Extreme Bananas

This may have been discussed before. I did a search but did not find anything on this particular topic. My apologies if this has been hashed over.

Has anyone ever successfully carried over a Musa basjoo in areas that got to 20, or more, degrees below zero with just a mulch cover of 3 or 4 inches? If the answer is no, then Basjoo is not hardy to Zone 4 or 5, and probably Zone 6. A plant's hardiness is its ability to survive an average winter low temperature. It is not based on covering with five lawn bags filled with leaves, or covering with a wooden box with an electric blanket or light bulb inside. While it is often described as hardy to Zone 4/5, WITH PROTECTION, the extensive protection required is not a normal practice. You have to be a nanner lover to make the effort. Most gardeners would let them freeze. And another requirement that I have seen is that the Basjoo should be at least three feet, or so, tall with an established root system in the ground. This is another mark against a Zone 4/5 hardiness. Plant height should not be a factor in hardiness.

I have once seen Basjoo's hardiness listed as Zone 7. This is probably more correct than the usual Zone 4 or 5. The correct listing should probably be "Hardy to Zone 7 and to Zone 4 or 5 in well-drained areas with extensive winter protection measures". But the usual is "World's Hardiest Banana Plant...25 Degrees Below Zero". Is this a marketing ploy?

I would really like to know if anyone has carried over a Basjoo with winter temperatures of 5 or 10 below zero with just a mulch layer of 3 or 4 inches. Apparently the goal is to keep the ground, and the root mat, from freezing. I would like to have a bunch of Basjoos in the yard but don't want to fill up and cart around 50 big lawn bags of leaves.


Ed

Chironex

The one thing I will say is that it is not so much the height of the pseudostem, (merely an indicator of root development) as it is the ability of the plant to become established well enough. This would seem to play a role in true hardiness.

To illustrate, let's say an acorn germinates late in the summer and doesn't have time to harden-off adequately before the first frost. Chances are that it will not return in the spring. On the other hand a more well-established seedling that germinated in spring and has established its roots better, will probably return.

Where the true zone hardiness lies, is beyond me. There is another thread talking about this same thing. Check that to see what other results have been posted.

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Scot

Gabe15

The Denver Botanic Gardens (zone 6) has M. basjoo that come back every year with just a covering of mulch, so yes, I've seen it work and it can indeed live up to it's reputation in some environments.

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Larry815

I have tried for a few years, to winter over Basjoo in Joliet, I live south of Chicago. They never come back. Another person told me they have some well established ones that do come back every year? So Im not sure?
Mine are from the first year and they dont come back, and I have also tried to over winter them in the house and leave them out side after the 2ed winter and they still dont come back?
The person I know said that hers are very big and do come back so maybe my plants are not old enough. She is spose to give me some of hers to see if i can get mine to winter over.
By the way I think my zone is 5

Bob

For the record I am NOT correcting Gabe. Still zone 6 Denver is way different for example than zone 6 New Jersey. In Denver it could get down to say 20 F with snow and be 70 the next day. I've seen it (Aroura anyway). Here I believe the cold is more consistant. So the point is you have to consider more than just zones and that certain microclimates( shelterd area next to south facing wall for example) will improve your chances of success. Keep trying , Good luck.

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austinl01

I really believe basjoo is very hardy in your area. I would go ahead and plant as many was you'd like. In the fall, leave the stems and rake your leaves around the base of the basjoos. That's all would be required really for plants that get established this spring.

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Arkansas River Valley

Average January Low: 31°F, Average August High: 92°F
Extreme Winter Lows: 5-15°F, Extreme Summer Highs: 100-112°F, Annual Precipitation: 52 inches

turtile

Zones don't work well for labeling a plants hardiness. Duration of cold, size of plant, the plant's health etc. all affect the hardiness. The climate variance within the same zone is huge. An area 1 mile away can all the difference.

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Ueberwinden

I taught a class at the extension office this past March, and one of the people that was in attendance was one of the gardeners for the Creation Museum in Peterburg, Ky. They were able to testify that their Basjoo's come back every year, and appear to be stronger each year. We are a zone 6, and I would say a cold zone 6. We reached -4 one day this past winter. In 2003 we recorder a -13 temp, so we do dip down rather cold but it isn't every year. We are actually warmer now than I can remember as a kid growing up in the 70's and early 80's. We use to get tons of snow every year and it would line the streets in piles for weeks. In the early 70's the Ohio river froze over because we remained right around 0 for over a week. I can remember people walking across the ice from Ohio to Kentucky. My kids really don't know what it is like to ride a sled because we don't get enough snow for that. They know tube riding and those discs that you can ride in minimal snow fall. I have quite a few friend here locally who grow Basjoo's also and have no problems with theirs either.

Michael

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just j

im in zone 4-5 upper wisconsin and had them come back and my temp for weeks was -20- 40 some days but had alot of protection

Bob

I dug up the corm from my overwintered basjoo yesterday. I had thought it was completely dead but surprisingly there was still a good portion of hard corm underground although not as much root development as I would have liked. I decided to plant it in a large pot along with a couple of others and will overwinter it this year indoors hoping that by starting with a larger more established corm and root system will overwinter even better the following year. I also decided that my hay bale method might not have provided enough contact with the ground as a pile of leaves would have so the insulating value was less than it should have been....live and learn.

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Sodak

Could you describe "alot of protection"??

Curious... I haven't tried to overwinter since my first failure with a small plant years ago.

Can you describe the protection, size of plant, location?

Thanks!!!

KBaron

Hello fellow ardent admirers of Musa!
The hardy Musa basjoo that I planted in my garden in Port Moody, BC has tolerated 2 months of wretchedly hard freezes as low as minus 17 celsius!

Die back this year was right to the ground, and I even protected them....

The tips began to break the surface soil last week... much to my relief!

My neighbour had a string of bananas last fall... but they never ripen in our cool maritime climate...

I look forward to the new to me site!

Happy Days to all!

Roger

Scuba_Dave

Snow actually acts as an insulator
So if there is snow all winter (or when it is cold) then there is added protection
We had a lot of snow this past winter
It was 10% colder then prior years (per some site)
Every plant/perennial I have is coming up earlier & bigger

Vickie H.

I am zone 6 Missouri. My Musa Basjoos made it throught the winter with 2 days of 4*F. I mulch my musas with 2 ft of cyprus mulch in a wire round tomato cage that we make ourselves. The cage is probably 1 1/2 foot wide. The big one did not come back buecause it rotted but 5 pups from that banana has come up. One other plant that was new last year, that my husband dug up by mistake and I had him replant came back. It also has 2 ft of cyprus mulch with a cage. It works here for us

saltydad

I have also heard the term 'root hardy' to describe those plants that behave like perennials and die back each winter. Basjoo would surely qualify.

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Scuba_Dave

As a gardener it's always been my understanding that the hardiness Zone means the plant will grow & survive the winter. To me that has always meant the plant will REGROW in the Spring. I have never considered that my Lupines or any other flowering plant would survive the winter with all its greenery etc

It means I do not have to dig the roots/corm/bulb/etc up & bring it in for the winter
Glads are supposed to be dug up & brought in here - but mine usually come back
I have steered clear (up to now) of any plants that require digging up for the winter
I now have Canna's in the ground & some bananas on the way

sandy0225

I had three out of three come back this year. One has six pups, one has five and one has the actual old stem from last year growing, and one pup about a foot away from it.
All I did is exactly what I tell people to do, cut the stem back to the height of a large bag of leaves, put about 5-6 bags of leaves around the stem in a circle, leaving a hole in the center about a foot across. Lightly place dry leaves in the center around the stub you cut off, and pile another bag over the top of the stump. Then I put a tarp over the whole thing to help it shed water and keep the wind here from blowing away.
Our lowest temp last winter was -25.
Now some people wouldn't be able to do that if you wanted to put a lot of basjoo out. So I go sparingly with them, and also landscape with plenty of annuals and perennials that look tropical in addition to the basjoo, and plug in a few tropical bananas too.
BTW, brown tarps look much better than the cheap blue ones!

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musaboru

USDA zone thing is crap, it only gives you a general idea of what the climate is like. It doesn't take into account micro-climates.

sirmoebly

Totally agree due to our weather in the US (jet steam & global warming & al gore). But makes me laugh even more when people say “ I live in zone 7a or 8b or 9d as d for dumb #%!! Everyone has there own micro climate & if it makes you feel better to say I live in ?abcd & if it makes the pain go away then I feel for you, but it doesn’t help other people that live in your area on what to grow...Ohhhh don’t get me going on sunset zones for people in the US.
USDA is a general rule no more than it states & don’t make more out of it, but to help you with a starting point on what to grow.(& what to cheat on like me!!!!)

natedogg1026

Micro climate is a big factor too. IMO. Mine come back in 6 and I just walk away from em. 8' already. Alot of it also has to do with the size of the corm. They are, quite amazing. Had Lasiocarpa come back with no protection also. Very tough.

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