly 2 inches of the sand in the bottom of a quart fruit jar. Then fill the jar three-fourths full of water. Place the cover on the jar and shake the contents vigorously.

Clean Sand Explained

a.hulva@coxinet.net · 07-08-2015, 09:17 PM

This picture is of a A'eaA'e?/Maninii that I bought from PR. It was planted in Coarse sand on June 23rd. It had no growth and no roots when planted. This picture was taken July 7th. The first leaf is showing nicely. I use Humalfalfa only on starter plants, and Humalfalfa and a commercial fertilize on more mature ones. It necessary to fertilize after a week or so when using pure sand. I am a believer!!! You can believe it or not.

[url=http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=51226]

I screwed up on getting picture shown. Hope to have soon.

PR-Giants · 07-08-2015, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by a.hulva@coxinet.net

This picture is of an A'ea'e/Manini that I bought from PR. It was planted in Coarse sand on June 25th. It had no growth and no roots when planted. This picture was taken July 7th. The first leaf is showing nicely. I use Humalfalfa only on starter plants, and Humalfalfa and a commercial fertilize on more mature ones. It necessary to fertilize after a week or so when using pure sand. I am a believer!!! You can believe it or not.

PR-Giants · 07-14-2015, 10:18 AM

Beautiful photo, Congrats Al

Quote:

Originally Posted by a.hulva@coxinet.net

18 Days - July 13

Kevin2685 · 07-14-2015, 10:50 AM

Looking good Al.

Mark Dragt · 03-30-2016, 09:41 PM

After having some of my corms rot away during the winter, all my banana plants will be planted in clean course sand. I will post picts of the process as time permits.

JP · 03-31-2016, 11:16 AM

I always use a mix containing at least 50% coarse sand. Since I started doing that, my plants do great.

cincinnana · 03-31-2016, 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JP

I always use a mix containing at least 50% coarse sand. Since I started doing that, my plants do great.

I thought all your posts said 40% why 50% at this post .....???

Locally, sand is not used as a soil amendment in the horticultural community.
Mainly anything high in organic matter is used for our soil...but everyones is different.

But....... in some instances it is used....but not for Musa.
Soils are more organic than sand or fillers for Musa.
This is local in zone 5-6-7.

Mark Dragt · 03-31-2016, 10:58 PM

Myself, I am going to use the sand as a French drain around my corms. My soil drains well, but it is overloaded with organics. So it also holds quite a bit of moisture. So say I have a 3 inch corm. I will probably dig a 7-8 inch hole, and as deep. Then plant the corm surrounded by about 2 inches of sand, bottom and sides. This will allow the water to drain away from the corm. Sometimes in the spring and fall it will rain for several weeks straight. During that time it is not warm out. Just trying to move the water away from the corm.

Mark Dragt · 03-31-2016, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cincinnana

I thought all your posts said 40% why 50% at this post .....???

Locally, sand is not used as a soil amendment in the horticultural community.

But....... in some instances it is used....but not for Musa.
Soils are more organic than sand or fillers for Musa.
This is local in zone 5-6-7.

I think from time time everyone tweeke their soil mix.

I am sure you get some cold rainy spells. How do you keep your corms from rotting.

JP · 04-01-2016, 05:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cincinnana

I thought all your posts said 40% why 50% at this post .....???

Locally, sand is not used as a soil amendment in the horticultural community.

But....... in some instances it is used....but not for Musa.
Soils are more organic than sand or fillers for Musa.
This is local in zone 5-6-7.

My posts usually say at least 40-50% coarse sand. It's possible that I might have occasionnally have said at least 40% but at that point I don't think it'll make a big difference. I do my mixes by the eye. Everything is approximatly mesured and adjusted when mixing.
As long as the horticultural community, I think everybody should consider coarse sand. It works well for me. I grow in containers and the usual mixes give me bad results and I loose plants with them. Everything I plant is planted with my recipe and it works. I have several nanners and fig trees, few cactus, rose apple, a few murraya koenijii, pineapples, tamarind and mandevillas. With the climate we have, the plants spend a lot of time inside my house under fluorescent tubes. I find my mix very forgiving when you overwater. I even put 3\4 inch gravel at the bottom of my pots. It drains and gives weight in case of windy days.

subsonicdrone · 04-01-2016, 10:52 AM

i watched a documentary on sand recently
round fine sand is wind blown and sand desirable for cement is coarse
apparently entire beaches are disappearing due to offshore sand dredging
and even carried away by bucket from shore
i spend a lot of time at the beach so i was really digging that doc

gmichael403 · 04-01-2016, 07:46 PM

Is there a particular brand of coarse sand that is recommended from a big box store? Ive seen bags that state washed all purpose/coarse sand but it does not seem very coarse..still seems to be pretty fine compared to some pics I see of corms potted in this media. Perhaps the pics make the sand appear to be larger granuals than what they really are.

JP · 04-01-2016, 08:13 PM

All purpose should be fine.

gmichael403 · 04-01-2016, 08:21 PM

Great..thanks!

Mark Dragt · 04-01-2016, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmichael403

Is there a particular brand of coarse sand that is recommended from a big box store? Ive seen bags that state washed all purpose/coarse sand but it does not seem very coarse..still seems to be pretty fine compared to some pics I see of corms potted in this media. Perhaps the pics make the sand appear to be larger granuals than what they really are.

I am making my own, so brand I do not know. Just do the jar test with it. If it doesn't pass the jar test, you can still sift more of the fines out.

bananimal · 04-01-2016, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cincinnana

I thought all your posts said 40% why 50% at this post .....???

Locally, sand is not used as a soil amendment in the horticultural community.

But....... in some instances it is used....but not for Musa.
Soils are more organic than sand or fillers for Musa.
This is local in zone 5-6-7.

Hey guy ---- when are you coming on down again? Last year I hooked up with a organic grower in Palm City - right on the Martin Hwy. He has naners from Keith growing like gangbusters. Morado, ARH, Patupi, Tigua and Williams, etc, all growing fast with all that manure and stuff. Drop me a PM.

Dan the Bananamal

Juicy Bananas · 04-01-2016, 11:11 PM

I was curious as to how well the sand holds nutrients? I notice you are using bio-char as well. Do you get a lot of rain where you are? I seem to have similar growth rates with cleaned corms in a home made media.

PR-Giants · 04-02-2016, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cincinnana

Locally, sand is not used as a soil amendment in the horticultural community.

But....... in some instances it is used....but not for Musa.
Soils are more organic than sand or fillers for Musa.
This is local in zone 5-6-7.

The Niche Nursery: Coarse Sand is Horticultural Gold.

Propagating sand, horticultural sand, sharp sand, quartz sand & coarse sand are all interchangeable terms that describe the subject material.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard

The suggestion to add peat and sand is good. Rinse the sand before you use it to remove any salts, and beware that products sold as "playground sand" often contain herbicides and pesticides. If you can find paver pack base (step 1) that is labeled "sharp sand", that is ideal and often inexpensive by the bag or in bulk.

PR-Giants · 04-02-2016, 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bananimal

Hey guy ---- when are you coming on down again? Last year I hooked up with a organic grower in Palm City - right on the Martin Hwy. He has naners from Keith growing like gangbusters. Morado, ARH, Patupi, Tigua and Williams, etc, all growing fast with all that manure and stuff. Drop me a PM.

Dan the Bananamal

Hey Bananamal ---- there's also a member in Port St Lucie growing the Morado, Goldfinger, French Red, Tigua, and a few more.

Are you still dealing with that damp off rotting problem you had for like 8 years in that highly amended sugar sand soil?

Quote:

Originally Posted by cincinnana

Of the mats I have seen in Florida all of them are in amended sugar sand soil (the local consistency) .
These were mature mats with pups, in the ground.
The amendments are high in organic matter. The growers grew this plant just as they did the other plants they had.

07-07-2015, 12:44 PM	#1 (permalink)
PR-Giants Commercial Grower Location: Florida & Greater Antilles Find me on the map! Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 4,690 BananaBucks : 5,920 Feedback: 16 / 100% Said "Thanks" 2,947 Times Was Thanked 12,838 Times in 3,764 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 3,217 Times	Clean Coarse Sand The blocks and rock both protect the moisture at the surface under them and the roots will seek out that area. Keys : air, temperature, and moisture. DEFINITION IMPORTANT First of all, clean sand, as described by soil scientists through a sieve analysis, is a soil texture composed by weight of at least 25 percent very coarse, coarse and medium sand varying in size from 2.0 to 0.25 mm (millimeters), less than 50 percent of fine or very fine sand ranging in size between 0.25 and 0.05 mm, and no more than 10 percent of particles smaller than 0.05 mm. This is technical, but is the definition soil scientists use to describe clean sand. A sieve analysis is not really needed on the job, as the fruit jar test is a simple way for both the installer and the inspector to test the quality of the sand. Clean sand can easily be determined by placing exactly 2 inches of the sand in the bottom of a quart fruit jar. Then fill the jar three-fourths full of water. Place the cover on the jar and shake the contents vigorously. Clean Sand Explained __________________ PR-Giants Photo Gallery 15,000+ Varieties Last edited by PR-Giants : 08-13-2016 at 07:39 AM.

07-08-2015, 09:17 PM	#2 (permalink)
a.hulva@coxinet.net Location: Edmond, OK Zone: 73034 Name: Al Join Date: Oct 2014 Posts: 456 BananaBucks : 52,101 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 3,694 Times Was Thanked 779 Times in 317 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 437 Times	Another testimony for using COARSE SAND This picture is of a A'eaA'e?/Maninii that I bought from PR. It was planted in Coarse sand on June 23rd. It had no growth and no roots when planted. This picture was taken July 7th. The first leaf is showing nicely. I use Humalfalfa only on starter plants, and Humalfalfa and a commercial fertilize on more mature ones. It necessary to fertilize after a week or so when using pure sand. I am a believer!!! You can believe it or not. [url=http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=51226] I screwed up on getting picture shown. Hope to have soon. Last edited by a.hulva@coxinet.net : 07-08-2015 at 09:20 PM. Reason: Posted with no picture showing.

07-14-2015, 10:50 AM	#5 (permalink)
Kevin2685 kevin2685 Location: sheridan,Indiana Find me on the map! Zone: 5 Name: kevin Join Date: Mar 2014 Posts: 244 BananaBucks : 36,195 Feedback: 1 / 100% Said "Thanks" 366 Times Was Thanked 407 Times in 142 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 18 Times	Re: Clean Coarse Sand Looking good Al. __________________ Currently growing Musa basjoo Dwarf orinico Variegated dwarf namwah Aeae Patupi Veinte cohol Musa lasiocarpa (golden lotus) Musa velutina Raja puri Mekong giant Double cavendish Super dwarf cavendish Truly tiny Musa laterita Ensete maurelli

03-30-2016, 09:41 PM	#6 (permalink)
Mark Dragt Location: Rochester,Wa Find me on the map! Zone: 8 Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 823 BananaBucks : 41,026 Feedback: 2 / 100% Said "Thanks" 3,357 Times Was Thanked 1,718 Times in 635 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 332 Times	Re: Clean Coarse Sand After having some of my corms rot away during the winter, all my banana plants will be planted in clean course sand. I will post picts of the process as time permits. __________________ Mark's Banana Forest Paradise

03-31-2016, 11:16 AM	#7 (permalink)
JP Location: Trois-Rivières, Québec Find me on the map! Zone: 4 Name: JP Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 1,227 BananaBucks : 151,275 Feedback: 3 / 100% Said "Thanks" 1,954 Times Was Thanked 1,692 Times in 817 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 304 Times	Re: Clean Coarse Sand I always use a mix containing at least 50% coarse sand. Since I started doing that, my plants do great.

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03-31-2016, 10:58 PM	#9 (permalink)
Mark Dragt Location: Rochester,Wa Find me on the map! Zone: 8 Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 823 BananaBucks : 41,026 Feedback: 2 / 100% Said "Thanks" 3,357 Times Was Thanked 1,718 Times in 635 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 332 Times	Re: Clean Coarse Sand Myself, I am going to use the sand as a French drain around my corms. My soil drains well, but it is overloaded with organics. So it also holds quite a bit of moisture. So say I have a 3 inch corm. I will probably dig a 7-8 inch hole, and as deep. Then plant the corm surrounded by about 2 inches of sand, bottom and sides. This will allow the water to drain away from the corm. Sometimes in the spring and fall it will rain for several weeks straight. During that time it is not warm out. Just trying to move the water away from the corm. __________________ Mark's Banana Forest Paradise

04-01-2016, 10:52 AM	#12 (permalink)
subsonicdrone Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 1,410 BananaBucks : 31,546 Feedback: 3 / 100% Said "Thanks" 4,772 Times Was Thanked 1,923 Times in 666 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 0 Times	Re: Clean Coarse Sand i watched a documentary on sand recently round fine sand is wind blown and sand desirable for cement is coarse apparently entire beaches are disappearing due to offshore sand dredging and even carried away by bucket from shore i spend a lot of time at the beach so i was really digging that doc

04-01-2016, 07:46 PM	#13 (permalink)
gmichael403 Location: Oklahoma Zone: 7a Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 207 BananaBucks : 22,792 Feedback: 1 / 100% Said "Thanks" 3 Times Was Thanked 285 Times in 76 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 0 Times	Re: Clean Coarse Sand Is there a particular brand of coarse sand that is recommended from a big box store? Ive seen bags that state washed all purpose/coarse sand but it does not seem very coarse..still seems to be pretty fine compared to some pics I see of corms potted in this media. Perhaps the pics make the sand appear to be larger granuals than what they really are.

04-01-2016, 08:13 PM	#14 (permalink)
JP Location: Trois-Rivières, Québec Find me on the map! Zone: 4 Name: JP Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 1,227 BananaBucks : 151,275 Feedback: 3 / 100% Said "Thanks" 1,954 Times Was Thanked 1,692 Times in 817 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 304 Times	Re: Clean Coarse Sand All purpose should be fine.

04-01-2016, 08:21 PM	#15 (permalink)
gmichael403 Location: Oklahoma Zone: 7a Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 207 BananaBucks : 22,792 Feedback: 1 / 100% Said "Thanks" 3 Times Was Thanked 285 Times in 76 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 0 Times	Re: Clean Coarse Sand Great..thanks!

04-01-2016, 11:11 PM	#18 (permalink)
Juicy Bananas Location: Big Island Zone: 10 Name: Alva Join Date: Nov 2015 Posts: 170 BananaBucks : 9,834 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 14 Times Was Thanked 259 Times in 121 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 16 Times	Re: Clean Coarse Sand I was curious as to how well the sand holds nutrients? I notice you are using bio-char as well. Do you get a lot of rain where you are? I seem to have similar growth rates with cleaned corms in a home made media.

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