View Full Version : Thoughts on the Fukushima contamination
momoese
08-24-2013, 10:08 PM
I'm very concerned about this. It looks like TEPCO has been lying since the beginning. Looks like things are far worse than any government agency or mainstream media is letting on to. Now the Japanese government has finally stepped in but it doesn't sound like they have any clue what to do about it. From what I've read the radiation is here on the west coast of the USA and it can and most likely will effect all living things here including our produce that in turn effects the rest of the country and the globe.
We have been talking about moving to Oregon, but this may change things especially seeing how my wife can get Danish citizenship.
I'm also looking for for diet/nutrition ideas to deal with this contamination.
I have a lot of stuff bookmarked but would appreciate your input.
sunfish
08-24-2013, 10:44 PM
If you go to Denmark bring your fishin gear
sunfish
08-24-2013, 10:48 PM
Just a hop skip and a jump to Ante's
momoese
08-24-2013, 10:52 PM
If you go to Denmark bring your fishin gear
My wife has family on Bornholm that fish for a living, and hunt for food/fun. No gear needed but I'd bring mine anyway. :)
hanabananaman
08-24-2013, 11:41 PM
Hate to alarm anyone but if you do a search of US Fukushima deaths there was a significant jump in death rates on the west coast. The estimates are about 14,000 additional deaths. Mostly the weak and vulnerable. Sounds unreal but there are a lot of reports that back it up.
sunfish
08-25-2013, 12:00 AM
Is everything we read on the internet true ?
momoese
08-25-2013, 12:17 AM
Is everything we read on the internet true ?
No.
Is everything that the mainstream corporate bought news and governments tell you true?
sunfish
08-25-2013, 12:30 AM
No.
Is everything that the mainstream corporate bought news and governments tell you true?
Is everything everyone on the Org. tell us true ?
That's my point. How do you separate fact from BS. I tried a BS thread but no one posted
momoese
08-25-2013, 12:36 AM
Is everything everyone on the Org. tell us true ?
That's my point. How do you separate fact from BS. I tried a BS thread but no one posted
No. You have to do your own research.
momoese
08-25-2013, 01:08 AM
Back on point, i'm looking for tips to survive the contamination should we stay here. If you have anything constructive to add please do.
Dalmatiansoap
08-25-2013, 02:09 AM
I dont know how worth it is. In my opinion its more like "u can run but U cant hide" theory. That Fukushima thing we will all over the Globe.
Anyway Im always ready for quality cuisine!
:nanadrink:
Dangermouse01
08-25-2013, 06:33 AM
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120326002953/simpsons/images/thumb/8/87/Blinky_Art.png/250px-Blinky_Art.png
DM
GreenFin
08-25-2013, 06:48 AM
My view: grow your own food indoors in a clean environment (e.g. get water from deep clean wells, scrub/filter external air before blowing it inside, and don't bring in contaminated mulch/compost/fertilizer/etc). If you can't do it for your particular family (say, because of lack of space), then band together with others.
My first test system, a high tunnel aquaponics design, was featured on C2Cam a couple of months after the earthquake/meltdowns: Aquaponic Garden - Photos - Coast to Coast AM (http://www.coasttocoastam.com/photo/view/aquaponic_garden/51718) I posted an update here on the forum a while back with an explanation and some pics of the fish: http://www.bananas.org/f2/my-1st-flag-leaf-dwarf-cavendish-17882.html#post218284
My second test system, a 4,500 gallon indoor greenwater aquaculture pond, is used to grow tilapia (which filter-feed on algae) and to fertigate the plants in my third system.
My third test system, a semi-pit walipini, is outlined in a thread here on the forum: http://www.bananas.org/f2/my-semi-pit-banana-greenhouse-18518.html
momoese
08-25-2013, 09:43 AM
I thought this was interesting.
Miso Protects Against Radiation, Cancer and Hypertension (http://www.greenmedinfo.com/blog/miso-protects-against-radiation-cancer-and-hypertension)
Worm_Farmer
08-25-2013, 11:21 AM
It is mostly FAKE news. The powers at hand are trying to scare you and keep you thinking that life with out Big Brother is not possible. Look at what has happened in other areas that had more serious melt downs. Chernobyl and 3 mile island
You should be more worried about all the Chem trails in you see in the sky everyday.
momoese
08-25-2013, 12:10 PM
It is mostly FAKE news. The powers at hand are trying to scare you and keep you thinking that life with out Big Brother is not possible. Look at what has happened in other areas that had more serious melt downs. Chernobyl and 7 mile island
You should be more worried about all the Chem trails in you see in the sky everyday.
Chernobyl was small potatoes compared to what is and will continue to happen at Fukushima. Even the mainstream media can no longer hide the truth.
BBC News - Fukushima leak is 'much worse than we were led to believe' (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-23779561)
Worm_Farmer
08-25-2013, 12:30 PM
Dont worry, They will just dump it all into the ocean behind our backs.
Dilution is the solution.
Just another way to make us depend on there "Clean water and canned air" And don't eat the fish any more. I personally believe if this were so bad Japan would feel the effects first if not right away. Their work force would drop like rocks and they would stop exporting and their market would crash very quickly.
Worm_Farmer
08-25-2013, 12:42 PM
BTW, I am just poking the fire right now. My option is mute on this subject. I like to stirrup Controversy.
momoese
08-25-2013, 01:03 PM
I don't expect Japan or the US to ever be honest about the level of contamination due to the economic collapse it would create. They are already finding elevated levels in CA produce and fish caught locally that don't migrate. That is no bueno.
momoese
08-25-2013, 02:58 PM
BGD - Special Issue - Impacts of the Fukushima nuclear power plant discharges on the ocean (http://www.biogeosciences-discuss.net/special_issue100.html)
momoese
08-25-2013, 03:04 PM
Lots of legit info here
Berkeley Radiological Air and Water Monitoring Forum | Department of Nuclear Engineering (http://www.nuc.berkeley.edu/category/forums/berkeley-radiological-air-and-water-monitoring-forum)
GreenFin
08-25-2013, 03:58 PM
Look at what has happened in other areas that had more serious melt downs. Chernobyl
Yikes, man, that's really inaccurate. I have indeed looked into Chernobyl in some depth, and if folks want to be legitimately horrified, they should do the same.
Not only was Chernobyl pretty horrific, there's the overwhelmingly important point that the aftermath was darn near the best possible scenario because Russia immediately implemented one of the most profound mobilizations of human badassery in history. Tens of thousands of troops were sent there immediately and immediately got to work on containing the problem (so that it wouldn't get out of hand, as Fukushima has). They poured hundreds of thousands of people into a desperate, 24/7 mega-engineering project to encapsulate the problem. Fukushima is being battled primarily by a few dozen Tepco employees with spitwads and garden hoses (that's unfortunately only a very slight exaggeration).
Fukushima utterly dwarfs Chernobyl. Utterly and completely. We are in a drastically worse situation now than we were following the Chernobyl incident. And I don't mean like twice as bad, I mean like a thousand times or a million times as bad.
First, there are already multiple meltdowns (as the people who have followed this closely have known since day one). Those molten blobs are already in the ground on their way toward rendering a large portion of Japan's groundwater hysterically unusable and creating perpetual geysers of hyper-radioactive steam. That alone dwarfs Chernobyl. Chernobyl was contained; Fukushima was out of control, possibly permanently, from day one.
Second, there are 1,300+ fuel rods stored in an upper floor of the crumbling reactor #4. Those are at EXTREME risk of going critical. If you want to picture hell on earth, a sputtering open-air nuclear reaction with all that fuel would be sufficient. [At that point we'd probably see some really amazing/horrifying hail Mary's, such as trying to use nukes to blow that entire section of Japan into the ocean as a 'lesser of two evils' option by keeping as much of the radioactive particles out of the atmosphere as possible.]
Third, there hasn't been jack squat of a containment effort compared to Chernobyl. There is just no comparison between the massive, almost miraculous nationwide effort put forth by Russia to barely contain their vastly smaller problem, and the tiny, pitiful effort put forth by a laughably overwhelmed private company. It's like comparing the building of the Great Wall of China to the building of the electric fence around my garden.
My view is that most if not all of Japan was effectively lost on day one. The ensuing 2 years have just been about desperately trying to cover up that fact and somewhat doing a half-ass job of trying to prevent the much, much, much, much wider destruction that would result from having those fuel rods take off. Tepco is going to start trying to remove the rods in November (it's only a matter of time until the building collapses anyway, so they HAVE to make this desperate play). It's an incredibly delicate and difficult operation even in the best of circumstances with functioning equipment. They're going to have to try to do it manually, since their computer controls just fry in that environment. If things go flawlessly, it will still take them years to finish, just due to the sheer number of rods being stored there and the damaged condition of the holding pool/building/equipment/etc. I think it's overwhelmingly likely that things won't go perfectly and that we're going to witness the most fubared event in human history at that time. If I were to guesstimate odds, I'd say there's only about a 5% chance they pull it off; put another way, 95% chance of hardcore doom for the entire northern hemisphere at a minimum.
I majored in nuclear engineering for a year and got to get up close and personal with a real, functioning reactor, but I did not get a degree in NE. I have not had a nuclear engineering job. My graduate work was in a completely unrelated field. I have not recently stayed at a Holiday Inn. My word is not gospel. But as for me, my life permanently changed on 3/11/2011. As I watched the events unfold in those early hours/days, I was already coming to terms with the likely repercussions and setting my mind and actions toward dealing with what likely lay ahead. It wasn't out of hobby-like interest; it came screaming from my intuition as a primal call to survival.
Best of luck to all of you. These are indeed interesting times. I cannot stress enough the importance of clean indoor food production. Fukushima is one sufficient reason to do it, though there is another: whereas indoor food production may be our only source of clean food in the near future, it may be our only dependable source of food, period, a bit farther out (decade or two, maybe less imo) due to rapid onset climate change. Frozen methane is already destabilizing en masse and roaring to the surface. Methane levels in the arctic are already spiking, and this is just the opening salvo; the pace will pick up considerably in a few years when the ice is gone. We're about to go through one of those 'cycles' that the earth has admittedly experienced before (during massive extinction events), but this time on steroids in comparison to those past cycles. Outdoor agriculture will soon be decimated by uncooperative, unpredictable weather and rapidly changing/meandering hardiness zones. It's too late to reverse, imo, but I expect to see some truly freaky Hail Mary attempts to mitigate, such as mega-engineering projects aimed at burning off gigatons of methane as it belches out of the frozen north and seeks to make its death march southward.
To finish on topic, hopefully Stanford's breakthrough cancer cure (http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/testing_starts_creates_homegrown_4jSHWpWFBEkczPTFque7VM), which goes into human trials in 2014, is a massive success.
GreenFin
08-25-2013, 04:11 PM
On the subject of Berkeley, note that, like virtually any collection of humans, they're not all "good guys" there. There was one nuclear engineer who seemed to be serving as an obvious disinformation agent soon after the incident. His schtick was to push the following comparison on the press as being legitimate:
A) experiencing being bombarded by radiation on a cross-country flight;
and
B) ingesting radioactive particles
Those two are NOT equal. B is MASSIVELY worse than A. Utter apples to oranges nonsense. But his stupid, false comparison was picked up and repeated endlessly in the press.
So wrong it's evil.
momoese
08-25-2013, 04:26 PM
Berkely also has a rep for spreading mis info on GMO's thanks to huge grants from Monsanto.
Thanks for taking the time to share your thoughts. I've read several opinion pieces from nuclear experts that are inline with you, some even more dire.
bengtang
08-29-2013, 12:22 AM
“Fukushima: Your Days of Eating Pacific Ocean Fish Are Over At the Very Least”
"Fukushima: Your Days of Eating Pacific Ocean Fish Are Over At the Very Least" | Alternative (http://beforeitsnews.com/alternative/2013/08/fukushima-your-days-of-eating-pacific-ocean-fish-are-over-at-the-very-least-2748726.html)
Fukushima apocalypse: Years of ‘duct tape fixes’ could result in ‘millions of deaths’
Fukushima apocalypse: Years of ‘duct tape fixes’ could result in ‘millions of deaths’ — RT News (http://rt.com/news/fukushima-apocalypse-fuel-removal-598/)
laserlight
09-03-2013, 01:26 AM
I have some interesting articles to share.
First more leaks were found over the weekend.
More leaks feared at Japan's Fukushima nuclear plant - CNN.com (http://www.cnn.com/2013/09/02/world/asia/japan-fukushima-radioactive-water/)
Next an older article. The radioactivity is increasing in a well and the scientists dont know why.
In mid-July, levels of radioactive cesium-137 and cesium-134 from monitoring wells inside the plant unexpectedly surged nearly 15-fold, a phenomenon that scientists have been unable to explain.
Its still doing that and its now even worse. I will post the link when I find it.
Latest Radioactive Leak at Fukushima: How Is It Different? (http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/energy/2013/08/130821-fukushima-latest-leak-how-is-it-different/)
Next the groundwater radiation is peaking and it will be reaching the sea soon.
Fukushima Groundwater Shows Record Radiation Levels (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/09/fukushima-groundwater-radiation_n_3565767.html)
Now, 2 1/2 years later, experts fear it is about to reach the ocean and greatly worsen what is fast becoming a new crisis at Fukushima: the inability to contain vast quantities of radioactive water.
The looming crisis is potentially far greater than the discovery earlier this week of a leak from a tank that stores contaminated water used to cool the reactor cores. That 300-ton (80,000-gallon) leak is the fifth and most serious from a tank since the March 2011 disaster, when three of the plant's reactors melted down after a huge earthquake and tsunami knocked out the plant's power and cooling functions.
But experts believe the underground seepage from the reactor and turbine building area is much bigger and possibly more radioactive, confronting the plant's operator, Tokyo Electric Power Co., with an invisible, chronic problem and few viable solutions.
At Fukushima, Radioactive Groundwater Nears Sea (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/08/23/fukushima-radioactive-groundwater_n_3803448.html)
K. Now the lighter side. Mutant veggies.
Deformed Vegetables, Fruit Reportedly Pop Up Around Japan Nuclear Plant - ABC News (http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2013/07/deformed-vegetables-fruit-reportedly-pop-up-around-japan-nuclear-plant/)
Btw we have a gieger counter for radioactivity. The count has risen from 14 clicks before the disaster to 30 clicks now. And we dont even live on the west coast.
caliboy1994
09-03-2013, 01:37 AM
All I know is that it's probably a bad idea to go boogie boarding at Zuma Beach right now.
laserlight
09-03-2013, 01:41 AM
All I know is that it's probably a bad idea to go boogie boarding at Zuma Beach right now.
Lol yeah! Or wind surfing! And watch for 2 headed sharks!
WE'RE ALL GOING TO DIE !
No really
Bleh.... Lost my long post.......oh well then some vitriol.......
Idiots, the whole lot of them.
Amateur hour.
Don't we look like a bunch of little kids who got burned playing with matches.
This event is the result of a social phenomenon which I will define thusly....... Has two Masters Degrees but cannot change a car tire.
My prediction, bomb shelters will be back in style late next decade. :lurk:
Lemmysports
09-03-2013, 08:50 PM
I am intentionally exposing myself so that I become immune (and hopefully my kids will be even stronger.) Survival of the fittest right? I also drink copious amounts of bourbon, eat bacon, and don't wear nearly enough sunblock... maybe that's a bad idea, but than again, maybe stressing yourself out something that you cannot control is not soo healthy either? In the words of Lamb of God: "There's no one left to save!"
laserlight
09-04-2013, 06:04 AM
They found a way to fix Fukushima and stop the ground water from getting into the sea. Its an idea they used in Tennessee only that accident was 150x smaller but they think it can work. They are making nuclear ice cubes! :D
If you go to Japan then take warm hoodies and bobsleds.
http://www.nbcnews.com/science/japan-build-ice-barrier-around-fukushima-nuclear-ruins-8C11067684
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