View Full Version : Overwintering
enigma99a
07-26-2008, 04:47 AM
Well, it's almost August and I'm already thinking about the winter. Currently have 2 Dwarf Cavendish (+8 pups), a musa basjoo(+3 pups) and 4 Blue Java Ice cream... of course everything is doing well now, but the cold will be here in December. I'm living in the Sacramento area, and last winter it got down to 28F at my house! Typically we have 2-4 nights in the 28-31 range per year. Maybe a handful of 32 nights. We've been lucky to have two COLD+dry arctic blast winters in a row! :0493:
My question for all you experts out there, is there anything I can do to save the leaves in the winter? Will a frost blanket be enough if the temp reaches 30F? If I need to do something extraordinary, I'm will doing to do so :)
Would lights, fans, or frost blankets help? I don't want to overdo it... my wife already thinks I am crazy lol
enigma99a
07-26-2008, 05:46 AM
Going back in history, a warm winter was 2002-2003 where it only froze twice at 30F. But two times or 20 times, I need to protect my precious bananas :)
stumpy4700
07-26-2008, 12:50 PM
is potting them and bringing them inside an option?
mskitty38583
07-26-2008, 02:27 PM
is potting them and bringing them inside an option?
if that is not an option...build a gh around them.
buzzybee
07-26-2008, 02:35 PM
Hi! I am new to banana plants just in the last 6 weeks but I have been researching some ways to overwinter my new Musa Basjoo also. I live in SW Michigan. One thing I read that I have been pondering is someone said they use the large C-9 size Christmas tree light strings and wrap the trunks before covering the tree in a cold snap. I do not know if that would burn the leaves or not without seeing an actual picture but it would produce some sort of heat source. Just thought I would pass that along. :2722:
enigma99a
07-26-2008, 05:53 PM
if that is not an option...build a gh around them.
gh? What is a gh? I know the trunks will be fine even without protection because it just doesn't get that cold here usually. But I hate to have the bananas start over on leafing every year... :(
enigma99a
07-26-2008, 05:56 PM
is potting them and bringing them inside an option?
My wife would kill me if I tried that:) haha
Bananaman88
07-26-2008, 06:05 PM
gh means greenhouse. She probably means a miniature, temporary greenhouse. Just to get them through a cold night or two.
Simply Bananas
07-26-2008, 07:14 PM
I would write off the leaves for the winter. Wrapping the leaves will likely break them any way or cause rot. I have best results letting the frost do as it may and start back in the spring. I have seen no adverse affects to 20F nights other than an occasional March/April bloom with not enough leaves.
I can only speak from experience with Basjoo and Ice Cream in your case, both are well able to withstand low 20's for a few nights over the winter. They recover fast in the spring.
mskitty38583
07-26-2008, 09:40 PM
gh means greenhouse. She probably means a miniature, temporary greenhouse. Just to get them through a cold night or two.
thank you bananaman88, thats exactly what i ment. sorry for the lack of information.
enigma99a
07-26-2008, 11:38 PM
What about setting a portable heater near it? Just enough to keep it above 32. Because here in the winter, 95% of the nights are above freezing, and a frost blanket would be enough to keep the leaves from getting damage. But for the few nights it freezes, what about setting out a portable heater near them. also what about fans? I know out here they use giant fans in the crops to keep plants from freezing.
natedogg1026
07-27-2008, 01:57 PM
I would just chop the leaves when they get burnt and let it go to it's semi-dormant state for winter unless you build a GH around them. Keep in mind that once the temps go below 57 the nana stops growing. I think your fighting a loosing battle. Maybe you should pot em up and just bring them in when it's cold. My opinion.One thing I read that I have been pondering is someone said they use the large C-9 size Christmas tree light strings and wrap the trunks before covering the tree in a cold snap. I do not know if that would burn the leaves or not without seeing an actual picture but it would produce some sort of heat source. Buzz. You're in Z5. The leaves are a lost cause, chop em. Cut the stem at 18" (or however much you wanna save) Build a cage around it, fill it with leaves, and then cover with DOUBLE plastic. It's that easy. Basjoo's are VERY HARDY.:03:
buzzybee
07-27-2008, 02:18 PM
Yeah, I know the leaves are goners here in Michigan for the winter but I was just suggesting the C-9 lights for enigma 99 with the tree in California for a cold snap just to give it some warmth until it passed.
As for mine, I am leaving mine in the ground and mulching with straw and then filling trash bags with dry leaves and placing them around the trunk, weighing them down with a brick and filling the space around the trunk with more leaves and THEN covering the whole thing with a tarp to keep it dry. We have plenty of leaves. What do you think? Thanx in advance for your input! :waving: Any other Michiganders out there with experience?
I have lots to learn. ;-)
natedogg1026
07-27-2008, 02:55 PM
Oh I got ya. Sounds like you got a good plan for winter. Should work great. My dad never even got around to putting plasic over his and they survived with a foot of oak leaves on top. They made it through the ice storm and are now 8'! They are an amazing nana!!
enigma99a
07-27-2008, 03:06 PM
Yeah, I know the leaves are goners here in Michigan for the winter but I was just suggesting the C-9 lights for enigma 99 with the tree in California for a cold snap just to give it some warmth until it passed.
As for mine, I am leaving mine in the ground and mulching with straw and then filling trash bags with dry leaves and placing them around the trunk, weighing them down with a brick and filling the space around the trunk with more leaves and THEN covering the whole thing with a tarp to keep it dry. We have plenty of leaves. What do you think? Thanx in advance for your input! :waving: Any other Michiganders out there with experience?
I have lots to learn. ;-)
Hmm Christmas lights.. i've heard of doing that but wasn't sure what size, but now you said C9:) Is it a fire hazard/dangerous to use C9 lights in combination with a frost blanket or cover? or if C9 lights are in use, there is no need for a frost cover?
buzzybee
07-27-2008, 03:20 PM
things that make you say hmmmmmmm........I am not sure either about the blanket. I guess it is just a trial and error thing unless someone has experience with it but then again if it could be a fire hazzard you want to be cautious with that too. Growing bananas or (going bananas :) is all new to me! One good thing about raising them in more tempid climates I would think is that even if you make a mistake you probably won't lose the plant. Might make it ugly for a while but it most likely will recover? :goteam: I will see if I can find out where I read about the C9 lights and find any more info.
Can someone tell me how to get my state and zone to appear by my signature? How did I miss entering that?
enigma99a
07-27-2008, 03:55 PM
things that make you say hmmmmmmm........I am not sure either about the blanket. I guess it is just a trial and error thing unless someone has experience with it but then again if it could be a fire hazzard you want to be cautious with that too. Growing bananas or (going bananas :) is all new to me! One good thing about raising them in more tempid climates I would think is that even if you make a mistake you probably won't lose the plant. Might make it ugly for a while but it most likely will recover? :goteam: I will see if I can find out where I read about the C9 lights and find any more info.
Can someone tell me how to get my state and zone to appear by my signature? How did I miss entering that?
Thanks:) Oh and you can go to http://www.bananas.org/profile.php?do=editprofile and enter your info there. If that link doesn't work, go to User CP on the top left, and then edit profile.
Yah that is the good thing about growing in more tempid climates, you don't lose the plants. In fact, in my area, LOTS of people are growing bananas in my neighborhood and they are very popular throughout the city. The worst that happens to an unprotected banana here (any variety) is that the leaves fall off and the plant resumes from the top of the P Stem again.. but still.. it takes them a couple months to really get growing quick again.
I am going to try the C9 lights as you mentioned and if it is a mild winter this year, I predict I can keep the leaves. (I will probably fail though;) That's what makes growing bananas so fun... trying to keep them alive much as possible and hopefully get fruit in the summer :P
buzzybee
07-27-2008, 04:52 PM
thanks enigma 99a on the heads up on how to enter zone, etc. I got it. :)
I guess I better sign off and get outside while the sun is till shining this afternoon. It is beauuuuutiful here. :) It will be gone all too soon and back to gray sunless days. ;-(
john_ny
07-28-2008, 07:42 AM
Buzz- Are you sure about the C9 lights? It would seem to me that they would get too hot. I'm not positive, but it seems that what I've heard is to use the mini lights. However, you would have to make sure that they are the regular, or older type, not the new LEDs. They don't get warm.
buzzybee
07-28-2008, 08:35 AM
Good Morning, John ny
Thanks for the input. Ya know, last night I tried to find the site I saw that info about the C-9 lites and I could not locate it......yet. But I will keep on looking. You might be right. I have not used C-9 lites for a long time and they might be too hot. I wonder if placing them on the ground in a circle around the trunk but giving it some space so it would not touch and burn the plant would be a better thing to do as heat rises. Hmmmmmm again......Like I said trial and error I guess unless you know someone who has first hand experience. That's what's so fun about these boards. You can find out oh so much info. It's grrrrrreat! ;)
bencelest
07-28-2008, 08:54 AM
My personal experience was this:
I bought a matured flowering California gold around September 2 years ago. I transplanted it to the ground right away and When Winter came I wrapped the trunk, and part of the leaves with burlap and then put the mini (clear) Christmas lights around the trunk, part of the leaves and spread the lights around the ground . After that, I wrapped them with clear plastic to keep them dry. I put the C lights on a timer to be auto turn at night.
When Spring came and when I opened my treasure, anything that was wrapped with burlap and C lights were green including the fruit and the much lesser leaf around 1 foot square.
Any leaves outside the wrapped turned brown and burnt.
Needless to say I was able to harvest the fruit but it took so long because of the much lesser leaf that was left and someone told me that the greens from the P-stem would be enough to sustain nutrients for the fruit to grow.
buzzybee
07-28-2008, 11:55 AM
Thanks Bencelest for the great info and clearing some things up but by C lights you mean the mini christmas lites, not the C-9 correct?
How cold does your weather get that you have to wrap trees in California?
bencelest
07-28-2008, 03:27 PM
Buzz:
That is correct. I believe that the C-9 will be too hot for the bananas when used in enclosed space. I think 100 Christmas lights per plug and at $1.75 ea when on sale after Christmas. You'll be surprise how warm they get in enclosed space. I always used them with my newly planted small citrus plants. We have many nights of 40 to 45 degrees in my area and sometimes dip to 34 degrees 4 to 5 times a year.
john_ny
07-28-2008, 04:22 PM
I think Benny's got it pretty well nailed. I remember that we used to call the C9 bulbs, "outdoor lights", (the slightly smaller C7's were, "indoor".) And if you grabbed one when lit, you could burn your fingers. Even the minis get pretty hot, However, as I said, make sure you don't get the LED ones that have been around for the last couple of years. They're the same as the little lights on the computer, charger, etc., and give off virtually no heat.
enigma99a
07-28-2008, 05:18 PM
My personal experience was this:
I bought a matured flowering California gold around September 2 years ago. I transplanted it to the ground right away and When Winter came I wrapped the trunk, and part of the leaves with burlap and then put the mini (clear) Christmas lights around the trunk, part of the leaves and spread the lights around the ground . After that, I wrapped them with clear plastic to keep them dry. I put the C lights on a timer to be auto turn at night.
When Spring came and when I opened my treasure, anything that was wrapped with burlap and C lights were green including the fruit and the much lesser leaf around 1 foot square.
Any leaves outside the wrapped turned brown and burnt.
Needless to say I was able to harvest the fruit but it took so long because of the much lesser leaf that was left and someone told me that the greens from the P-stem would be enough to sustain nutrients for the fruit to grow.
So you put the C lights under the burlap right? I'm assuming I could use a white frost blanket as well? Is the plastic wrap make a lot of difference?
bencelest
07-28-2008, 11:24 PM
Enigma:
I was just experimenting at that time and it was my first time I got "hooked" on bananas.
I put the C lights over the burlap.
I first wrap the P-stem with burlap then I wrapped the Christmas lights over and over the P-stem and thinking that we would have a lot of rain coming I protect the Christmas lights with clear plastics and to hold everything together I tied them with strings.To give warmth to the soil I spread Christmas lights at the base of the trunk and cover them with black plastics. It worked.
I am sure frost blanket will work better than burlap.
But this winter I am thinking to use the insulating material that one uses inside the house walls.
I may not need to use C lights after all.
Yes, John is right. Don't use the LED lights because they don't heat up. On minis you can feel the warmth when you put your hand close on a string of those minis.
enigma99a
07-29-2008, 01:59 AM
I ordered a 6' X 100' roll from American Nettings & Fabric Inc. Crop cover, Frost Blanket & Overwintering products. (http://www.americannettings.com/packaged_products/crop_cover/crop_cover.htm) today. $28.. not bad. (link wasn't working so I just called them)
I am planning on taking some twine and bring them together in an upright fashion. Then take xmas lights and circle around the banana, and finally wrap it up with frost covers from top to bottom. I think it will work:)
edd82
07-29-2008, 05:28 AM
My wife would kill me if I tried that:) haha
I've suggested it to my girlfriend and she pretty much said the same thing :ha:
enigma99a
07-29-2008, 05:57 AM
I've suggested it to my girlfriend and she pretty much said the same thing :ha:
haha. What about kick the cars out of the garage, put down 2 ft of dirt, install a couple skylights and lights and make it a greenhouse! Would she go for that? :ha:
bencelest
07-29-2008, 07:05 AM
Enigma:
That's a very good plan!
Better than my plan.
At that time, I just used what was on hand because of the frost prediction that night.
paula
08-20-2008, 06:35 AM
Can any tell me how cold would my basement have to be
to overwinter my trees. I had them down there last year
they did great. But they had drafty windows. I am getting
new ones installed . I turn off the heater down there,
but don't know if it will be cold enough.Please let me know
maybe I will have to leave a window open.But I don't what
to do that either , my laundry room is also down there.
Buy the way it is a finished basement, so it's not that cold
around 60 - 65. Thanks for any info.Paula
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