View Full Version : I need to grow more banana plants....
crazy banana
12-19-2013, 06:25 PM
Usually we do not see the cases our supermarket bananas are shipped in, but yesterday they have packed my groceries in an empty banana box which stated that the bananas were treated with Thiabendazole, Imazalil and Azoxystrobin. Yuck! Had to research those chemicals and it just makes me want to grow more banana plants in my yard.....
Thiabendazole:
It is used primarily to control mold, blight, and other fungal caused diseases in fruits (e.g. oranges) and vegetables
Toxic Effect on Brain or Spinal Cord Function
Serious and Sudden Stomach or Intestine Problem
Severe Delirium
Severe Hallucination
Numbness
Loss of Appetite
Severe Nausea
Severe Throwing Up
Severe Diarrhea
Dry Eye
Ringing in the Ears
Dry Mouth
Drowsiness
Dizziness
Head Pain
Infrequent side effects of thiabendazole oral:
Inflammation of Skin caused by an Allergy
Severe Itching
Severe Rash
.....
The following link shows you what chemicals to expect on your supermarket bananas:
What’s On My Food :: Pesticides on Bananas (http://www.whatsonmyfood.org/food.jsp?food=BN)
Nicolas Naranja
12-19-2013, 06:43 PM
You can also buy organic bananas. But to make another comment, the main disease they are fighting is crown rot which is only a problem with certain varieties. I don't treat my bananas with a fungicide and I don't have trouble with crown rot.
caliboy1994
12-19-2013, 06:57 PM
There's a reason why someday I want to have a few acres. :)
crazy banana
12-19-2013, 07:05 PM
You can also buy organic bananas. But to make another comment, the main disease they are fighting is crown rot which is only a problem with certain varieties. I don't treat my bananas with a fungicide and I don't have trouble with crown rot.
I agree. Not saying that 100% organic is the only way to go. I try to use a lot of organic products but sometimes we just cannot avoid the chemicals. The banana case in question came from Ecuador...
Richard
12-19-2013, 08:30 PM
I agree. Not saying that 100% organic is the only way to go. I try to use a lot of organic products but sometimes we just cannot avoid the chemicals. The banana case in question came from Ecuador...
Certified organic does not mean "no pesticides", nor does it mean "only non-chemical" pesticides. I know if you read the opening paragraph of the USDA NOP requirements it all sounds warm and fuzzy. Now go scroll down and start reading the numerous exceptions: Organic Certification | USDA (http://www.usda.gov/wps/portal/usda/usdahome?navid=ORGANIC_CERTIFICATIO).
Nicolas Naranja
12-19-2013, 09:29 PM
I agree. Not saying that 100% organic is the only way to go. I try to use a lot of organic products but sometimes we just cannot avoid the chemicals. The banana case in question came from Ecuador...
I used to reuse the boxes when I did a lot more wholesale. Bananas from all over the world are treated with fungicides. The corporation doesnt matter. What you will notice with a lot of the organic fruit is a wax seal on the crown. But lets face it, you aren't eating the peel which is where the fungicides are.
blownz281
12-20-2013, 11:07 AM
Yes it stinks but look at everything we eat. We have no idea how healthy it is being processed. Just what we are told and assume. Of course fast food is bad for you no matter what :). I do know that from a Master Gardener stand point in classes we learned spraying the actual plant,buy the time the fruit or veggie was ready the sprays were pretty leaned out. Meaning the plant dissolved some.I guess better then nothing.. I dont quit believe the whole organic thing,unless I am there growing it myself or watching it we have no idea if its pesticide free. I wish I had tons of land too just to grow them for fun not just for fruit reasons. If we owned are house I would have a bunch more then the almost 3 dozen I have now.:08:
Abnshrek
12-20-2013, 12:07 PM
So my Q? is when I throw all them sprayed peels out in my compost pile how long before I should use them? and will it harm my banana's growing here?
bananimal
12-20-2013, 07:24 PM
Don't eat the skins and don't use them for compost.
Problem solved.
I eat store bought naners almost every day between my backyard bunches.
So do the dogs. Everybody's happy.
crazy banana
12-20-2013, 10:59 PM
I used to reuse the boxes when I did a lot more wholesale. Bananas from all over the world are treated with fungicides. The corporation doesnt matter. What you will notice with a lot of the organic fruit is a wax seal on the crown. But lets face it, you aren't eating the peel which is where the fungicides are.
Banana peel is semi-permeable, so there is a chance of intake with the fruit pulp.
And I am also aware that in "third world countries" people use banana peel ( and papaya) as enzymatic and mechanical wound dressing. It can also be used to remove necrotic tissue and enhance wound healing.
However, this is not why I originally had posted this. And after researching the mentioned fungicides I think there are probably other chemicals in our food chain which are a lot worse for us. I will continue to buy supermarket bananas until my own are ripe to eat, but hey: makes me want to grow more banana plants for sure :)
lmswayne
12-21-2013, 11:37 AM
All this talk of toxic food makes me want a banana and a twinke.:woohoonaner::woohoonaner:
crazy banana
12-21-2013, 12:38 PM
All this talk of toxic food makes me want a banana and a twinke.:woohoonaner::woohoonaner:
:ha:
Hahaha, you are funny. Yes, I will need to have a store bought banana for breakfast, too, but if my memory serves me right, banana cream filled twinkies are only banana flavored, so no real bananas were harmed in the production of those and that would probably be a totally different thread....
lmswayne
12-21-2013, 01:01 PM
true
kizanne
12-22-2013, 09:50 AM
I love growing my own food so that I know what I am eating. My only desire is for more land and more time to grow more. Ok actually I need more sun the acre I have would probably be enough to grow plenty if it wasn't so shaded.
Richard
12-22-2013, 06:38 PM
I love growing my own food so that I know what I am eating. My only desire is for more land and more time to grow more. Ok actually I need more sun the acre I have would probably be enough to grow plenty if it wasn't so shaded.
For someone to grow all of their food is a difficult task with no assistance. The statistics from Cornell are:
Amateurs at agriculture - 5 acres per person, 7 people minimum; a total of 35 acres.
Persons with at least 2 years of agriculture college - 3 acres per person, 5 people minimum; a total of 15 acres.
Experienced, expert agriculturists - one and a third acres per person, 3 people; a total of 4 acres.
For someone to grow all of their food is a difficult task with no assistance. The statistics from Cornell are:
Amateurs at agriculture - 5 acres per person, 7 people minimum; a total of 35 acres.
Persons with at least 2 years of agriculture college - 3 acres per person, 5 people minimum; a total of 15 acres.
Experienced, expert agriculturists - one and a third acres per person, 3 people; a total of 4 acres.
Are those stats for vegetarians? Chickens don't take up much space but cows do. And I like beef. If you want to raise meat, you have to provide grain unless they're on pure grass; if so they need more space than 1 1/3 acres. And that leaves me no space to grow other food.
What about coffee? I suppose I could raise it here but not very successfully and I'd rather give it up (I don't drink much) than switch to chicory or some plant that tastes like mud. (Old joke my father told...) My grandparents had 250 acres in upstate NY; they milked 150 to 200 Holsteins. They also had 2000 or more Leghorns. They obviously grew more than just for themselves and they baled hay plus grew field corn for the animals. When my father was growing up during the Depression they had also lambs and pigs for market. My grandmother had a large garden. Guess what? If they wanted chocolate or flour or sugar, they went to the store.
crazy banana
12-22-2013, 07:21 PM
For someone to grow all of their food is a difficult task with no assistance. The statistics from Cornell are:
Amateurs at agriculture - 5 acres per person, 7 people minimum; a total of 35 acres.
Persons with at least 2 years of agriculture college - 3 acres per person, 5 people minimum; a total of 15 acres.
Experienced, expert agriculturists - one and a third acres per person, 3 people; a total of 4 acres.
I want to be the amateur here. 1.33 acres would never be enough for me. Is this study referring to just fruits and veggies? I would need a lot of land for my animals, too. Would love to have more chickens and a couple milk goats to make my own cheese....
I will have to keep dreaming.....
kizanne
12-22-2013, 07:41 PM
URBAN HOMESTEAD RECORD HARVEST!!! | Little Homestead in the City - the Urban Homestead Journal (http://urbanhomestead.org/journal/2011/01/06/urban-homestead-record-harvest/)
There is a family in california that grows 7000 lbs of food on 1/10 of an acre garden area they own 1/5 of an acre total. I think you'd find with new square foot gardening/ intercropping/ plants started indoors to save time. I can grow a crop of radish in the area I'm going to grow tomatoes if I start my tomatoes indoors instead of planting seed in place. I have about 20 chickens that make me about a dozen eggs a day in about 1000 sf. While I'm not saying you can live on 4 eggs a day (we have a family of 3) but it is 28 grams of protein per person with would go along way and that doesn't count that I hatch and eat some too. I do buy their organic food elsewhere which I don't mind. They also get garden scraps and forage in my yard. They love earthworms, keep the snakes down. I also know the farmer who sells me grass fed beef so I don't need to grow that to know what is in that food or to avoid unnecessary antibiotics, (I grow my own chicken so there is no antibiotics there).
I will probably always buy rice. I don't use flour much. I made enough sweet potatoes last year to last the whole year. We don't eat as many as some but we made about 100 lbs in a small 6x6 area. So if you didn't want rice or flour you could grow enough starch in a relatively small area.
I have 11 banana plants in small pots and a double mahoi in the process of plumping. As you know once they potted ones come to bear fruit that will be 25-40 pounds of banana at a time. I have some figs that first fruited this year so hopefully next year will be a good year for them. I have a peach tree, pindo palm, mulberry, muscadine grape, some citrus, pear, jujube, loquat, raspberry and blackberry. I raise bees. I have a pond with tilapia. I have a garden that does well when I can tend it. This is all in a very small portion of my yard. I am still waiting for some of the trees to get more mature. My neighborhood is very shady and has very tall trees so even if I cut down every tree in the yard there would be some shade in my yard. I also don't want to cut down all the trees as many of them keep my house shaded and keeps my electric bill down.
I don't grow my food to save money, though it does in most cases. I do it for knowing what is in the food. To provide my family with as healthy food as possible. I don't buy most my food organic at the store due to cost and the fact it can still have lots I don't want.
But it can be done and even if I can't grow all my own food, I can do my part to lower the intake of pesticide, fungicides, herbicides, antibiotics, spray on colorant, possible sickness like samonella and such of my family. It also helps the use an dependence on oil and the carbon foot print of shipping everything around the world. I don't see it as an all or nothing deal. I do what I can. I just wish I had more sun to do it with. Maybe another acre.
Nicolas Naranja
12-22-2013, 08:11 PM
For someone to grow all of their food is a difficult task with no assistance. The statistics from Cornell are:
Amateurs at agriculture - 5 acres per person, 7 people minimum; a total of 35 acres.
Persons with at least 2 years of agriculture college - 3 acres per person, 5 people minimum; a total of 15 acres.
Experienced, expert agriculturists - one and a third acres per person, 3 people; a total of 4 acres.
When I was getting my bachelor's the figure we were told was 900 sqft. But that is in my part of the world where you can grow all year. We actually had to plan the garden out for a year. Its pretty intense to do as it requires a lot of relay cropping and intercropping. A bunch of bananas has 10000 calories, roughly. I think the 100 plants behind my house yield 2 million calories per year on 1/6 Acre. I could definitely grow greens and calabaza in the middles. If I had coconuts that would be a good protein source. I could live out of my backyard. I just wouldnt get much meat.
kizanne, where are you located? At least zone would be nice.
I've gardened in a warm 7, a 6 and a very chilly 6 (felt like 4 to me!) and now am trying to grow in 9a in horrid dirt that isn't mine--right now I'm doing a 2 gallon pot experiment for a gleaning org that wants to help people learn how to grow vegetables for themselves. So far it's a huge failure (I can't even get fresh seeds to sprout reliably in the dirt I was given)--my next step is to put an inch of potting soil on top and plant in that--never had these issues but this determined old dog is learning new tricks so this will happen. This has to be totally turnkey--hand someone 5 pots preplanted that they water and harvest. Some will take them, ignore them and let them die, some will follow the instructions and hopefully a few will become so fascinated with the process that they'll be receptive to learning more then want to teach others.
We'll see....it's a start....
Richard
12-22-2013, 09:29 PM
Are those stats for vegetarians?
There's no cows or bulls in the equation because they are inefficient sources of nutrition. For more information go to the Cornell Agriculture site and start reading the peer-reviewed papers they've published for the U.N., etc.
What about coffee?
2 coffee trees (grown in suitable environment) will supply two people with plenty of coffee, 1 coffee tree will supply you for a 1/2 year.
... There is a family in california that grows 7000 lbs of food on 1/10 of an acre garden area they own 1/5 of an acre total. ...
This is very minor even by organic agriculture standards. A commercial U.S. farm using high-quality organic fertilizers outputs an average of 45 tons per acre, a commercial U.S. farm using non-organic water-soluble minerals outputs about 70 tons per acre.
There's no cows or bulls in the equation because they are inefficient sources of nutrition.Maybe not but they sure are yummy! (Actually I'm more a fish/fowl/lamb/goat person but about 4 times a year I crave a tenderloin.) I have gardened very intensively and grown more than my family of 3 wanted or I wanted to can/put up so some went to waste and I didn't take full advantage of my season; I did it on 1/8 acre so I know what's possible.
Hey, how come 2 coffee trees supply 2 people for a year but 1 only supplies me for 1/2 year? Just wondering....
eddiemunozep
12-22-2013, 10:16 PM
I want to be the amateur here. 1.33 acres would never be enough for me. Is this study referring to just fruits and veggies? I would need a lot of land for my animals, too. Would love to have more chickens and a couple milk goats to make my own cheese....
I will have to keep dreaming.....
growing all your food would be a full time job and require help.
Here is the video of those people in LA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCmTJkZy0rM&feature=youtube_gdata_player
Richard
12-22-2013, 10:24 PM
... Hey, how come 2 coffee trees supply 2 people for a year but 1 only supplies me for 1/2 year? Just wondering....
That has been the observation of coffee trees grown in good conditions, but in isolation of others.
kizanne
12-22-2013, 10:24 PM
Kat2
I'm in Zone 8b right down the road from you in Tallahassee.
I find that I love raised bed. If you use Mel's Mix you can grow just about anything. I sprout in the standard peat pods and transfer or repot after seed leaves appear for some items. Peas, beans, sweet potato I direct plant and some things like green pepper I just buy a nice size start from the local nursery, they have different varieties and are some cheaper than bonnie's.
Mel's mix comes from the square foot gardening book. It is simply 1/3 compost, 1/3 vermiculite and 1/3 peat moss. Then each season you add some compost for fertilizer. I have an on the ground bed that is only about 6" high on the side and a much nicer raised bed which means not as much squatting and bending.
I have my double mahoi in a cold frame right now. I have planted broccoli, cauliflower, rutabaga, collards, swiss chard, eggplant (though that will probably be toast on Tuesday), green pepper, sugar snap peas, kohrabi, red cabbage, lettuce (3 different varieties), brussel sprouts, radish, and carrot.
That is all in about 150 sq. ft of space and some of that is taken up by strawberries.
I am crossing my fingers for my tilapia as this is their first winter outside. They are large enough to eat but I want some babies and the indoor 125 gallon was getting too small for 9 of these large guys so 4 went to the outdoor pond. I have a ground water loop to keep the temp up and I just sat a composter with fresh chicken poop on top to hopefully warm the ground and the water loop. Only Christmas day will tell if they survive the 29 degrees projected here on Tuesday night.
It certainly helps to have almost year round decent weather. I will eventually up grade to a cold frame maybe even a greenhouse. I'll be planting the bananas against a brick south facing wall with my avacado so hoping that will be enough cause I'm not much for constant babying. I also am close to a large lake that keeps us about 4 degrees warmer than right up the hill.
Richard
12-22-2013, 10:36 PM
... It certainly helps to have almost year round decent weather. ...
Consider what the Mennonites do in Homestead AB, USDA hardiness zone 3. The studies from Cornell and others show them consistently below 2 acres per person: man, woman, and child -- and with a surplus to sell! Of course everyone works from a very young age and there is no place for laggards in their culture.
That has been the observation of coffee trees grown in good conditions, but in isolation of others.Well, I do plan to see if I can grow more than 1 plant here; I plan to market Jacksonville coffee as the best in the world and sell it for a bazillion dollars per bean. ;)
Seriously, I'm like a kid in a candy shop. I can, if I can figure out the dirt and bug issue, grow nearly anything I want year round here! (Okay, I'm willing to do a hoophouse when I get my own place but nothing more.) I've waited all my life for this!
Richard
12-22-2013, 10:53 PM
Well, I do plan to see if I can grow more than 1 plant here; I plan to market Jacksonville coffee as the best in the world and sell it for a bazillion dollars per bean. ;)
I recommend you don't grow them from seed, and don't buy the plants cultivated for indoor ornamental growth that are sold by many nurseries and online novelty stores.
kizanne, I never bothered with Mel's mix; I made my own stuff from leaf mould and it worked plus it was free which I really liked. Your fish should do fine outside where you are. I never had any success with peat pots; I ended up either grabbing plug trays tossed by nurseries or making newspaper pots. (I didn't buy any gadget but just decided on what size I needed and rolled strips around it then stapled 2x and filled with good starting dirt/cooked compost/potting soil. Squash and such hate having their roots disturbed so I used a tube of caulk to form a long pot--pinch the end when you plant--roots go deep that way. Tomatoes/peppers/eggplant aren't as picky so a pill bottle works. Cheap and the paper breaks down!)
I have a huge basil that won't quit! A few seeds are coming up in the pots but, when I get back from my Christmas trip, I'll be experimenting with starting seedlings in potting soil. Right now I have tomatoes, peppers, beans, squash, lettuce and spinach that are not thriving but healthily alive. If I were in MD or Ohio, they'd have been toast on Halloween. I'm going to outsmart FL if it's the last thing I do!
I recommend you don't grow them from seed, and don't buy the plants cultivated for indoor ornamental growth that are sold by many nurseries and online novelty stores.Wellspring? Where?
crazy banana
12-23-2013, 12:22 AM
I love the way this thread is going....
After reading all this, I really need to start growing more of my own veggies and fruits again in my garden and raised beds. So maybe I need to change the title to more self - sufficient, or at least veggies and fruits not easily available here in California(Kizanne: Kohlrabi is so yummy, but rarely available at the supermarkets or farmers markets here), but usually we are so spoiled with getting any produce fresh at any given time of the year.
As a coffee addict I like the idea of growing coffee. There is someone up North from here who roasts his own coffee beans. Delicious!
Richard
12-23-2013, 01:25 AM
Where?
There are multiple species, hybrids, and cultivars of coffee -- and a wide variety of tastes among them. The roasting process also shapes the taste, so a poor variety or a poor roast will make for poor tasting coffee.
So first identify what cultivar you'd like to grow, then find someone with the plant and grow from cuttings. For your area, consult this guide: HS1056/HS306: Coffee Growing in the Florida Home Landscape (http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/hs306)
bananimal
12-23-2013, 01:30 AM
When I was getting my bachelor's the figure we were told was 900 sqft. But that is in my part of the world where you can grow all year. We actually had to plan the garden out for a year. Its pretty intense to do as it requires a lot of relay cropping and intercropping. A bunch of bananas has 10000 calories, roughly. I think the 100 plants behind my house yield 2 million calories per year on 1/6 Acre. I could definitely grow greens and calabaza in the middles. If I had coconuts that would be a good protein source. I could live out of my backyard. I just wouldnt get much meat.
I've seen your best source of free meat swimming around in the canal behind the bananas. Need a harpoon and duct tape. lol
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=55471&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=55471&ppuser=820)
kizanne
12-23-2013, 07:11 AM
Crazy,
I love Kholrabi too. I first got it in a CSA bag and so this year I sprung for some seedlings since it was getting late and I hadn't thought to plant any.
I have some tomato's sprouted but after Christmas I'll be sprouting a second round of Kholrabi as it doesn't take that long to grow to a nice medium size. Sneak that second round in while my tomatos get nice and lanky under the indoor lights. I like to get them a little more than a foot tall then bury the stem for a good root system.
You know you can grow sweet 100's in almost anything including a milk jug. Won't get a big as they do in the ground but I've gotten tomato's off them way back when I didn't have a nice garden.
PR-Giants
12-23-2013, 09:58 AM
You know you can grow sweet 100's in almost anything including a milk jug.
Sweet 100's in a pop bottle.
Topper's Place - Pop Bottle Pots - Recycled bottles, make self-watering planters (http://www.toppers-place.com/pop_bottle_pots.htm)
http://www.bananas.org/f8/useful-sources-info-plants-3123.html
I have a tomato blooming! This is my 1st tomato bloom in Florida! Plants set into ground last May just died despite fertilizing and adding compost. It's a volunteer that came with with a plant from someone else's compost so odds are it's not a choice variety (hybrid reverting) but I was not about to spend another dime on plants until I saw some success.
PR-Giants
12-23-2013, 12:21 PM
We're lucky they only use safe systemic pesticides to kill these guys...
Entomology PR: Hypothenemus hampei: The coffee berry borer (http://entomologylabpr.blogspot.com/2013/01/hypothenemus-hampei-coffee-berry-borer.html?q=weevil)
Species Araecerus fasciculatus - Coffee Bean Weevil - BugGuide.Net (http://bugguide.net/node/view/302850)
Richard
12-23-2013, 12:22 PM
I have a tomato blooming! This is my 1st tomato bloom in Florida! Plants set into ground last May just died despite fertilizing and adding compost. It's a volunteer that came with with a plant from someone else's compost so odds are it's not a choice variety (hybrid reverting) but I was not about to spend another dime on plants until I saw some success.
Nearly all tomato hybrids sold are stable when pollenized with the same hybrid. What is typically reported as "hybrid reversion" is not -- what has actually happened is cross-pollination from some other tomato or compatible relative in the garden.
The only unstable annual vegetable hybrids I've noticed in recent years are new, patented hybrids -- and it is printed on the label as F1, F2, etc. For reliably packed seeds, I recommend you avoid the online sellers who engage in fear-based advertising tactics. Two reputable suppliers I use are Johnny's Selected Seeds (http://www.johnnyseeds.com/) and Tomato Growers Supply Company (http://www.tomatogrowers.com/).
crazy banana
12-23-2013, 12:58 PM
Sweet 100's in a pop bottle.
http://www.bananas.org/f8/useful-sources-info-plants-3123.html
That is some really "good reads".
Thank you!
Nearly all tomato hybrids sold are stable when pollenized with the same hybrid. What is typically reported as "hybrid reversion" is not -- what has actually happened is cross-pollination from some other tomato or compatible relative in the garden.
The only unstable annual vegetable hybrids I've noticed in recent years are new, patented hybrids -- and it is printed on the label as F1, F2, etc. For reliably packed seeds, I recommend you avoid the online sellers who engage in fear-based advertising tactics. Two reputable suppliers I use are Johnny's Selected Seeds (http://www.johnnyseeds.com/) and Tomato Growers Supply Company (http://www.tomatogrowers.com/).I rarely buy tomato plants or seeds; I have at least 40 packs of Green Zebra and the like I've saved. Included is one of the best paste I've ever had: San Marino. (Not Marzano and good luck finding information about them.) I gave seeds to my landscaping buddy; her son who is a chef told her to never grow another for sauce. I suspect what's blooming now were F1s but it really doesn't matter; any tomato will be devoured appreciatively. BTW, I'm not planting any of my stash until I conquer this dirt.
Richard
12-23-2013, 05:27 PM
... I suspect what's blooming now were F1s ...
I seriously doubt it. Packets of patented seeds are very slow sellers.
I seriously doubt it. Packets of patented seeds are very slow sellers.I save OP tomatoes; these plants came from seeds from hybrid tomatoes that sprouted in the compost. I transplanted them expecting them to die; they didn't.
Richard
12-23-2013, 08:12 PM
I save OP tomatoes;
You mean off-patent tomatoes? Most off-patent tomatoes are hybrids, albeit stable.
these plants came from seeds from hybrid tomatoes that sprouted in the compost. I transplanted them expecting them to die; they didn't.
Just because they are hybrid doesn't mean they are unstable. That is a myth touted by marketeers using fear-based advertising.
If they don't come true to type, then it is almost always because the host plant received some pollen from a different tomato or tomato-compatible source.
You mean off-patent tomatoes? Most off-patent tomatoes are hybrids, albeit stable.I suppose I do. I've never bagged tomato blossoms yet seed saved came true. Except for the year I stuck a currant (only potato leaf) in the mix. Next year? I had some crackers. Worthless pink pear shaped fruit that cracks before turning red and tastes nasty. (A good friend very knowledgeable about tomato crosses and tomatoes clued me in. He trades seeds from all over; he's gotten some of them.) Tossed all seeds from that year and went back to my provens; I never plant my entire stash.
Just because they are hybrid doesn't mean they are unstable. That is a myth touted by marketeers using fear-based advertising.
If they don't come true to type, then it is almost always because the host plant received some pollen from a different tomato or tomato-compatible source.Not necessarily. A friend's father and I were gardening friends in the 80s. We lived more than a mile apart but both let volunteers from hybrids grow; we both ended up with tasteless huge cherries. Soured me on bothering with Early Girl or any of he "gotta grow" varieties. That said, I did purchase hybrids for "the south" knowing I would not save a single seed. Turns out I didn't get a chance; they never bloomed.
Richard
12-23-2013, 10:26 PM
Not necessarily. A friend's father and I were gardening friends in the 80s. We lived more than a mile apart but both let volunteers from hybrids grow; we both ended up with tasteless huge cherries.
I believe it. Further, I believe they were pollenized by other tomato varieties growing in those gardens or nearby.
Many hybrids contain the genetics of cherry tomatoes because somewhere early along the line they were cross-bred with cherry tomato for hardiness. It is standard practice. So if you look at the offspring of tomatoes grown in a home garden, the probability of getting cherry is about 40%, the probability of getting an even mix of attributes between the parent and the donor is also about 40%, and the probability of getting something else entirely is about 20%.
Further, if the only two plants in the garden were the parent and a cherry, the probability of getting a cherry offspring is nearly 100%.
eddiemunozep
12-23-2013, 10:52 PM
Well if southern California doesn't get a lot rain this winter I am going to have to keep 13 banana plants in pots 15 gal and 5 gal until spring 2015 assuming we get good rain next winter.
Much less growing my vegetables and herbs this season. Trying to understand all this talk about tomatoes. All I know is that I haven't found the correct correct variety for my area.
Eddie
I believe it. Further, I believe they were pollenized by other tomato varieties growing in those gardens or nearby.
Many hybrids contain the genetics of cherry tomatoes because somewhere early along the line they were cross-bred with cherry tomato for hardiness. It is standard practice. So if you look at the offspring of tomatoes grown in a home garden, the probability of getting cherry is about 40%, the probability of getting an even mix of attributes between the parent and the donor is also about 40%, and the probability of getting something else entirely is about 20%.
Further, if the only two plants in the garden were the parent and a cherry, the probability of getting a cherry offspring is nearly 100%.I called them cherries--perhaps I should have said cherry bombs. Simply awful. I haven't looked back after sticking to old varieties. I just learned that the seeds were probably from the supermarket so what these plants produce are anyone's guess. FL supermarket tomatoes are dreadful...
crazy banana
12-24-2013, 12:11 AM
Well if southern California doesn't get a lot rain this winter I am going to have to keep 13 banana plants in pots 15 gal and 5 gal until spring 2015 assuming we get good rain next winter.
Much less growing my vegetables and herbs this season. Trying to understand all this talk about tomatoes. All I know is that I haven't found the correct correct variety for my area.
Eddie
I too have yet to find the correct varieties with good yields. Our coastal fog causes powdery mildew issues on my plants. The more resistant varieties just do not taste that great, so there is the juggle between mildew resistant varieties and/ or fighting the diseases organically or with the least amount of chemicals.
Richard
12-24-2013, 01:01 AM
I too have yet to find the correct varieties with good yields. Our coastal fog causes powdery mildew issues on my plants. The more resistant varieties just do not taste that great, so there is the juggle between mildew resistant varieties and/ or fighting the diseases organically or with the least amount of chemicals.
Consider the presence of copper in the soil where tomatoes are native, and the lack of it in your soil. Now go buy some Liqui-Cop (http://www.montereylawngarden.com/product_information.aspx?242000p=38d342ec-490d-4a2b-8680-a5c80e030d41&240000p=0fcd062e-3250-4d03-9e74-3be36cab8eb4). It is not certified-organic for homeowners, but it is for those who have a license.
crazy banana
12-24-2013, 01:22 AM
I do not see it on your website. Do you carry it?
eddiemunozep
12-24-2013, 01:27 AM
Liqui-cop I got at home depot
Richard
12-24-2013, 02:09 AM
I do not see it on your website. Do you carry it?
Nope. I only sell fertilizer products from Grow More. There are other sites that buy pesticides by the pallet and offer great prices.
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