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Richard
08-11-2017, 03:42 PM
Some time ago in a place not too far away ... Greenie (http://www.bananas.org/member-greenie.html) began growing this SH 3640.

SH-3640 9/15/07
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=5533&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5533)

I'm not sure how he obtained it -- perhaps from NANAMAN (http://www.bananas.org/member-nanaman.html), or visa-versa, or ...?

Anyway, with no surprise pup(s) of this plant eventually found their way to bananimal (http://www.bananas.org/member-bananimal.html) and then (through servatusprime (http://www.bananas.org/member-servatusprime.html)) to crazy banana (http://www.bananas.org/member-crazy-banana.html). And I -- having wanted this plant (Greenie's) for nearly a decade was thrilled to obtain one from her last year.

In the meantime PR-Giants (http://www.bananas.org/member-pr-giants.html) began distributing SH-3640 'High Noon' a few years ago. I presume he obtained this cultivar from TARS Mayaguez (https://www.ars.usda.gov/southeast-area/mayaguez-pr/tropical-crops-and-germplasm-research/). I believe this is the plant being grown by HMelendez (http://www.bananas.org/member-hmelendez.html), TyTaylor (http://www.bananas.org/member-tytaylor77.html), and possibly several others.

It has been pointed out elsewhere that these two plants have nearly identical growth habit and appearance but the inflorescences do not match. What I have observed about the plant I'm growing:
- Cavendish-like structure with petioles following one right after another
- Red edges along petioles but green midribs
- Broad leaves
So that leads me to believe its genetics contain two 'AA's followed by a 'B' and 'A' in unknown order. But I have yet to see an inflorescence and probably won't until next year. Time will tell. :)

http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=62110&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=62110&ppuser=1558)

http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=62109&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=62109&ppuser=1558)

Tytaylor77
08-12-2017, 01:51 AM
Looks great Richard! Mine is the USDA Tars Mayaguez! It is the same as Hectors!

I see some differences already! Mine has a lot of black on the pstem. Thank you for the pictures! I'm excited to contimue comparing mine to your pictures in the future!

Anyone know where Grennie obtained it from?

Mine is about 7'. Still hasn't pupped. Next year I hope to fruit mine. Richard when I get good sized pups next year your welcome to have a free one to compare if you have room! Just PM me.

I find mine looks very similar to the USDA Tars FHIA-01 Goldfinger only it has a more slim pstem. I'm sure it's the dwarf Brazilian parent plant showing in both!

Keep us updated! I will be following this for sure!!

Richard
08-12-2017, 02:20 AM
Looks great Richard! Mine is the USDA Tars Mayaguez! It is the same as Hectors!

Thanks for the validation :)

I see some differences already! Mine has a lot of black on the pstem.

That could be due to our differences in humidity ... or not!

Thank you for the pictures! I'm excited to continue comparing mine to your pictures in the future!

:woohoonaner:

Anyone know where Greenie obtained it from?

Greenie and NANAMAN are both still active here ... check it out on their profile pages.

Mine is about 7'. Still hasn't pupped. Next year I hope to fruit mine. Richard when I get good sized pups next year your welcome to have a free one to compare if you have room! Just PM me.

7' going into Fall. This is good, perhaps it will bloom in March or April.

Thanks so much for the offer of a pup ... I'm estatic :nanadrink:

I find mine looks very similar to the USDA Tars FHIA-01 Goldfinger only it has a more slim pstem. I'm sure it's the dwarf Brazilian parent plant showing in both!

Yes, they are both AAAB but arrived at in different breeding sequences. There are of course other AAAB tetraploids that are wholly different, incl. FHIA-18, and FHIA-21.
:nanarobot:

HMelendez
08-12-2017, 05:02 AM
Richard,




As you and Ty mentioned, my SH-3640 High Noon 'Nana is also, the USDA TARS Mayaguez!.....Right now, I got three SH-3640 High Noon 'Nanas blooming!.....All three SH-3640's are approx. 10 ft. tall at flowering/blooming!.....SH-3640 is a very stout, strong and robust 'Nana plant!..... You can check the thread http://www.bananas.org/f2/fhia-21-plantain-sh-3640-nana-47226.html.....

sputinc7
08-12-2017, 07:14 AM
Just as I suspected some time ago... Two different 3640's, and some love it and some hate it...that's why.
Mine is very much like GM or Cav... wide open petioles with lots of red on the fringes.. Basically a stouter GM with wider leaves.
Ty, when mine pupped, it did it around 6 feet, and dropped 3 all of a sudden at one time. One day, nothing... the next day, 3. BAM!
I hope yours pups soon... Winter's on it's way.

Richard
08-12-2017, 01:49 PM
... wide open petioles with lots of red on the fringes ...

By "fringes" -- do you mean petiole edges, or blade edges, or ?

Info:Plant Morphology - Bananas Wiki (http://www.bananas.org/wiki/Info:Plant_Morphology)

Richard
08-12-2017, 02:23 PM
... Two different 3640's ...

Actually there may be more. Further, I'm not sold on the idea there is only one "true" SH-3640. For example, consider all the variation among Pisang Awak. My personal interest is how this famous plant from Greenie tastes!
:woohoonaner:

sputinc7
08-12-2017, 04:43 PM
I was speaking of the petioles when I mentioned fringes, so it's the fringes of the petioles. Definition of fringe:

fringe
frinj
noun
1.
an ornamental border of threads left loose or formed into tassels or twists, used to edge clothing or material.
synonyms: edging, edge, border, trimming, frill, flounce, ruffle;

So, fringes, edges, borders, frills, edging... whatever synonym you choose to use, they are red.
Here are some pics of the 3640 I have...
I got this one from Wormfarmer last year about this time. I don't know where he got his from. It's a strong grower and not afraid of the cold. I have not seen a flower yet, but am hoping soon. The first pic is the plant from a few feet away...

http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=62114&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=62114&ppuser=22903)

The next one is a little closer so you can see the colors on the petioles better. The leaf edges have a color, but not red like the GM.

http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=62111&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=62111&ppuser=22903)

Compare those to the petioles of my GM, which I got from SDDarkman as a TC a year and 3 months ago (Very similar)...

http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=62112&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=62112&ppuser=22903)

One more, of the pups. They are now only about 2 months old (6/15 ) Note the minor coloring on the leaf, wine stains...

http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=62113&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=62113&ppuser=22903)

As for how many there are, it's anybody's guess... I know I have heard some talk about 3640 and think it's great, and others say it's awful. I find it difficult that opinions could be so polarized among so many if they were all the same. Also, the descriptions of color and flavor seem to vary somewhat, thus I concluded they cannot all be speaking of the same banana...My personal interest mirrors yours, Richard... If I like it, I really don't care what it is, officially, other than to be able to speak of it here and to have others know definitively of what I speak. It's difficult to have an intelligent discussion about something when you both believe you speak of one thing when,in reality, it is two different things.

Richard
08-12-2017, 05:18 PM
... Here are some pics of the 3640 I have ...

Thanks for the great photos! :08:

From Worm_Farmer (http://www.bananas.org/member-worm_farmer.html) you say -- another long time member. I would guess he obtained it from bananimal (http://www.bananas.org/member-bananimal.html) etc.

I also have the GM from sddarkman619 (http://www.bananas.org/member-sddarkman619.html). It definately has the red "fringes", but the early leaves have wine markings whereas the SH-3640 did not.

sputinc7
08-12-2017, 09:05 PM
My GM has only recently pupped, as in just a few days ago (8/6) , so I do not know of wine stains on it's pups yet, but they are obvious on the 3640 I got from Worm Farmer last year. (I went to his house here in Palm bay. He gave me some Namwah, which confirmed to me that I do not like them)... The GM TC I got definitely had wine stains on it.
So long as my bananas taste good, I am not going to be too upset. But the GM better taste like GM because I know what they taste like and I want them to be the real deal. (unless Nick has the wrong thing, which I doubt). I know some poo poo GM, but they are an outstanding banana in my book. Every one is like the best banana you ever had, that tastes like a banana, of course. Like the most perfect Cavendish, every time.
Anyone with extra bananas within an hour or so of Palm Bay, Fl. let me know... I always am looking for new ones to try, or beloved ones to have again.

meizzwang
08-15-2017, 05:10 PM
Looking forward to watching this thread and contributing in the years to come. I also have an SH-3640, just put it in the ground. Very excited to see how it performs in our cool, Northern California climate:
https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4375/36427254682_cbb71d23fd_c.jpg

Richard
11-02-2017, 07:27 PM
Bud emerging ...

http://growingfruit-images.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/original/3X/1/8/18010815d664c141ff620aa96690e8e22ee0b96d.jpg

HMelendez
11-07-2017, 10:20 AM
Bud emerging ...

http://growingfruit-images.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/original/3X/1/8/18010815d664c141ff620aa96690e8e22ee0b96d.jpg



Congrats Richard!.....

HMelendez
11-07-2017, 10:54 AM
SH-3640 High Noon Update!....



First picture was taken on September 14, 2017, a couple of days later, after very bad girl Hurricane Irma passed!....I lost all three blooming SH-3640 High Noon 'Nana bunches!.....

http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=62597 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=62597)




Second picture was taken last Saturday, November 4, 2017....SH-3640 pups took off growing!....Six SH-3640 soldier pups growing in a circle formation!....LOL.....Most of them are approx. 8 ft. tall and growing!....They should be flowering/blooming soon!....

http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=62598 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=62598)



It is incredible, amazing!.....All 'Nanas (mats) recovered like nothing happened to them!....I might have some 'Nanas flowering/blooming before the end of the year!....'Nanas are strong, tough plants!....



I'm baaaaack (walkinbeam)!.....LOL....



I will keep updating soon!.....:2723::bananarow::2723:

beam2050
11-07-2017, 11:03 AM
I'm baaaaack (walkinbeam)!.....LOL....



I will keep updating soon!.....:2723::bananarow::2723:

OH NO!

SHOW OFF :birthdaynana:

HMelendez
11-07-2017, 11:10 AM
OH NO!

SHOW OFF :birthdaynana:



LMAO!.....

sputinc7
11-07-2017, 12:56 PM
Lookit what I got on my 3640 today...

http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=62599&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=62599&ppuser=22903)

Between nematodes and hurricanes I have only had one bunch in 2 years make it to completion... This one will probably freeze...

beam2050
11-07-2017, 02:28 PM
Lookit what I got on my 3640 today...

Between nematodes and hurricanes I have only had one bunch in 2 years make it to completion... This one will probably freeze...

:lurk: hope not. we will be waiting. may the banana gods smile on you.

Richard
11-07-2017, 03:35 PM
nematodes

Nematodes hate sulfur ... and acidic soil in general. If you haven't already, consider mixing some "soil sulfur" into the mulch of your planter.

There are several brands ... here's one:

https://www.ebstone.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/eb-stone-ferts-soil-sulfur-box-02.png

sputinc7
11-07-2017, 09:56 PM
Are you sure? I have done a lot of research on controlling or killing nematodes lately and have not read anything about sulfur or acidity... I sure want that to be true... Sounds too easy to be true. Everything I read basically said to destroy all your plants and wait a year... I am in no way saying you are wrong, just want to know how you know and how acidic it needs to be, as my soil is VERY alkaline, like in the range of 8... Florida sugar sand. I thank you very much for the help.

Richard
11-07-2017, 10:13 PM
Are you sure?

It's the primary advice given to potato growers.

A $12 box of prilled sulfur seems like an inexpensive trial.

sputinc7
11-07-2017, 11:22 PM
Yes, it does... Will try. Like this? https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00VU3KGT6/ref=asc_df_B00VU3KGT65254230/?tag=hyprod-20&creative=395033&creativeASIN=B00VU3KGT6&linkCode=df0&hvadid=193150648923&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=4834949442276282046&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9011821&hvtargid=pla-309383316708

sputinc7
11-07-2017, 11:25 PM
Or might this be better? https://www.amazon.com/dp/B074N5VXL8/ref=sspa_dk_detail_0?psc=1&pd_rd_i=B074N5VXL8&pd_rd_wg=Q0Jyt&pd_rd_r=GKNT8S6SN6T9QYC7H1H0&pd_rd_w=GkZwo

Richard
11-08-2017, 12:16 AM
Or might this be better? https://www.amazon.com/dp/B074N5VXL8/ref=sspa_dk_detail_0?psc=1&pd_rd_i=B074N5VXL8&pd_rd_wg=Q0Jyt&pd_rd_r=GKNT8S6SN6T9QYC7H1H0&pd_rd_w=GkZwo

No. You want a box or bag from a manufacturer with application instructions. Your goal is to bring the pH down to 6.0 in your banana bed. You will probably have to reapply every six months. Be aware that sulfur takes up to 3 months to break down, so don't jump the gun and reapply too early.

sputinc7
11-08-2017, 11:46 PM
Okay. I had about 5 lbs of this left and used the rest on all my bananas, 12 in all, but a couple are bigger mats. I watered it in a little. We will see. I spread it out in about 6 feet diameter around all of them concentrating more near the corm and gradually getting thinner as you move outward.
https://www.amazon.com/Espoma-GSUL6-Soil-Acidifier-6-Pound/dp/B0063ZDQ66/ref=pd_sim_86_29?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B0063ZDQ66&pd_rd_r=F71F0PM75RB0FNHNB08H&pd_rd_w=24Ziy&pd_rd_wg=RMSnJ&psc=1&refRID=F71F0PM75RB0FNHNB08H
.
. I remember when I first got it because I thought it was a fungal issue related to the massive alkalinity of the soil and my well water. I put some around the plants and I remember it did help some for a while, like a month or two, maybe. the package instructions state: "apply 12 lbs per 100 square feet for each one point reduction in soil pH desired. For heavy clay soils increase rate to 15 lbs, so I don't think I overdid it... I figure I covered 280 sq ft or so with about 5 lbs. I am more concerned about chasing away nematodes than raising the Ph.

Richard
11-09-2017, 12:04 AM
Okay. I had about 5 lbs .

For a 280 sq.ft. area the dosage to drop 1 pt in pH would be:
280 x 12/100 = 33.6 lbs.
To get your soil into an effective range (pH 6) against nematodes you would need about 67 lbs.

Look at it this way:
Suppose you are bitten by a poisonous snake. The Paramedics show up with the antidote. Do you want the 1/10th dosage or the full dosage?

sputinc7
11-09-2017, 09:59 AM
I know I need more but it also says not to do it all at once so as to not shock the plants. When putting it on, though it seems like a lot. If I put on that much fertilizer it would kill everything.

Richard
11-09-2017, 11:07 AM
Sigh.

sputinc7
11-09-2017, 11:18 AM
A condescending sigh? Now what? First off, it was all I had. Second off, that is what the instructions said. I am not a chemical engineer but it seems to me that too much at once could be bad... You told me to get something with instructions, now complain when I follow them?
I appreciate your help, and I hope it works. Sometimes you can be so much help, but sometimes.... Like I said, we are not all chemical engineers. You would be more helpful if you remembered that.

sputinc7
11-09-2017, 11:20 AM
The sigh was no help at all.

Botanical_Bryce
11-09-2017, 12:27 PM
The sigh is how someone who thinks they have superior intelligence addresses those below them. The irony I find is that you are talking to a guy who can't get a mysore larger than 7 foot tall. I have fought nematodes for many years. The acid theory is a total myth being the most acid part of my property is the main part with nematodes mainly just flowers over on that part I don't care about. Nematodes dominate within the top 12 inches of soil. They like fine particles that are easy to travel through. I always remove as much sand as possible and replace it with organic material and biochar. I have just started adding vermiculite. If you do some research on endomycorhizae you will see that it has the ability to catch and choke a large number of nematodes and it seals and protects the roots. Removing native soil around the plants, adding course materials like biochar and vermiculite to organics and using high quality mycorhizae I would challenge anyone to come and see root knots on my bananas. I get so much growth that soon I will be throwing plants away soon from just having so many suckers. It sucks to do but the sand needs dug out.

sputinc7
11-09-2017, 05:50 PM
Allright... I found some evidence to back you up as well... Sounds like a winner winner chicken dinner!!!
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1023/A:1026150917522
Now, where do I buy innoculants? I can look, but you use them so I can only assume you have a source...

Richard
11-09-2017, 06:19 PM
Today.

http://growingfruit-images.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/original/3X/e/6/e6ca95bd65a90d9423f7f4b19c07b6595931515b.jpg

Botanical_Bryce
11-10-2017, 10:20 AM
Allright... I found some evidence to back you up as well... Sounds like a winner winner chicken dinner!!!
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1023/A:1026150917522
Now, where do I buy innoculants? I can look, but you use them so I can only assume you have a source...
I use a product called mykos. Comes from a company that sends it fresh. That is important since it is not stable outside of root systems. Products that have it added I don't trust because mixing it with nitrates and moisture I am sure that it ensures it is dead in those products. IMO it is most effective on healthier root systems so the organic materials are important for beneficial fungus in general. I hope that helps you.

Richard
11-13-2017, 07:12 PM
progress ...

http://growingfruit-images.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/original/3X/9/a/9a5476326a10bd7e58d17c09d73ed9b183e18d55.jpg

sputinc7
11-13-2017, 08:35 PM
My 3640 is almost exactly in the same place right now, but it looks different... I will try to remember to get a pic tomorrow...

edwmax
11-14-2017, 08:11 AM
Allright... I found some evidence to back you up as well... Sounds like a winner winner chicken dinner!!!
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1023/A:1026150917522
Now, where do I buy innoculants? I can look, but you use them so I can only assume you have a source...

https://www.motherearthnews.com/organic-gardening/creating-your-own-mycorrhiza-zbcz1403

or

https://www.smilinggardener.com/sale/mycorrhizae-for-sale/

and/or

amend your soil with compost and manure to promote growing the bacteria and fungi already present.

sputinc7
11-14-2017, 09:16 AM
I just took this pic this morning. From underneath is the only clear shot on account of all the leaves. It's leaning some compared to yesterday. It's ready to drop and pop. Can't wait.

http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=62613&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=62613&ppuser=22903)

beam2050
11-14-2017, 09:20 AM
:woohoonaner:

HMelendez
11-14-2017, 10:20 AM
progress ...

http://growingfruit-images.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/original/3X/9/a/9a5476326a10bd7e58d17c09d73ed9b183e18d55.jpg


Looking good Richard!....

HMelendez
11-14-2017, 10:36 AM
I just took this pic this morning. From underneath is the only clear shot on account of all the leaves. It's leaning some compared to yesterday. It's ready to drop and pop. Can't wait.

http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=62613&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=62613&ppuser=22903)



Steve,


Congrats my friend!....Finally, it's flowering!....It's normal for SH-3640 to lean!....Last year, I harvested a SH-3640 High Noon MASSIVE bunch!...SH-3640 fingers were in the plantain size league!.....Huge 'Nana fingers!....The SH-3640 plant was holding the bunch without any problems, any prop or brace!....

Richard
11-14-2017, 12:33 PM
For this specimen, the pseudo-stem height at budding is about 4’ 10".

http://growingfruit-images.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/original/3X/4/e/4e2bbfc4846024a21387314003870e029b6ee1d4.jpg

http://growingfruit-images.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/original/3X/6/d/6d8a658d8a365f2eee1d80f4a6f135b8f85338f2.jpg

crazy banana
11-14-2017, 02:01 PM
For this specimen, the pseudo-stem height at budding is about 4’ 10".

http://growingfruit-images.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/original/3X/4/e/4e2bbfc4846024a21387314003870e029b6ee1d4.jpg

http://growingfruit-images.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/original/3X/6/d/6d8a658d8a365f2eee1d80f4a6f135b8f85338f2.jpg

Interesting. Thanks for posting.
Out of curiosity I have just measured mine (the mat your plant originated from). It has a fruit bunch developing at 8'. The mat next to it has one plant I was hoping to get an inflorescence this summer, but it is already 8.5' tall and not even a flag leaf yet.

Richard
11-14-2017, 07:34 PM
Interesting ...

I remember being at your house the first time yours fruited. It seems to me it was about 4.5' ... or was that something else?

HMelendez
11-14-2017, 07:46 PM
Richard, crazy banana;



The last three blooming SH-3640 High Noon ‘Nana plants that I lost during Hurricane Irma, they were approx. 10 ft. tall!....Currently, most of my six SH-3640 are approx. 8 ft. tall and they still growing!....

crazy banana
11-14-2017, 10:46 PM
I remember being at your house the first time yours fruited. It seems to me it was about 4.5' ... or was that something else?

Must have been something else. The SH 3640 grows down by the street, so anything flowering below 6' or 7' would never end up in our kitchen. People would just help themselves :(

Richard
11-14-2017, 11:04 PM
Must have been something else. The SH 3640 grows down by the street, so anything flowering below 6' or 7' would never end up in our kitchen. People would just help themselves :(

Yes, I remember it growing inside the fence next to the sidewalk. You had receive the pup earlier that year and were surprised it was blooming so soon. I also remember your concern with fruit theft. :2733:

sputinc7
11-14-2017, 11:38 PM
I will have to measure mine. I forgot to do that. I am six feet tall and cannot reach the bud with my fingers. I would guess around 8 ft or so. Unfortunately I noticed yesterday it looks like the stinking nematodes may have found the 3640... The pups are all showing signs of the "Umbrella effect" I was hoping it was just very resistant. I did, however put some of the Mykos on them today. I hope it is helpful.

Mark Dragt
11-17-2017, 11:44 AM
I am also growing the SH-3640 and should be the same as Hector's plant. It will be interesting to see at what height my plant fruits with my completely different growing conditions.

Richard- your plant flowering at such a short height must be a freak anomaly for what ever reason. Now if your Rattoon blooms and fruits at that short height people will want to know how you did it. I hope your bunch turns out great!

Richard
11-17-2017, 08:03 PM
http://growingfruit-images.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/optimized/3X/5/3/535b2a98ec2116dea98b62b3b0e9aa79fc455782_1_690x920.jpg

Richard
11-17-2017, 11:51 PM
For readers who have recently joined this thread, I recommend starting at the beginning (http://www.bananas.org/f12/tales-sh-3640s-47524-2.html#post308360) for context.

Akula
11-18-2017, 07:52 PM
I don't know what you have but it looks to me like you have something completely different than the other guys who have 3640 based on the photos and information provided.

Richard
11-25-2017, 04:51 PM
Here's the infant fruit. The fresh female flowers are completely beige.

http://growingfruit-images.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/original/3X/5/e/5e8f39fa9f36493eaddc55d5519fa436bcc261d2.jpg

http://growingfruit-images.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/original/3X/9/7/977fc3ae5b47a1e75ad500c577eae6f435683142.jpg

Tytaylor77
11-26-2017, 06:57 AM
Congrats Richard! I’ve never seen female end flowers that color. Very cool. Could be environmental but still looks awesome. Now I’m excited to hear the taste report. SH3640 clone that i have taste almost exactly like Agristarts FHIA-1 Goldfinger to me (and others i know) Both amazing tasting bananas! Both in my top 5 and incredible growers! Please keep us updated!

I’m pretty sure i can get you a few fingers off our clone to taste/compare. Let me know if your interested. Free of course.

Seems like a smaller than normal plant! Mutations are happening all over this year! Could it have mutated into a super dwarf? I’m not an expert though!!

Richard
11-26-2017, 12:42 PM
Congrats Richard! I’ve never seen female end flowers that color.

Neither have I. :)
We've been experiencing summer weather this week due to "Santa Ana" conditions, so I believe the blossoms are natural color.

In days of yore, the expert banana ID'ers on this site used male & female flower colors along with rib coloration and leaf proportions to nail down the Musa group and sometimes the cultivar of a specimen.

Pretty soon we'll know what it isn't, and possibly what it is. :08:

Seems like a smaller than normal plant!

Yes, although I've seen this occur a few times times before in a first-year pup. The real height will be established in follow-on generations.

sputinc7
11-26-2017, 05:05 PM
Here is mine yesterday afternoon, Saturday... About 8 feet, BTW...

http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=62660&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=62660&ppuser=22903)

It has been a chilly fall here so far. I remember two years ago we were in the pool until the end of Jan, and that was without a solar cover or heater, which I have now and still can't get into my 72 degree pool... Much cooler. I hope it warms up, we don't need any freezing this winter...
I would call those little flowers grayish as well... odd.

Richard
12-02-2017, 01:30 PM
Male flowers.

http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=62676&size=1

meizzwang
06-11-2018, 07:00 PM
Any updates on your plant Richard? Interested to see how the fingers are developing on this particular clone.

Richard
06-11-2018, 07:04 PM
Any updates on your plant Richard? Interested to see how the fingers are developing on this particular clone.

The fingers died during the unusual long cool spring. I'm now nurturing along a few pups.

sputinc7
06-11-2018, 10:03 PM
We had 2 freezes down to 26 last winter about a month after mine flowered and it lost all the leaves... I covered the bunch, though and it filled in most the way and they were pretty good. The bottom 2 hands had a core and were kinda small but the top 3 were bigger but smaller than usual but good.

meizzwang
06-12-2018, 03:03 PM
Sorry to hear that bunch didn't make it, was really looking forward to a full report on the mature fruit. Got maybe a year to go before I can give any reports on my plant, provided it doesn't get nipped by the cold next winter!

Richard
06-28-2018, 10:55 PM
Porch light is mounted at 6'

http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=63219&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=63219)

venturabananas
07-01-2018, 12:54 AM
Sorry to hear that bunch didn't make it, was really looking forward to a full report on the mature fruit. Got maybe a year to go before I can give any reports on my plant, provided it doesn't get nipped by the cold next winter!

I don't know if this variety is right for the California climate. It took years for my to finally fruit and it has only made a little bunch that is hanging now. Seems to be filling OK and barring any unforeseen problems, I should finally be able to taste this variety, after growing it for years. In defense of this variety, I haven't treated it very well or had it in a very good spot

Richard
10-15-2018, 07:38 PM
Latest bud on my pseudo-SH-3640. Anyone care to ID?

https://growingfruit-images.s3.dualstack.us-west-2.amazonaws.com/original/3X/a/c/ac4b39b2449df396c52e28c0d43f03bbe785f60e.jpeg

venturabananas
10-16-2018, 03:26 PM
My SH-3640 finally ripened a bunch after 6 years in the ground (this is the original p-stem, too). Slowest ever to flower in my yard. It wasn't in a great spot, but it wasn't that bad a spot. In a couple of days, the fingers ought to be ripe enough to finally try one.

Botanical_Bryce
10-16-2018, 03:45 PM
Isn't that just a Brazilian tall?

Richard
10-17-2018, 05:16 PM
Isn't that just a Brazilian tall?

Well ... no, the pstem height is 6.5' ... about the same height it bloomed last year.

It is the correct height to be a Dwarf Brazilian but I've no idea if the markings or flower colors match that hybrid.

http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=63987&size=1

https://growingfruit-images.s3.dualstack.us-west-2.amazonaws.com/original/3X/a/c/ac4b39b2449df396c52e28c0d43f03bbe785f60e.jpeg

Botanical_Bryce
10-17-2018, 06:29 PM
If it stunted like your pisang ceylon the pstem height makes total sense. Either way it looks like something from the pome complex.

meizzwang
10-17-2018, 06:51 PM
My SH-3640 finally ripened a bunch after 6 years in the ground (this is the original p-stem, too). Slowest ever to flower in my yard. It wasn't in a great spot, but it wasn't that bad a spot. In a couple of days, the fingers ought to be ripe enough to finally try one.

That's just absolutely ridiculous! I guess we have to add maybe a year or two up here in Northern California!

Any pics of your plant and the bunch? Very curious to see how it looks.

Richard
10-17-2018, 09:58 PM
... Either way it looks like something from the pome complex.

Thanks, that's good info.

Richard
10-18-2018, 12:42 AM
... Either way it looks like something from the pome complex.

Ok, so the Pome complex are AAB hybrids. After some reading on We-Be-Bananas (http://webebananas.com/bvar-A-B.html), I'm thinking that the Silk subgroup (AAB hybrids) are another possibility.

Nicolas Naranja
10-18-2018, 03:55 PM
My SH-3640 came from Bananimal as well. I had it in a row with FHIA-1, FHIA-18, and Dwarf Brazillian so that you could see the differences between them. My fruit looked beautiful, but did not taste good. Maybe it was in a bad spot, so I am trying again from a different source. One thing to keep in mind before getting all bent into and out of shape is that bananas are not as stable as you might imagine, they spontaneously mutate. That's why there are so many accessions of Cavendish. TARS tissues cultures as well, and just because you got your plant from TARS doesn't mean it's going to match the catalogue description. Also, remember the descriptions are made under well fertilized, irrigated conditions at about 18 degrees latitude. The defining feature of SH-3640 to me was the long peduncle, which is also evident from the pictures at TARS. This isn't the case of selling Nam Wah as Ice Cream.

Richard
10-18-2018, 05:03 PM
... One thing to keep in mind ...

Thanks Nicholas, great answer.

HMelendez
10-19-2018, 04:56 AM
Richard!.....



Woohooo!.....My SH-3640 High Noon Nana Gazebo it's flowering again!....My Nana Gazebo consists of 7 (seven) SH-3640 High Noon adult plants!......This is the third SH-3640 flowering/blooming in the same mat!....All of my SH-3640 have been approx. 9 3/4 to 10 ft. at flowering/blooming consistently!.....



Pictures from 10/16/2018....

https://c2.staticflickr.com/2/1975/45280617501_766ebc8cba_b.jpg

https://c2.staticflickr.com/2/1920/44368565015_49e4a5e427_b.jpg





http://www.bananas.org/f2/fhia-21-plantain-sh-3640-nana-47226.html

Identification and characterization guide for FHIA banana and plantain hybrids (http://www.musalit.org/seeMore.php?id=11677)




You should receive/get the True To Type/Real SH-3640 High Noon pup soon!....Hopefully it grows very good for you!....It will be very interesting to do a comparison with the one that it's currently flowering/blooming!.....SH-3640 High Noon it is one of my best growers!......A monster grower!.....






:2723::bananarow::2723:

sputinc7
10-19-2018, 12:21 PM
One thing about 3640 is how it tends to grow quickly to a point then seems to begin a dwarf growing pattern in the last few months before flowering. Also the PS is like a tree trunk...
Richard, the one defining characteristic of a D Brazilian to me is the very messy rachis, everything stays attached all the way down. It's a very defining characteristic, as the tall Brazilian has a completely clean one.

venturabananas
10-19-2018, 05:32 PM
As I understand it, Richard, Nick, and I got our SH-3640's from the same source (Banaminal). I think it is correctly identified, but wouldn't bet my life on it. It is definitely NOT Dwarf Brazilian. I have those all over my yard, and the messy rachis that Steve mentions is always present on them. It is not present on the SH-3640, which was mostly, but not entirely clean. I think this variety just needs hot, humid conditions to be happy, and grow to its full potential. We don't have that in California, but you Florida folks do.

Tytaylor77
10-26-2018, 06:54 AM
I also have the Tars/Hectors clone. This was my 1st year and currently mine is about 9’ and looks exactly like the Tars clone in the pictures. The tropical ones may have a bit more black. 3640 I would say blew away all my goldfinger clones in growth. I have also tasted it twice and it is amazing! My top 5 best tasting. Very similar to other pome/goldfinger taste!

I’m adding my most recent picture of my sh-3640 to my Flickr.

Richard I’m excited you have it now. I have no doubts it will become a favorite for you and I’m excited to see updates! The other 3640 clone could be an off-type. Remember another hybrid with very similar parents (fhia01 goldfinger) and how many off-types we see of it.

bananaT
10-29-2018, 02:46 PM
Botanical Bryce; I received a nice sucker from him not too long ago. She's around 4.5 feet and pushing a flag leaf right now. A bit unexpected, but that first fruiting always comes on shorter p stems.

Did you get your original plant off a member here Bryce?

Botanical_Bryce
10-29-2018, 07:00 PM
Botanical Bryce; I received a nice sucker from him not too long ago. She's around 4.5 feet and pushing a flag leaf right now. A bit unexpected, but that first fruiting always comes on shorter p stems.

Did you get your original plant off a member here Bryce?

Not at my house. First fruitings are often shorter on mine by maybe a foot or so but never that much. Every single SH 3640 sucker I planted has consistently fruited at the 8 to 10 range and the plants there after exactly 10 foot every time. Rarely do I get premature fruiting. Raja Puri and cavendish are probably the only ones that premature fruit in my garden. I also only use heavy corms never water suckers or too young swords. My SH 3640s came from a grower in Apopka and Josh Jamison from Heart Village. Originally verified on here and then several people after including Don from Going Bananas who tasted the banana and said it was an SH 3640. Using the scientific method I made no mention they were supposed to be SH 3640. Short fruitings suggest an issue in the husbandry since all I do is put them in a planting hole and leave them. Only surface cover is oak leaves and only in extreme cases do I fertilize.

Richard
10-29-2018, 07:05 PM
... Every single SH 3640 sucker I planted has consistently fruited at the 8 to 10 range and the plants thereafter exactly 10 foot every time. Rarely do I get premature fruiting ...

Great info, thanks.

Richard
10-31-2018, 08:22 PM
mutant SH-3640 male flowers 2018-10-31

http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=64050&size=1

bananaT
11-01-2018, 08:18 AM
Short fruitings suggest an issue in the husbandry since all I do is put them in a planting hole and leave them. Only surface cover is oak leaves and only in extreme cases do I fertilize.

The best way to fruit bananas!! Ignore them, starve them, and shred them with a stick..

Thanks. I was just curious where they came from, Bryce.
There are 2 suckers on the one I received from you & and they're pushing 6 feet already. They stole all the love I was giving the clump, and the original plant gave up.

Botanical_Bryce
11-01-2018, 07:31 PM
Honestly I got the worst results putting lots of care in my bananas. I do tend to keep the suckers off so that may factor in bigger plants. It's Not to benefit the plant but to increase my numbers. SH 3640 is awesome especially when a jungle of them is established.

Richard
11-01-2018, 08:15 PM
Location: Inverness, Florida
Zone: 9a


It appears that Inverness FL is in USDA cold hardiness zone 11. If I had that weather I could probably get by with a lot less plant care too.

http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=64054&size=1

Botanical_Bryce
11-01-2018, 09:01 PM
Ummmm, try zone 9a. We get down in the upper teens.

Botanical_Bryce
11-01-2018, 09:02 PM
Wow!

Botanical_Bryce
11-01-2018, 09:02 PM
Lol!

Botanical_Bryce
11-01-2018, 09:03 PM
Under my name even says 9a for years now. Lol!

Richard
11-01-2018, 09:05 PM
Lol!

I'm guessing city-data.com picked Miami FL for your data :bananas_b

Botanical_Bryce
11-01-2018, 09:28 PM
Roughly 400 miles north of 11a, lol.

Richard
11-02-2018, 12:50 AM
Roughly 400 miles north of 11a, lol.

That's about the driving distance from here to Fresno, CA ... LOL.

I see the Weather Underground has a few stations online from Inverness. Is this station in your micro-climate?

https://www.wunderground.com/personal-weather-station/dashboard?ID=KFLINVER13

Botanical_Bryce
11-02-2018, 02:54 AM
Not my area.

Richard
11-13-2018, 06:17 PM
At sunrise

https://growingfruit-images.s3.dualstack.us-west-2.amazonaws.com/optimized/3X/7/1/71354093197378ba3eeb8f1d487483808865bb65_1_690x920.jpeg

venturabananas
11-14-2018, 12:35 AM
...In a couple of days, the fingers ought to be ripe enough to finally try one.

As a brief report, the bananas ripened well and they were very nice. The flavor was similar to Goldfinger, but I thought slightly better. The texture was excellent: firm yet smooth when chewed. My tiny plant made a tiny bunch (10 lb total), but the fingers were nice sized (120-150 grams) considering how small the plant was. I wish this variety was more productive in my yard. That said, it wouldn't displace Mysore or Dwarf Brazilian on my list of favorite bananas to eat.

Richard
11-14-2018, 12:47 AM
As a brief report,

Sounds like you came through the fires ok. Whew.

venturabananas
11-14-2018, 01:29 AM
Yes, thanks. The fires are several miles southeast of us. Last year's Thomas Fire came within about a mile of us. That was scary.

beam2050
11-14-2018, 09:26 AM
fire makes the pines go in your part of the world, but lets pray for some heavy rain for yahl.

Johnsk9
11-23-2018, 07:02 AM
On the SH-3640 is the pseudostem very dark or smoky colored?

crazy banana
11-26-2018, 02:52 AM
As I understand it, Richard, Nick, and I got our SH-3640's from the same source (Banaminal). I think it is correctly identified, but wouldn't bet my life on it. It is definitely NOT Dwarf Brazilian. I have those all over my yard, and the messy rachis that Steve mentions is always present on them. It is not present on the SH-3640, which was mostly, but not entirely clean. I think this variety just needs hot, humid conditions to be happy, and grow to its full potential. We don't have that in California, but you Florida folks do.

Interesting observations. Here is a photo (sorry, bananas.org does no let me flip it correctly) of my supposed to be SH3640 (Richard has his from my mat, source is bananimal). I thought it might be a mutant, but if you look at the inflorescence with its retaining bracts, it sure reminds me of a dwarf Brazilian or Raja Puri.
Right now I have three plants with an inflorescence and fruit bunch and it took me a long time to finally have them fruit. The fruit bunches are not filling in the way I was hoping for either (but I admit negligence this year). Overall disappointing and I am grateful to have the real deal from Hector now, so more than likely this mat will have to go.
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=64135&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=64135)