Eric

Hi guys,
I got a "dwarf Gran Nain", as a present, this spring. Have investigated my brains out but no luck. It was labelled "dwarf Gran Nain" but one source says it's "Grand" (with a D), another says Grand Nains have no dwarf, and one even says it's just a take-off on a Gros Michel. . Put a pic in my LateJune2009 album (in a pot). Could somebody tell me what I'm growing?

Jack Daw

It's a Cavendish Sports that in several areas of the planet replaced the Gros Michel as a plantain crop, when the Panama Disease came and elliminated good part of the harvests based on Gros Michel.
It's yield was comparable to that of Gros Michel, yet it's resistance to PD was much better. (some peple say that it was a sport of Gros Michel, that was resilient to Panama Disease).
It's widely cultivated in the areas, where occasional frosts and snow come in consideration, such as areas in Mediterranean region, because it's quite hardy. It is however substituted by other sports in the regions of tropics by homegorwn cultivars.

There's no variant of this cultivar, that would be called Dwarf Grand Nain, becasue the dwarfing process itself is unnecessary. Grand Nains grow to 8 foot tall and thus they are many times labelled as 'Giant Dwarf', but this prefix is not needed.

As to the cultivar name, the taxonomy of banana is not strictly defined, so the names of this cultivar can be:
'Gran Nain' (Chiquita (banana), Grand Naine, Grande Naine, Umalog, Nana, Grand Nain...)

Hope this helps you pal. (Btw. I only read this, so others, who are from banana growing regions, might correct me)

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Thnx to Marcel, Ante, Dr. Chiranjit Parmar and Francesco for the plants I've received.



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Dalmatiansoap

U ll be expert by this time next year Jack. Than we will know from your own expirience.
Good luck with them Jack!

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Eric

Thanx Jack,
Want all the input I can get. If ur right & it is a Gros Michel variant, it should do well in Oklahoma. If it is, is it a desert or a cooking nanna?

Dalmatiansoap

Gran Nain is tipicall store Chiquita banana
Dessert typ.

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Jack Daw

Exactly, the ones you buy from store, the typical yellow, slightly curled banana, that is usually some Cavendish sort. If you have eaten Chiquita banana, Chiquita company is known to have replaced all cultivars with Grand Nain.
Dessert type and from the garden, fress, ripened on a tree, it should much more tasty and flavorful than those unripe, artificially ripened you get from the store.
Grand Nain might be perfect in your area, it might even do fairly well in my.


Let's hope Ante, that we both will be. You have a nice chance on fruting this year, even if in latter time of the year, your DC seems very mature. Maybe he will want to try something soon.

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Thnx to Marcel, Ante, Dr. Chiranjit Parmar and Francesco for the plants I've received.



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Dalmatiansoap

Hope so!
What is maind difference between DC and Gran Nain?

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Jack Daw

I would say that the hardiness to the cold and maybe yields, of that I am however unsure. Dwarf Cavendish can hardly survive the whole long period of cold going down to 0°C or 3°C. Yet, Grand Nain, grown in the Mediterranean region grows in plantains without any significant problems.

Also, the yielding is different, when in midler climates. DC is a tropical banana and GN seems to be more of subtropical one. Kalabrian said, that the DC was planted in southern Italy with little succes, because the plants, even though they survived, had little fruit (if I recall well).
This however shouldn't be the issue with GN, as it doesn't seem to mind the cold period. DC is also pretty damaged below 10°C, whch makes it quite unsuitable for growing in our locations. I use the SDC only as a thermometer.

Each year I will plant with the other nanas also a small SDC and when I see in the autumn or winter, that SDC is going down and dying, I will know it's time to pull out the other, cold hardier nanas. Pretty cruel, but effective non the less.
SDC can not withstand light frosts during the night, yet subtropical nanas can, so that will be the sign. One morning, I wake up and the SDC will be dying. Its life will have purpose though.

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Eric

Thanx guys,
I'm gradually increasing sunlight for mine. Would like to see this one fruit. I've never had a fresh banana but I have heard they are a lot tastier.

Jack Daw

Me neither, the only problem there is with our bananas (and yours as well) is that it's harvested unripe, shipped into another country and only after that it is forced to ripen. From what I've read, ripening on the tree, those few weeks, that the store ones miss, also adds much more intensity to the flavor and makes the bananas more pleasureful to eat.
I got the GN bare root and they had problems with light. Even though, I planted them on their spots and waited. We had a heat wave then, about 31 to 33°C, but they held well. Some had a minor leaf burn, but they recovered quickly and now we have extreme cold wave, temps are about 22°C and the nanas are starting to regrow. Many have new leaves, but 2 don't seem to be growing aboive the soil level. I think It might have something to do with that they came bare root. Somehow, they are making new roots and I hope they are just growing below the surface level.

I also have preusmably an ABB triploid to ID, as it was labelled Dajiao, but compared to the others, Grand Nains is pretty fast. Even faster than basjoo at temps around 25-35°C (77-95°F). Basjoos seem to like much milder temperatures and now, that we have cold wave, they started to grow like hell. 1 leaf in 3 days, as it is the second cold day and the leaf is there from none to almost fully open.

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Thnx to Marcel, Ante, Dr. Chiranjit Parmar and Francesco for the plants I've received.



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Dalmatiansoap

haha Jim, so it looks Im not the only one. Hope we ll both taste them soon .
I ll even invite Jack on test sampler!

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Jack Daw

I take your word for it. And I promise to be as tanned as an Indian (frm India I mean, not USA). Well, maybe not that much, but either way, dark.
I hope that the Nains reach the height of 1m or more this year, also the Dajiao seems to be pretty high cultivar. With only 3rd leaf coming up, it's about tripple the height of the GN, which are 25cm (10 inches) at 5th leaf from the emerging. The GN really show a small stature from the beginnig.
Just like the Dwarf Brazilian from Marcel, he too is with his 6th leaf much smaller than the Dajiao and and about the same height as the GN with their 5th leaf on. That would make mature heights, if the growth is proportional as it is now:
Dwarf Brazialian - let's consider 2,2 meters
Grand Nain - 2,2 * (6/5,5) = 2,4 meters
Dajiao - 2,2 * (6/3) = 4,4 meters
This makes the Dajiao (possibly) about 4,5 meters high from the ground to the leaf tip in maturity.

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Eric

All right! I hope so too! In the meantime, I've got a fair shot with my Blue Javas, at least. They're 12-14 feet, already. BTW, great avatar ! Wish I'd thought of it.
Jack, good to hear your Basjoo are doing so good! Best of luck with the Nains and the others.

Jack Daw

Thanks, as you can see from my avatar, everything has its purpose.

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Eric

Never been much of a bird-watcher but I am curious; what species of bird is that?

Jack Daw

It's a Jackdaw. European Jackdaw to be precise. Corvus monedula.
Lovely eyes, don't you think? Shame that mine are dark brown.

Let's quote wikipedia:
But I believe I explained to you in one PM, what is the connection with these birds in my case.

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Eric

Pair bond !? Think I'll avoid that topic!
Thanks for the info.

Jack Daw

Only very little animals do that in nature and many of those, that do, actually kill the partner after mating. Special birdies these are.
They also live close to and see the Israel GN plantains. Unlike us.

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Dalmatiansoap

Want to see that PM!!

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Jack Daw

Sent. But only the passage.

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Thnx to Marcel, Ante, Dr. Chiranjit Parmar and Francesco for the plants I've received.



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