View Full Version : what are you using for potting soil?
nucci60
09-12-2006, 07:17 PM
Hi, I have been using Miracle-Gro potting soil for allmy plants. The palms and cannas seem to thrive in it, but it seems to dry right up Quickly with my potted basjoos. I think It is making me overwater them. What are you using for a potting soil formula? All help apreciated!
Zac in NC
09-12-2006, 07:23 PM
I use Miracle-Gro potting mix too and I do not think you can over water them. I have mine outdoors right now, though they'll come in for winter.
Zac
Frankallen
09-12-2006, 11:30 PM
I use nothing but Miracle-Grow also!! I agree with Zac, I don't believe you can overwater them, when you have a real porous soil mixture like M-G.
Frank
nucci60
09-13-2006, 07:03 AM
THanks for your advice guys, I will continue to use it.
I have been invited to post my comment about miracle gro potting soil, so please don't think I am being disagreeable. I am just speaking from my own experience in central Florida. And maybe some of you are in Florida, too, and your experience has been great using miracle gro. I would advise anyone to keep using what works for them. My experience has been just the opposite. I also admit I have not used it in at least 3 years. I have a nursery and have never used it on the business side of my property. I did use it for some personal plantings. Most notable was the rose bushes I had great hopes for. They already looked great. I repotted them in miracle gro and within a month they were all dead. I also used it on some gingers and some ground orchids with the same results. If that was not enough, there were dead plants brought back to the nursery. They left here healthy. The common denominator in every case was miracle gro potting soil. So my personal experience has turned me completely against it. But I love and use the liquid fertilize by miracle gro.
And just on the side, I noted later that the pictures of the plants on the bag and in the ads were of annuals. So rightly or wrongly I concluded I was using it for the wrong plants. But it just doesn't work for me.
I use the commercial soilless mix now with no fertilize added for all my plants, not just those in the nursery. And I add fertilize after they have time to settle in. But if I were buying a potting soil from the store I would probably amend it with compost, vermiculite, wood chips or whatever it needed to be arable, fast draining, but hold enough moisture for the plants.
Trudy
nucci60
09-13-2006, 09:02 AM
Thank you TE, I have found all comments and opinions are welcome on this forum. Welcome t the forum, I am new here myself. It is a lively forum compared to most.:2688:
Carolina
09-13-2006, 01:45 PM
I also use Miracle Gro potting soil, but do use the cheap walmart potting soil for those things that like to keep their feet wet.
I have to agree with TE in the not using Miracle-Gro potting soil. I have never had any luck with anything I have used it for. I have never lost any plants, but they just never did very well. I use Fafard #2 and add hardwood bark fines to it if I want more drainage. Also like TE I love Miracle grow fertilizer and use it when I feed. I just don’t like fertilizer in my soil as I like to decide when and how much fertilizer to use.
Jane
I had not mentioned the potting soil I actually use, but it is not far from what Jane uses. I use Faford 3b. TE
momoese
09-13-2006, 03:00 PM
I make my own using a store bought organic compost, perlite, a small amount of chicken manure, and worm castings. I do this because it's cheaper, organic, and I control how well it drains or holds water. If you need you soil to hold water longer use more vermiculite and less Perlite. This combo has gotten all my freshly dug and potted pups through the rooting process and kept them organic along the way!
JoeS475
09-13-2006, 07:28 PM
I too had been warned against Miracle-Gro (too late since my first banana drowned in it). I currently use a mix that I believe was recommended to me on this forum: 1/3 potting soil, 1/3 perlite, and 1/3 peat moss. I've had nothing but great success and also use the same mix on all palms, bird of paradise, and other tropicals I'm growing. I'm using Scotts brand (all 3 parts) since it is readily available at Home Depot close to home.
Possibly next season I will mix up some of the organic ingredients that others are using to give the plants more nutrients, and do a side by side comparison with my current mix.
~Joe :2711:
Sodak
09-13-2006, 07:33 PM
I use Gabe's recipe he posted a cople years ago.
1/3 Peat
1/3 perlite
1/3 small pine bark mulch
I use it to pot my plants during the winter to keep them going.
It's worked well until last year when I lost 2 Basjoo, and 2 SDC to rot.
I think I'll continue with it again for another year.
MediaHound
09-13-2006, 07:38 PM
anyone know where to get large bags of pearlite?
Tropical Lady
09-13-2006, 08:17 PM
I've had LOTS of customers call that has had problems with their tropicals, the first question I ask is are they using MG potting soil, 95% of the time their answer is yes! I do not down MG, however I personally do use the liquid fertilizer, just not the potting soil.
scooterbug
09-13-2006, 08:24 PM
You can get large bags of Perlite from any greenhouse/ nursery supplier.
I get my Fafard Pro mix and Perlite from
http://www.carlinsales.com/
BTW ....... the correct name for the Miracle grow and others is Potting Mix.
You do not want potting soil it is just about useless for fast growing tropical giants .:0493: The only thing worse is totally useless Top Soil.
Then you end up adding compost,bark,vermiculite etc to beef it up .
MG or other brands of potting MIX are made only from these additives to begin with.
If you want to lighten up your Potting Mix you can add some vermiculite or perlite. Be careful which you choose .
Verm holds water but Perlite does not.
These 2 additives will not change the nutritional profile of your chosen Potting Mix.
Adding peat, compost or composted manure will change the profile.
heeeeeeeeeee, fell off my soap-box ........... I'm outta here :2691:
S
mikevan
09-13-2006, 09:37 PM
M M My Momma says, she says, Miracle Gro is of the Devil! But I gots some high quality H2O. :)
I custom mix what I use. Compost, vocanic sand, a smiggen of bentonite clay, perlite, composted manure, vermicompost, nosy people, etc... Since I stopped using MG, I stopped killing plants all the time. Funny, huh? Building up a soil foodweb in your soil whether in a container or in your garden makes for a far happier plant than some chemical salts that lack most of what plants need. This includes leveraging the strengths of helpers like mycorrhizal fungus, companions and mulch, even in containers. Peat is not a good choice either - lacks in nutrition seriously not to mention contributes to the destruction of our bogs. Even coir can be problematic - few coconut plantations are sustainable - they're planted at the expense of native jungles and are rarely organically cultivated. So - compost is king! Get a pile or bucket going!
:2742:
Be well,
Mike
Frankallen
09-13-2006, 10:31 PM
I have never had "Miracle Grow Potting Soil" to kill a Plant??? I have grew some Monster Banana Pups in nothing but MGPS!! I really like it alot myself. I have used it for about 10 years and to my knowledge it has never killed a plant or harmed one.
One of the top Banana Plant sellers(Ted Taylor, of GreenEarth Inc.) on Ebay, actually recommends you to use "Miracle Grow Potting Soil" to pot the plants he sends you!! Just my 2 cents worth. :)
Frank
mikevan
09-14-2006, 01:41 AM
And one of the largest seed producers in the world recommends that you use GMO seeds and Roundup. Not my bag, personally. I'm sure Ted is a smart guy and all - he helped me with identification of one of my nanners after all. But I believe that MG fert is damaging to the ecosystem and largely ineffective and unnecessary in a good organic regimen, and I don't support MG by purchasing other products they produce like their soil, which I suspect, of course, is full of MG. They supposedly have an "organic" soil too, but trust is an issue there. I lost quite a few cacao trees to MG (used according to their instructions, naturally) before I stopped using it and used mycorrhizal fungus, molasses and fish emulsion and later repotted into rich compost based soil with remarkable and nearly miraculous results - which began my journey down the Organic Path (well, I believe the USDA screwed the pooch on the term "Organic", let's just say, Ecologically Friendly). No salt buildup problems, very happy and diverse soil - lotsa happy earthworms in it - and happy plants. I'll stick with DIY because it works for me, just as MG works for you.
Personal choice, mind you. No judgement. And... they're the Devil!!!! :) <Mike runs around in circles screaming like a little girl> :)
Be well,
Mike
I have never had "Miracle Grow Potting Soil" to kill a Plant??? I have grew some Monster Banana Pups in nothing but MGPS!! I really like it alot myself. I have used it for about 10 years and to my knowledge it has never killed a plant or harmed one.
One of the top Banana Plant sellers(Ted Taylor, of GreenEarth Inc.) on Ebay, actually recommends you to use "Miracle Grow Potting Soil" to pot the plants he sends you!! Just my 2 cents worth. :)
Frank
sandy0225
09-14-2006, 07:50 AM
ProMix HP is the best one I've found so far. It already has the increased perlite levels in it, so it drains well and doesn't hold too much moisture. It's balanced, doesn't compact easily over time, and it has a small starter charge of fertilizer, and ph balanced. The only complaint I have with it is that it's lightweight, so plants tend to get top heavy and tip easily.
Even with it, be careful how much you water a potted banana in the winter! and don't overpot, keep the roots crowded for winter so they dry out faster.
I agree that Miracle gro soil is worthless for aeration of roots. Once you wet it out, if you live in a humid climate, or have it in a humid greenhouse, it takes FOREVER to dry out. It's fine here for mid-summer potting of containers that are in full sun, but don't even think about using it in the fall or winter in Indiana unless you cut it 50/50 with perlite. Don't cut it with bark and then pot it up for a long term plant, because that changes the ph of your mix over time as the bark decomposes, it ties up the nitrogen and you'll end up with very light green, spindly thin weak growth, unless you change the ph of your watering/fertilizing water. If you have a lot of plants, unless you mixed all the soil at the same ratio with bark, then you have a lot of different ph levels to adjust. Too much work!
And I would love to go organic in my greenhouse. Just give me the name of a fertilizer that won't run off the customers with the smell, that I can apply in a convenient way (and that I can actually afford-that would be a nice bonus!), a soil that drains properly for long term production, and some pesticides that actually kill more bugs than leaves.
My 2 cents worth!
Sandy @ Northern Tropics
mikevan
09-14-2006, 10:24 AM
Heh. Fish emulsion only stinks if you don't like the smell of rotting fish. :) Okay - the Alaska stuff smells for a couple of days - it can be applied Friday evening and should be okay by Monday morning. I have had critter problems when using it tho - seems like coons, possums, rats and mice like to root around in soil that's been freshly watered with the stuff, so make sure you've effectively excluded them.
Nevertheless, the best "fertilizer" is the soil you use. Nothing beats good compost for nutrient value to a plant. Lava sand contains trace amounts of iron (the red stuff) and potash and also functions similar to powderized charcoal by giving bacteria a place to hold onto while it's processing nutrients in the soil. A little rock phosphate, a bit of New Jersey greensand (the Texas stuff is worthless), and mycorrhizal fungus to start. Fish meal doesn't smell once it's mixed with the soil, and there's also blood meal and bone meal. Heck, coffee grounds and eggshells are actually good fertilizers! And there's the good ol diluted molasses! Boosts nitrogen levels in the soil, adds trace minerals and carbon and in at least one test in a Hawaiian papaya plantation reduced pathogenic nematode infection significantly. Don't over-apply, of course. And, did I say compost? Not that bark-filled garbage that Lowe's sells - but classic home-made stuff comprised of a good balance of greens and browns. Of kitchen scraps, yard clippings, manure, leaves, etc all mixed up and cooked real good. After using that stuff, you'll wonder why you ever used peat... I've also planted inoculated clover in with some of my containers. Can't say the results were spectacular, but it does diversify the soil foodweb somewhat. May try sugarsnap peas this winter - at the very least I'll get a nice harvest. And there's vermicompost. My plants go gaga over that stuff. It's especially easy if you live close to a Charbucks... oops, Starbucks too - redworms love coffee grounds. The resulting vermicompost is fairly nuetral too, interestingly. You can apply it as a topdressing and water it in, or you can use it to make an aerated humus tea - I use some fresh vermicompost and a bit of molasses and strongly aerate it for 24 hours and both drench the soil and apply as a foliar spray. If it smells like rotten fish, discard it - it went anearobic. Should smell like an earthy wine.
As to pest control - I see more warnings on non-organic labels about possible leaf damage than on organic solutions. Regardless, aphids and mites can be washed off with a regular spraying of water - something I do for my taro. Simple boric-acid soaked grits works great as a bait for ants. Caterpillars respond well to hand-picking. Grasshoppers too if you get them early in the morning. Haven't had any borer problems, but organic soaps are no worse than non-organic soaps. I also encourage the likes of spiders, mantids and other predators too. They work for you full time all the time. I'm always seeing a jumping spider with an insect - their ambush tactics must be seen to be believed. In the warm season, paper wasps are great for caterpillar problems. Not that all caterpillars are a problem in my view - I like butterflies. Chickens, guinea fowl and peafowl are excellent for grasshopper and cricket control and even snake control (tho I love my snakes). I have tried liquid seaweed on mites, but can't say whether it was the liquid seaweed or the moisture that drove them off. Plants didn't complain either way tho. Very effective solutions are there. It's better to target the pest than to carpet-bomb - helps make sure beneficials aren't killed in the process.
The biggest roadblock to going organic is personal preconceptions, I think. Standing on the precipice of the unknown when you're already comfortable with what you're currently using. Once the change is made, however, it's life as usual...
Be well,
Mike
And I would love to go organic in my greenhouse. Just give me the name of a fertilizer that won't run off the customers with the smell, that I can apply in a convenient way (and that I can actually afford-that would be a nice bonus!), a soil that drains properly for long term production, and some pesticides that actually kill more bugs than leaves.
My 2 cents worth!
Sandy @ Northern Tropics
nucci60
09-14-2006, 10:37 AM
BUT, isn't miraclegro potting mix organic? It contains compost, sphagnum peat moss, and perlite. Except for the chemical fertilizer, the other ingredients seem to be what others are recommending, except for the wood chips,which you use or don't use. I just find it dries too quickly in hot weather.
mikevan
09-14-2006, 10:48 AM
I think the OMRI would laugh themselves to tears if MG tried to register their mix as "Organic". The imbedded fertilizer is the big downer for me, personally. Everything else is... well - comodity. Every mix contains pretty much the same stuff - peat and perlite and sometimes bark compost and the differences are the ferts they add to it. Peat isn't sustainable, perlite amounts must be matched to the desired drainage, and nowadays they seem to label shredded bark as compost - every bag I've purchased - be it "mushroom compost" "manure compost" or "organic compost" from the likes of Lowe's and Walfart has come out basically the same - shredded bark. I remember when a bag of manure was actually a bag of manure! There was a time when I saw decent stuff coming out of the bags - but nowadays, nothing beats DIY for me and I get my manure from local dairies. But that's just me. My home-made soil retains moisture pretty strongly in hot weather - I actually have to mix in a little more perlite.
Be well,
Mike
BUT, isn't miraclegro potting mix organic? It contains compost, sphagnum peat moss, and perlite. Except for the chemical fertilizer, the other ingredients seem to be what others are recommending, except for the wood chips,which you use or don't use. I just find it dries too quickly in hot weather.
jeffreyp
09-15-2006, 01:52 PM
I've had good luck with the jungle growth mix from Lowes.
GpD79
07-18-2007, 11:59 PM
Sheesh! I'm a first time banana grower and I just got my 2 banana plants today. Of course, the first thing I did was repot them into large pots full of Miracle-Gro Potting Soil! After reading all these posts, I'm scared to crap that I'm going to kill my banana plants! (or severely inhibit their growth) Maybe tomorrow I'll remove the Miracle-Gro and do it the old fashioned way. EEK! I've actually never done it the old fashioned way. I have a quick compost question though. Whenever I mow the lawn, I put all the grass clippings into a mound on the ground in the back. Would that pile of this seasons grass be considered compost? Should I mix that stuff into the soil or just put it on top? Do the clippings have to be completely broken down before I use them? We don't use fertilizer in our yard. Sorry for the 20 questions :-) I guess it's typical though for a new banana plant owner. I just don't want to mess it up! Thanks in advance for anyone who could help.
nucci60
07-19-2007, 11:11 AM
I have grown palms ,bananas, and brugmansia in miracle gro without any bad results. After about three months the feed part wears out, so you can use a fertilizer. My main tool is a cheap moisture probe so you will know if the plant needs watering. In the sun miracle gro can dry out on top and still be moist where the roots are.
CookieCows
12-27-2007, 12:10 PM
I potted my two new pups in a pot with a bag of miracle grow. No perlite and I put the fertilizer sticks that they came with into the dirt also. After reading this thread I'm a little concerned that maybe I should dig the fertilzer sticks out? With fertilizer already in the Miracle grow could I be harming the plants with over fertilizing? I'm going to make a trip down to Lowes and see if I can find a cheap soil moisture tester to keep an eye on that though.
turtile
12-27-2007, 07:20 PM
Pro-mix with med. size pine bark.
Like others have mentioned, Miracle Gro is both poorly drained and aerated. Banana roots don't do well in it (too much watering will rot the roots).
Osmocote Plus is a good fertilizer for potted bananas.
phantom17
12-27-2007, 08:00 PM
I have been using Hyponex brand & earth's finest (lowes) & it seem to do OK. I have'nt had a problem yet!:rollerbananadone: :2623:
CookieCows
12-27-2007, 08:17 PM
ok thanks ... I guess I'll keep an eye on the dirt with the soil moisture tester and if it doesn't start to dry out soon I'll pull it out and re-pot
jason
12-27-2007, 08:33 PM
ProMix HP is the best one I've found so far. It already has the increased perlite levels in it, so it drains well and doesn't hold too much moisture. It's balanced, doesn't compact easily over time, and it has a small starter charge of fertilizer, and ph balanced. The only complaint I have with it is that it's lightweight, so plants tend to get top heavy and tip easily.
Even with it, be careful how much you water a potted banana in the winter! and don't overpot, keep the roots crowded for winter so they dry out faster.
I agree that Miracle gro soil is worthless for aeration of roots. Once you wet it out, if you live in a humid climate, or have it in a humid greenhouse, it takes FOREVER to dry out. It's fine here for mid-summer potting of containers that are in full sun, but don't even think about using it in the fall or winter in Indiana unless you cut it 50/50 with perlite. Don't cut it with bark and then pot it up for a long term plant, because that changes the ph of your mix over time as the bark decomposes, it ties up the nitrogen and you'll end up with very light green, spindly thin weak growth, unless you change the ph of your watering/fertilizing water. If you have a lot of plants, unless you mixed all the soil at the same ratio with bark, then you have a lot of different ph levels to adjust. Too much work!
And I would love to go organic in my greenhouse. Just give me the name of a fertilizer that won't run off the customers with the smell, that I can apply in a convenient way (and that I can actually afford-that would be a nice bonus!), a soil that drains properly for long term production, and some pesticides that actually kill more bugs than leaves.
My 2 cents worth!
Sandy @ Northern Tropics
yes I would have to agree with the people that did not like miracle gro ,in my opion its crap soil if you even want to call it that ,I call it fake soil. If you have to buy a soil that is avalible almost anywhere i would buy fertilome it has no built in fertilizers so you can add what you need ,not all plants like the same N P K so why give them all the same by buying miracle gro ,I only use fertilome and sometimes mix my own soil mixture ,but my base that i use for my soil mixture always starts out with a bag of fertilome in the equation. Jason .Grower of many different tropicals!!!!
bananimal
12-27-2007, 08:51 PM
I think it should be undersood that there is MirGro potting soil -------- and there is MirGro Potting Mix. Potting Mix is sterile. This is why plants of any kind survive much better with it. And to take it up another knotch, we here in Fla have "Bushel Stop"; they have a special potting mix that allows max drainage and the right nutrients to keep the pups moving well along past the sword stage. I have tried Mg soil, Mg mix, native dirt (lots of sand and muckage), all peat moss - but let me tell ya -- the Bush Stop mix of sand, peatmoss, manure, bark chips, "secret dirt" tops them all. Max drainage; and in hot weather all you have to do is water more often. The plants don't die -- period.:2124:
Dan
mskitty38583
12-27-2007, 08:52 PM
1-bag (2 cubic ft) miricle gro potting MIX
1-bag (8 qt.) cactus/ citrus potting mix
1 to 1 and 1/2 bags (8 qt.) perilite
mix together in a large lidded tote. i keep mine in the house so it dosent get bugs from outside in it.
CookieCows
12-27-2007, 09:06 PM
to give me an idea of how fast the soil should drain ... how often do you water your indoor, wintering nanas? Should the soil become dry and then drench them? These are growing and in front of a south facing window in the bathroom
mskitty38583
12-27-2007, 09:28 PM
i have pulled 2 nanas out of dormancy and i water when the soil is dry 2 inches down in the dirt. and i feed them 1 time every week.
CookieCows
12-27-2007, 09:38 PM
Well I was trying to figure out if you have a time frame so I know what the dry out time would be with the proper soil mix but I forgot that I bought the soil moisture tester today and can check with that to know what's going on below the top 2" and know if it's draining good all the way down.
I appreciate everyone's advice
mskitty38583
12-27-2007, 09:43 PM
i dont use a time frame for watering my nanas. they have temps in the nana room of 70-75 *f day and nite. i have a humidifier going 24/7 and i just use the stick a finger in the dirt method.( it works well with my non- tropicals) if it aint broke dont fix it kind of thing. however i am sure that the more experienced growers have better was to do this, all i can tell you is what works for me.
formontcalamus
12-27-2007, 11:04 PM
O.K. you guys . . . you are going to get in trouble with Logos !!
Retail potting mixes in small bags are all formulated for "bedding plants" like Begonias, Impacience, etc., to be used in small containers: 4", 6" max. In larger pots these mixes all decompose into a mess of emulsified goop ! And they are all too expensive to use in big pots.
Newly forming roots on cuttings and transplants need a relatively acid soil. Adding Pine Bark is not good 'cause it decomposes to goop if the pot contains too much. Commercial mixes in nurseries often have Pine bark but it is usually "charcoaled" to discourage emulsification.
Ever notice that the lable on potting mix and "cow manure" give the weight of the bag ? How is that possible if the contents are supposed to be organic. We all know if you shovel 20 lbs. of manure or organic soil into a pot, in a few months it will weigh much less. In other words, commercial mixes are all treated with decomposition inhibiting chemicals. Bad for plant, especially bad for roots.
Roots . . . Rooting cuttings and new forming roots start growing with tiney micro roots which can be damaged by heavy fertilizer and other chemicals. Also, if your soil mix contains too much Pearlite and just granular soil "it moves" which tears micro roots, stopping or slowing down groth. Consider this: with a grainy soil (with Pearlite) every time thunder strikes or a big truck come down your road the slightest vibration kills micro roots.
If your soil contains ""Fiber"" it becomes stable. Also new roots like to "follow" the lengths of fibers which gives the roots stability from damage.
This is why I have the reputation for growing the most healthy beautiful plants in all of Puerto Rico (same previously in Florida). I use Cypress mulch as at least 50% of soil content with river sand and a small content of Peat Moss. It is on the acid side of neutral, it drains fast and decomposes slower than root advancement avoiding emulsification. Its also cheap! If water drains fast, you need no moisture testing. If the contents are natural Cypress and Peat moss, it is naturally acid and you need no PH testing.
To test this method . . . put three inches of Cypress mulch in the bottom of a 3 gallon pot (10" pot) and fill the pot with Miricle Grow. Plant in this a fast growing plant like a Banana pup. In 2 to 3 months turn over and look. You will see all the roots in the bottom and none in the retail mix.
"If you try to do everything perfectly, your likely to do everything wrong"
mskitty38583
12-27-2007, 11:08 PM
have to try the cypress mulch. the only time we get it in cookvegas is in the summer. so i guess ill have to wait after all to cut my dogwoods.ha ha(didnt want to cut them anyway) :bananajoy: :bananajoy: :bananajoy: :bananajoy:
who uses small bags of anything????? lol
CookieCows
12-27-2007, 11:16 PM
That makes so much sense. You explain things so clearly!! As soon as I post this I'll look on the web to see if I can buy cyprus mulch locally.
Thank you!
Deb
CookieCows
12-27-2007, 11:20 PM
kitty if you go over to the rootings and cuttings thread you'll see Logo's first comment on that with putting the cuttings into the spahgum moss .. I used that today. Couldn't get the Canadian brand so am hoping that any brand will do.
CookieCows
12-27-2007, 11:30 PM
doesn't look like I can get the cyprus mulch, mskitty's right. We live in ajoining states so pretty close together. Can I just mix the spahgum moss in with the potting mix? I've got to pull those pups out I think and re-do the mix.
CookieCows
12-27-2007, 11:38 PM
OH I forgot.. the spahgum moss retains water so I guess that isn't want I want to mix in with the soil!
bananimal
12-28-2007, 01:42 PM
Logos,
When you were in Fla where did you get cypress mulch? Do you mean the red stuff commonly used as landscape top dressing? Comes red stained and natural, right? And what about "river" sand?
Dan
Ahava
12-28-2007, 06:31 PM
About Cypress mulch... http://www.actionstudio.org/public/page_view_all.cfm?option=begin&pageid=7467
GpD79
12-28-2007, 10:21 PM
Wow...I never knew that about the cypress tree. It looks like we better find an alternative for it. At least I will.
mskitty38583
12-28-2007, 10:51 PM
i wont ever use it again, thats for sure. did you sign the petition?
Ahava
12-28-2007, 11:25 PM
i wont ever use it again, thats for sure. did you sign the petition?
I filled out the little petition myself. It's definately a concern. We always need to be careful of the materials we use if possible.
formontcalamus
12-29-2007, 02:08 AM
Bananimal . . . The Cypress mulch available in Florida comes mostly from State sponsored programs (in N. central Fla. where seedling Cypress is being cleared for farmland (Trenton Fla. near Gainsville) and in The Big Cypress where small trees are cut to alow large tree to develope. Cutting is paid for by the state). The Big Trees you see in photos in Louisiana are being cut for "lumber", and Cypress bark is usually a waste product. I am not defending the bark companies because they also contribute to forest destruction. But thoes really big trees have been cut down for the last 90 years for very valuable lumber. It is the same situation as in Oregon where the whole state is being clear cut to provide lumber for the booming home construction in Florida. (Here in Puerto Rico all houses are built of Concrete, floors, walls and roofs. Do you live in a wooden house ? Would you like to give it back to Oregon ? It is a real delema, isn't it? And what about where you live in Port St. Lucie . . . several of the worlds largest paper mills right next door, clearing thousands of acres of forest a year ?
Western societies, mostly USA, consume about 3/4 of the worlds natural resources. The paper products made from trees, packaging at your local suppermarket, Walmart, K-mart, even the boxes we ship and share plants in are all made of MULCH. We are all guilty ! Perhaps the only answer is to re-cycle as much as we can.
At least in Florida the EPA has a thousand dollar or more fine for anyone, including lumber companies who may cut down a Cypress tree larger that (I think) 1-1/2' circunfrence. I know not about Louisiana.
I use about five bags of Cypress mulch per week for rooting and small pots. The landscapers in Florida . . . I know many who use 500 bags a day or more. I have always worried about where it is all comming from and which beautiful forest is being cleared. Big trees are definately not cut for mulch, they are cut for lumber. Mulch is made from the trimmings cut from milling. Mostly, but also harmfull is too much clearing of seedling Cypress. I think the companies that do it are not trustworthy to cut only a few here and there.
The Red died Cypress mulch is probably toxic to plants. If you use it, use only natural.
formontcalamus
12-29-2007, 02:22 AM
I hope you are all happy . . . you guys got me feeling so guilty. Even my wife agrees with you'all. I won't be able to sleep tonight. Think I'll go out and sleep in the shed with the cats tonight. At least they are not so judgemental !
mskitty38583
12-29-2007, 02:22 AM
when you cut a tree you should replace it with 2 trees. that way there is a greater chance of survival by at least one tree. and if both grow hay thats awsome and even better. i have 2 ironside oaks that unfortunately have to be moved. thats what happens when someone just sticks a tree in the ground and dosent relize its gonna get bigger. i have been putting this off for almost 2 yrs now. i just cant wait anymore. so instead of just planting the 2 trees back(different species ) i will plant a fence row. you never have enough trees. wonder if cypress will grow in middle tn...have to do some reading..
mskitty38583
12-29-2007, 02:23 AM
we are not judging, were just informing. maybe the cats will be mad at you too. lol. just joking. its gonna be an endangered tree if we dont do something. sorry.....
magicgreen
12-29-2007, 04:05 PM
Whew........What a wealth of knowledge! I had to start at the original post and work my way forward!
Iam constantly learning on this site! I never {honestly} gave too much thought about the environment before becoming a member here! The oceans, cyprus trees,environmental factors,soil, composting, air, food we eat, genetic testing, till i came here!
Iam a city person and my world has consisted of robbery, murder, theft, you name it!
All of you have expanded my mind!
Thank-you---------Magicgreen
microfarmer
12-30-2007, 12:51 PM
anyone know where to get large bags of pearlite?
I got a huge bag (lawn and leaf sized) of perlite and vermiculite at Home Despot in the grass seed aisle, not the bagged potting mix area.
when you cut a tree you should replace it with 2 trees. that way there is a greater chance of survival by at least one tree. and if both grow hay thats awsome and even better. i have 2 ironside oaks that unfortunately have to be moved. thats what happens when someone just sticks a tree in the ground and dosent relize its gonna get bigger. i have been putting this off for almost 2 yrs now. i just cant wait anymore. so instead of just planting the 2 trees back(different species ) i will plant a fence row. you never have enough trees. wonder if cypress will grow in middle tn...have to do some reading..
Mskitty, I have removed 0 and planted over 30 fruit trees since I moved into my home 9 years ago. That isn't including any of my 25 bananas, as everyone here knows, bananas don't grow on trees... The house next door was bought by an arsonist and after burning the house to the ground, he cut down all but 2 trees on the lot including a 70 foot tall Elm and 7 full grown Cypress (French?). He replaced the Cypress wall with a bare cinderblock wall and black iron fencing... It looked like a prison... The new owner at least finally stuccoed the wall. I planted bananas to help break up the sterile-ness of all the concrete.
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=5009&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5009)
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=5010&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5010)
Oh, after the arsonist rebuilt the house double the size of the original, he immediately put it up for sale. I figure I need to plant another 30 trees just to replace the Elm. Now if only the new owner would finish the irrigation he's been installing for the last year...
I can't complain though as my Studebaker has been out front the whole time. At least it was hidden under all the Cypress.
What I use for potting soil is Kellogg's patio plus. It has manure, worm castings, bat guano, and a few other things. It is not good for winter, as it holds too much water. Summer it is a dream for the plants. Whae I initially water in, I try to recapture the runoff as it is a wonderful tea that I water other plants with.
mskitty38583
12-30-2007, 01:25 PM
i havent taken any out yet.i have planted 11 trees in my yard. when i bought my house 1 yr ago, 2yrs ago? i cant even remember, there was 5 trees in my yard. these older trees in my yard are not in the best of health, i hate to take them out but its a lose lose situation, to leave them. so ive been trying to decide what to replace them with. the ones in the side yard are going to be replaced with nanas( i hope). the tree by the road isnt bad, but it is starting to rot and bugs are eating it. it may sound stupid but i can almost feel its pain. my parets had 3 HUGE maples (they were very old) remove out of their yard and i sat there and cried. tree freak here. my parents planted 2 dogwoods and i bought her a weeping black cherry tree. by my count their 3 trees short of the 2 for one goal. lol before i bought my present house i lived in a house that had a maple tree that was over 200yrs old( guy from the extension office guessed at the age.) it was a beautiful tree. i fought w/ the city, they wanted to take the whole tree down and i told them no. it was on my property and they could take the limbs over and under the power lines,i told them they were limited to taking just the limbs. so they trimmed about 10 branches( big ones) and she looked better. not 3 months after we moved out half of the tree broke off and missed the house by 1/2 ft. the wierd thing, the tree was healthy, the trunk was stable and when it didnt rain it got watered. as for your neighbor maybe you should offer him a housewarming present..maybe a tree or two. the arbor day foundation offers free trees with a 15.00 membership. and it might be a good way to introduce him to lowering his monthly energy bills.( stratigically placed trees in the landscape).if no one has told you this then i will, thank you for your upkeep, maintance and the planting of trees in your yard. may you never run out of room to plant a tree.no mater what kind it is.
CookieCows
12-30-2007, 06:30 PM
I can't speak for Cyprus trees but I grew up in No. Calif. and Southern Oregon and I know that the methodology for clear cutting over there has changed since the old days of ignorance. The forestry chooses areas of forest that need regeneration where normally a forest fire would do it naturally and we sure don't need as big of forest fires as we have over there,or as many.... so clear cutting actually prevents fires and in fact allows certain plant species and animals that need open areas a place to survive.
I use miracle grow potting soil for all my plants and have never had a problem. For my bananas I mix 1/3 miracle grow potting soil, 1/3 perlite and 1/3 peatmoss. I have a saba and a mysore from Ted at Greenearth in that mix and they are putting out a new leaf every week. It drains very well when I water them. I also use it on all my houseplants and on my tomatoes that are grown in very large pots during the warmer month.
Sib
mskitty38583
12-30-2007, 10:15 PM
cookiecow you are very correct. it is when they clearcut and dont replace that its bad. in ga. where we hauled chalk out of the mines, the law requires that the company re-claime the land. there are 2 options( unless they have changed in the last8 yrs) they can fill back in the 1.5 mile deep holes and plant trees( they have a certian number of trees to be planted per acre) or they can turn it into a park like setting with some of the biggest ponds you have ever seen. when they opt for the ponds it has got to be managed and it has to have areation pipes put in it( chalk sucks air) they must also take chemical readings 2 times a week, for 2 yrs to make sure when they stock the pond the fish will survive. most of the time they opt for the trees to be planted. its less work. and yes for the forest to rejuvinate it self fire is the best, but we dont want that, so some cutting is good. however MY OPINION, you should still plant 2 for 1. if not in the same place as the original cut , close to it.
CookieCows
12-30-2007, 10:37 PM
Yeah, I'm not going to dump out the miracle grow I planted my two pups in.. will just take what I need out and add the perlite and peat. I have one lemon tree that I noticed has some mildew on the dirt (surface) and I bet I need to pull that out and add perlite also. They've done fine for 3 years and I repotted this fall before I brought inside for the winter and put them in straight potting soil. I know now that perlite is important!
I think our feet are getting wet ....
Tony O
12-31-2007, 12:29 AM
wonder if cypress will grow in middle tn...have to do some reading..
If they'll grow for me here, they should grow there for you. I collected a few cypress seeds about 20 some odd years ago from Louisiana. I really didn't know it they could live here in zone 6, but I grew them to one gallon pot size & planted them anyway. I now have a grouping of 4 beautiful Louisiana cypress trees by the edge of my pond. They've even started putting up knees last year. :2559: Up until the last few winters, they've taken from single digits, to below 0*f almost every winter. I say, "Go for it!!!" :0517:
mskitty38583
12-31-2007, 11:15 AM
i actually have a grapefruit seed sprouting. in the whole ruby red grapefruit there was 2 seeds. i thought that odd. but i have it growing in my banana mix. my pondarosa havent sprouted yet but i feel it getting close! as long as their feet arent wet they should be ok cookie. if they are getting wet you might need to get them out of it before root rot starts. my white bird of pradise seed went kapoot, but thats ok, ill get some more and start all over again. the soil i put them in was to heavy and it didnt drain well. so my seeds rotted. a single tear rolls down my cheek..sorry moment.
Mustang
01-01-2008, 05:33 PM
I use a mix of coir/perlite/mini bark chips/slow release fertiliser for bigger plants, and a mix of perlite/vermiculite/coir for seedlings.
I use the highly compressed coir blocks, and wet it with a solution containing neem, fungicide, root hormone and plant booster. For nanas, I also use Mycorrhizal fungi when I remember!
CookieCows
01-01-2008, 06:17 PM
Mustang do you use this mixture with no soil at all or do you mean that you add it to soil?
Mustang
01-01-2008, 07:07 PM
No soil. For seedlings, no soil at all. For my other plants, they are all in pots so again, no soil.
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