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View Full Version : what are the differences between Musa Cheesmanii and Musa Nagiensum


bikoro child
01-22-2008, 12:12 AM
Hi you all; they look so similar that it's not clear to me...

Tropicallvr
01-24-2008, 10:45 AM
It's not very clear to me either. Here's some pics of Musa nagesium. I think Musa nagesium has alot of yellow, and wax. Yellow midrib, yellow petiole, and yellow flower.
M. nagesium pics from Chinese border. http://tag.inibap.org/files/Wild_species_threathened_cultivars/M._nagensium/Photos_musa_nagensium/


This will probably only add to the confusion. Now different pics of Musa nagesium from plant grown in Kerala India, but I don't think it is correct(but sure would like to have one of these anyways)- http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~drc/mnagensiumimages.htm

Now more pics from Burmese/India border from Trebrown seed suppliers.-
http://www.trebrown.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=302

Looking back on your plant, I'm not sure anymore.
http://gardenbreizh.org/photos/niceben/photo-57766.html

Gabe15
01-24-2008, 09:15 PM
They are very different species. I think the confusion comes from the fact that many seed dealers label things incorrectly. Below are descriptions for each plant. The M. nagensium found in the wild is a different variety than what was originally seen years ago, the originally known form did not have yellow bracts.

http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~drc/mcheesmani.htm

http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~drc/mnagensium.htm

bikoro child
01-25-2008, 02:22 AM
okay so is this one cheesmanii?
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=7247&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7247&ppuser=1162)

Tropicallvr
01-30-2008, 12:16 PM
I think so.

Mark Hall
02-01-2008, 08:10 AM
I have just taken some pics of my Nagensium and I have to agree with david constantine. They are very waxy under the leaves almost white.

bigdog
02-01-2008, 10:20 AM
Mark, what was your source for that plant? Great pictures!

I'm fairly certain that the banana labeled as Musa nagensium 'Floral Noir' is nothing more than Musa cheesmani. I'll have them growing side-by-side next year for somparison.

Mark Hall
02-01-2008, 04:23 PM
Frank , I think the seeds came from Ebay in france by a seller called
Bananapalm292. He used to have lots of different types and they were a good price.

I should keep a record of where I get my seeds from really as I am often asked.

I have yet to find the true white seeds of Nagensium. Sunshine seeds list 3 types of Nagensium
http://www.shop.sunshine-seeds.de/

I have Cheesmanii too so I will have a look to see if there,s a difference.

I also have another Nagensium that has a darker midrib than the one in the previous pics.

bigdog
02-01-2008, 07:41 PM
There's an article coming out in Novon in June, I believe, about Musa nagensium. Markku Hakkinen wrote it also. He is a busy guy!

51st state
10-27-2008, 06:04 PM
this is driving me mad (well madder than usual anyway) Nag and cheese are so different. I'm off down the polytunnel for another look.

I just noticed that Flaviflora is now designated a synonym of Thomsonii. I'm really not sure about this either.

These re-designations do seem to fly in the face of some pretty compelling photographic evidence, not to mention many years of work by a number of very capable botanists. The taxonomic descriptions have some significant differences.
I need to get a load of photos uploaded to the wiki and then perhaps ask Mr Hakkinen to comment.

bigdog
10-30-2008, 11:41 AM
Hey Kev, since I talked to you last I looked at all of mine. My Musa cheesamni has quite a bit of wax, maybe even more than the M. nagensium from europalms. The nagensium x from Kenibreed does look slightly different though. When I compared leaves, they look almost identical to me! I'll have to get some pics uploaded. They all have the same color pseudostem, the only real differences that I can tell are the amounts of wax, the midribs, and petiole color (slightly different).

51st state
10-30-2008, 06:22 PM
not a great photo I know. anyone got another photo of Cheesmanii seeds?

51st state
10-30-2008, 06:23 PM
sorry...please see my pics for the photos