Musa nagensium seeds for reference

Gabe15 · 10-19-2006, 12:49 PM

I know some members have wanted to see what M. nagensium seed really looks like, and here are some pictures for reference. You can see the the larger flat "bottom" of the seed is a normal brown but the rest of the seed is white. I should note that these seeds are also very large, for comparison is an american quarter coin (about 2.5cm), each seed is at least 1 cm in diameter I would guess.

Zac in NC · 10-19-2006, 01:17 PM

Cool. Looks liek you got the seeds in that you were expecting.

Zac

barna · 10-19-2006, 01:51 PM

Sunshine-seeds (link in german) and Tropengarten (link in german). are offering a supposed 'true form'

I ordered mines last year from Tropengarten and I have grow a couple of plants

They were supposed to be 'pure nagensium' but unfortunately i can remember how they look.

Does somebody ordered from them?. Do they look like the ones posted by Gabe?

mrbungalow · 10-19-2006, 02:19 PM

Wow! Looks exactly like what I got from Phil at Trebrown.. I dont think your seeds look much like the description at "the musacea" here, so I am still confused: http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~drc/mnagensium.htm

Here are some pics of the seeds I have obtained, from Seedman and Trebrown.

[IMG]

[/IMG]

[IMG]

[/IMG]

Notice how Trebrowns seeds are prickly and worty while Seedmans seeds are smooth and a bit larger.

Erlend

griphuz · 10-21-2006, 01:50 PM

Hey Gabe,
Nice pictures, clearly white like you said!
Where did you get these seeds?
You can also see some left-overs from ****e stuff on the other seeds from Erlend, but I have no idea how easy it is to wash it off...?

Gabe15 · 10-21-2006, 01:55 PM

These seeds were a gift, you cannot buy them. The white on mine cannot be washed off like on some seeds, it is the color of the seed.

griphuz · 10-21-2006, 02:00 PM

A gift?! Wow sweet!
From someone you know in India or something?
Have you had some luck germinating these yet?
Very curious how the plants will look!

mrbungalow · 10-21-2006, 02:07 PM

So what do you guys reccon the smooth ones from Seedman are?

Gabe15 · 10-22-2006, 01:02 AM

erlend,
those look to me like Musa sikkimensis.

mrbungalow · 10-22-2006, 02:07 AM

They look different than sikkimensis seeds. They are much larger, and have a generally different shape and colour than what I have seen on sikkimensis over the years. The seedlings have very thin first leaves, and look like a very nice sword sucker as they sprout. I am starting to think Seedman might have given me seeds of ensete superbum...

Tropicallvr · 10-24-2006, 05:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrbungalow

The seedlings have very thin first leaves, and look like a very nice sword sucker as they sprout. ..

That's pretty much how the bumpy ones that I got from sunshine seeds looked after they sprouted. I'm starting to think that the Musa Nagensium seeds are real and the M.cheesmanii aren't. Or they are and were the same thing when they were first named, with many variable seeds and plants making the ID more confusing. I give up trying to figure it out.

barna · 10-27-2006, 06:03 AM

In my experience, Musa cheesmani and Musa nagensium 'Florale Noir' look very similar with dark coloured stem at their bottom and a dark leave mid-rib, but musa nagensium 'pure' (mine is still small) has more 'bluish' leaves and until now no dark mid-rib

M. nagensium 'Florale Noir' (Sunshine seeds)

M. cheesmani (Sementes.de)

M nagensium 'pure'? (Tropengarden.de)

mrbungalow · 12-03-2006, 09:36 AM

Gabe, I am not claiming anything, but I am starting to think you may have regular musa cheesmani seeds and not musa nagensium.

http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~drc/mcheesmani.htm
This description of musa cheesmani matches the picture you posted.

http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~drc/mnagensium.htm
The description of musa nagensium says the seeds are almost half an inch!

What do you think?

Erlend

Gabe15 · 12-03-2006, 06:22 PM

I know I have Musa nagensium because they were a gift from Markku Hakkinen, he collected them in the wild and I have pictures of the plants. Much of the information regarding these species that is still available is sometimes inaccurate and in need of revision. Also, the seed descriptions are rather poor on that website, simply stating size still leaves a wide range of possible variations of a seed. Remember, information from seed dealer website is often very erroneous as they dont do research, and also websites like David's, although very helpful and a great resource, still do not provide end-all answers.

mrbungalow · 12-04-2006, 01:18 AM

OK, thanks Gabe!

mrbungalow · 01-23-2007, 04:44 PM

Gabe, have you sprouted any of the white seeds yet?

Gabe15 · 01-23-2007, 04:56 PM

nope, but im still working on it. I also still have some that are un-planted as well.

barna · 09-20-2007, 04:40 PM

One year latter my Musa nagensium 'Pure' has grown, Here you have some pictures of both

MUSA NAGENSIUM 'PURE.................................................MUSA NAGENSIUM 'FLORALE NOIR'

MUSA NAGENSIUM 'PURE.................................................MUSA NAGENSIUM 'FLORALE NOIR'

They look very similar except for a small difference in the coloration. The pure ones has darkish line on the leave’s stem

I do not know if it is really a pure form, but at least they look a little bit different.

Does somebody is also growing a 'pure' form?

mrbungalow · 09-21-2007, 03:55 AM

Looks good Conrad!
These species seem to grow slower than others. For me, other plants can grow up to twice as fast as nagensiums.

I still only have the nagensium X form from Trebrown, and the "Seedman" plants all died.

Erlend

10-19-2006, 12:49 PM	#1 (permalink)
Gabe15 Moderator Gabe15's Photo Gallery Location: Oahu, Hawaii Find me on the map! Zone: 12 Name: Gabe Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 3,892 BananaBucks : 13,339,298 Feedback: 5 / 100% Said "Thanks" 1 Times Was Thanked 8,237 Times in 2,200 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 8 Times	Musa nagensium seeds for reference I know some members have wanted to see what M. nagensium seed really looks like, and here are some pictures for reference. You can see the the larger flat "bottom" of the seed is a normal brown but the rest of the seed is white. I should note that these seeds are also very large, for comparison is an american quarter coin (about 2.5cm), each seed is at least 1 cm in diameter I would guess. __________________ Growing bananas in Colorado, Washington, Hawaii since 2004. Commercial banana farmer, 200+ varieties.

10-19-2006, 01:17 PM	#2 (permalink)
Zac in NC Plant Nerd Extrordinaire Location: Harlingen, Texas, Lower Rio Grande Valley Find me on the map! Zone: 10b/11a? Name: Zac Hill Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 265 BananaBucks : 23,687 Feedback: 1 / 100% Said "Thanks" 9 Times Was Thanked 54 Times in 39 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 5 Times	Re: Musa nagensium seeds for reference Cool. Looks liek you got the seeds in that you were expecting. Zac

10-19-2006, 01:51 PM	#3 (permalink)
barna Member barna's Photo Gallery Location: Barcelona, Spain Find me on the map! Zone: USDA 9a Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 99 BananaBucks : 30,988 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 12 Times Was Thanked 19 Times in 12 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 3 Times	Re: Musa nagensium seeds for reference Sunshine-seeds (link in german) and Tropengarten (link in german). are offering a supposed 'true form' I ordered mines last year from Tropengarten and I have grow a couple of plants They were supposed to be 'pure nagensium' but unfortunately i can remember how they look. Does somebody ordered from them?. Do they look like the ones posted by Gabe?

10-19-2006, 02:19 PM	#4 (permalink)
mrbungalow Freezing member mrbungalow's Photo Gallery Location: Bergen, Norway Find me on the map! Zone: 8 Name: Erlend Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 598 BananaBucks : 46,387 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 14 Times Was Thanked 165 Times in 78 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 3 Times	Re: Musa nagensium seeds for reference Wow! Looks exactly like what I got from Phil at Trebrown.. I dont think your seeds look much like the description at "the musacea" here, so I am still confused: http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~drc/mnagensium.htm Here are some pics of the seeds I have obtained, from Seedman and Trebrown. [IMG][/IMG] [IMG][/IMG] [IMG][/IMG] Notice how Trebrowns seeds are prickly and worty while Seedmans seeds are smooth and a bit larger. Erlend __________________

10-21-2006, 01:50 PM	#5 (permalink)
griphuz Cold-tolerant collector griphuz's Photo Gallery Location: Netherlands Find me on the map! Zone: 7 - 8a Name: Remko Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 295 BananaBucks : 82,910 Feedback: 1 / 100% Said "Thanks" 317 Times Was Thanked 290 Times in 114 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 827 Times	Re: Musa nagensium seeds for reference Hey Gabe, Nice pictures, clearly white like you said! Where did you get these seeds? You can also see some left-overs from ****e stuff on the other seeds from Erlend, but I have no idea how easy it is to wash it off...?

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10-21-2006, 01:55 PM	#6 (permalink)
Gabe15 Moderator Gabe15's Photo Gallery Location: Oahu, Hawaii Find me on the map! Zone: 12 Name: Gabe Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 3,892 BananaBucks : 13,339,298 Feedback: 5 / 100% Said "Thanks" 1 Times Was Thanked 8,237 Times in 2,200 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 8 Times	Re: Musa nagensium seeds for reference These seeds were a gift, you cannot buy them. The white on mine cannot be washed off like on some seeds, it is the color of the seed. __________________ Growing bananas in Colorado, Washington, Hawaii since 2004. Commercial banana farmer, 200+ varieties.

10-21-2006, 02:00 PM	#7 (permalink)
griphuz Cold-tolerant collector griphuz's Photo Gallery Location: Netherlands Find me on the map! Zone: 7 - 8a Name: Remko Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 295 BananaBucks : 82,910 Feedback: 1 / 100% Said "Thanks" 317 Times Was Thanked 290 Times in 114 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 827 Times	Re: Musa nagensium seeds for reference A gift?! Wow sweet! From someone you know in India or something? Have you had some luck germinating these yet? Very curious how the plants will look!

10-21-2006, 02:07 PM	#8 (permalink)
mrbungalow Freezing member mrbungalow's Photo Gallery Location: Bergen, Norway Find me on the map! Zone: 8 Name: Erlend Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 598 BananaBucks : 46,387 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 14 Times Was Thanked 165 Times in 78 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 3 Times	Re: Musa nagensium seeds for reference So what do you guys reccon the smooth ones from Seedman are? __________________

10-22-2006, 01:02 AM	#9 (permalink)
Gabe15 Moderator Gabe15's Photo Gallery Location: Oahu, Hawaii Find me on the map! Zone: 12 Name: Gabe Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 3,892 BananaBucks : 13,339,298 Feedback: 5 / 100% Said "Thanks" 1 Times Was Thanked 8,237 Times in 2,200 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 8 Times	Re: Musa nagensium seeds for reference erlend, those look to me like Musa sikkimensis. __________________ Growing bananas in Colorado, Washington, Hawaii since 2004. Commercial banana farmer, 200+ varieties.

10-22-2006, 02:07 AM	#10 (permalink)
mrbungalow Freezing member mrbungalow's Photo Gallery Location: Bergen, Norway Find me on the map! Zone: 8 Name: Erlend Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 598 BananaBucks : 46,387 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 14 Times Was Thanked 165 Times in 78 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 3 Times	Re: Musa nagensium seeds for reference They look different than sikkimensis seeds. They are much larger, and have a generally different shape and colour than what I have seen on sikkimensis over the years. The seedlings have very thin first leaves, and look like a very nice sword sucker as they sprout. I am starting to think Seedman might have given me seeds of ensete superbum... __________________

10-27-2006, 06:03 AM	#12 (permalink)
barna Member barna's Photo Gallery Location: Barcelona, Spain Find me on the map! Zone: USDA 9a Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 99 BananaBucks : 30,988 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 12 Times Was Thanked 19 Times in 12 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 3 Times	Re: Musa nagensium seeds for reference In my experience, Musa cheesmani and Musa nagensium 'Florale Noir' look very similar with dark coloured stem at their bottom and a dark leave mid-rib, but musa nagensium 'pure' (mine is still small) has more 'bluish' leaves and until now no dark mid-rib M. nagensium 'Florale Noir' (Sunshine seeds) M. cheesmani (Sementes.de) M nagensium 'pure'? (Tropengarden.de)

12-03-2006, 09:36 AM	#13 (permalink)
mrbungalow Freezing member mrbungalow's Photo Gallery Location: Bergen, Norway Find me on the map! Zone: 8 Name: Erlend Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 598 BananaBucks : 46,387 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 14 Times Was Thanked 165 Times in 78 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 3 Times	Re: Musa nagensium seeds for reference Gabe, I am not claiming anything, but I am starting to think you may have regular musa cheesmani seeds and not musa nagensium. http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~drc/mcheesmani.htm This description of musa cheesmani matches the picture you posted. http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~drc/mnagensium.htm The description of musa nagensium says the seeds are almost half an inch! What do you think? Erlend __________________

12-03-2006, 06:22 PM	#14 (permalink)
Gabe15 Moderator Gabe15's Photo Gallery Location: Oahu, Hawaii Find me on the map! Zone: 12 Name: Gabe Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 3,892 BananaBucks : 13,339,298 Feedback: 5 / 100% Said "Thanks" 1 Times Was Thanked 8,237 Times in 2,200 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 8 Times	Re: Musa nagensium seeds for reference I know I have Musa nagensium because they were a gift from Markku Hakkinen, he collected them in the wild and I have pictures of the plants. Much of the information regarding these species that is still available is sometimes inaccurate and in need of revision. Also, the seed descriptions are rather poor on that website, simply stating size still leaves a wide range of possible variations of a seed. Remember, information from seed dealer website is often very erroneous as they dont do research, and also websites like David's, although very helpful and a great resource, still do not provide end-all answers. __________________ Growing bananas in Colorado, Washington, Hawaii since 2004. Commercial banana farmer, 200+ varieties.

12-04-2006, 01:18 AM	#15 (permalink)
mrbungalow Freezing member mrbungalow's Photo Gallery Location: Bergen, Norway Find me on the map! Zone: 8 Name: Erlend Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 598 BananaBucks : 46,387 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 14 Times Was Thanked 165 Times in 78 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 3 Times	Re: Musa nagensium seeds for reference OK, thanks Gabe! __________________

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01-23-2007, 04:44 PM	#16 (permalink)
mrbungalow Freezing member mrbungalow's Photo Gallery Location: Bergen, Norway Find me on the map! Zone: 8 Name: Erlend Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 598 BananaBucks : 46,387 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 14 Times Was Thanked 165 Times in 78 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 3 Times	Re: Musa nagensium seeds for reference Gabe, have you sprouted any of the white seeds yet? __________________

01-23-2007, 04:56 PM	#17 (permalink)
Gabe15 Moderator Gabe15's Photo Gallery Location: Oahu, Hawaii Find me on the map! Zone: 12 Name: Gabe Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 3,892 BananaBucks : 13,339,298 Feedback: 5 / 100% Said "Thanks" 1 Times Was Thanked 8,237 Times in 2,200 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 8 Times	Re: Musa nagensium seeds for reference nope, but im still working on it. I also still have some that are un-planted as well. __________________ Growing bananas in Colorado, Washington, Hawaii since 2004. Commercial banana farmer, 200+ varieties.

09-20-2007, 04:40 PM	#18 (permalink)
barna Member barna's Photo Gallery Location: Barcelona, Spain Find me on the map! Zone: USDA 9a Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 99 BananaBucks : 30,988 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 12 Times Was Thanked 19 Times in 12 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 3 Times	Re: Musa nagensium seeds for reference One year latter my Musa nagensium 'Pure' has grown, Here you have some pictures of both MUSA NAGENSIUM 'PURE.................................................MUSA NAGENSIUM 'FLORALE NOIR' MUSA NAGENSIUM 'PURE.................................................MUSA NAGENSIUM 'FLORALE NOIR' They look very similar except for a small difference in the coloration. The pure ones has darkish line on the leave’s stem I do not know if it is really a pure form, but at least they look a little bit different. Does somebody is also growing a 'pure' form?

09-21-2007, 03:55 AM	#19 (permalink)
mrbungalow Freezing member mrbungalow's Photo Gallery Location: Bergen, Norway Find me on the map! Zone: 8 Name: Erlend Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 598 BananaBucks : 46,387 Feedback: 0 / 0% Said "Thanks" 14 Times Was Thanked 165 Times in 78 Posts Said "Welcome to Bananas" 3 Times	Re: Musa nagensium seeds for reference Looks good Conrad! These species seem to grow slower than others. For me, other plants can grow up to twice as fast as nagensiums. I still only have the nagensium X form from Trebrown, and the "Seedman" plants all died. Erlend __________________

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