View Full Version : Creating my own Fert
bananafarmer
05-01-2012, 01:49 PM
Mixing my own Fert is my newest idea.
After reading the forum, realizing that the best ratio of giving fert ist 4-1-6 NPK is I decided to create my own fert.
Another reason is, this way its cheaper than buying ready-fert, that has also not the perfect NPK-ratio for bananas.
The Fert I am feeding the bananas is 10-2,5-15, for creating this I use Ormin-k a organic-potas fert, with 30% K2O it has a ph of 5-7,
My second ingredient ist Urea (here its called Üre) has a N of 46 %.
My third ingredient is 18-46, it has 18%N and 46% 'Fosfor`.
So When I use two bags of Ormin-K I have 15 kg net K, when I use 5,4 kg 18-46 I have about 2,5 kg P,
Whats left is the N I need 10 kg, with the 18-46 I have already 972 gr, to complete the amount I have to add 9kg and 28gr,
I get this from the urea, I have to add about 19,6 kg to the mix to get my formula.
So I have 10 kg of Nitrat, 2,5kg of Phosfor and 15 kg of Kalium.
I give this mix to my plants in one watering every 21 days.
When I have 450 bananas every banana gets 33 gr K, 22g N and 5,5gr P with every watering every 21days.
I am using this mix for about six weeks.
What do you think about this amount and the mix? Any suggestions, any ideas ?
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=48674&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=48674&ppuser=12430)
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=48673&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=48673&ppuser=12430)
sunfish
05-01-2012, 01:54 PM
Mixing my own Fert is mey newest idea.
After reading the forum, realizing that the best ratio of giving fert ist 4-1-6 NPK is I decided to create my own fert.
Another reason is, this way its cheaper than buying ready-fert, that has also not the perfect NPK-ratio for bananas.
The Fert I am feeding the bananas is 10-2,5-15, for creating this I use Ormin-k a organic-potas fert, with 30% K2O it has a ph of 5-7,
My second ingredient ist Urea (here its called Üre) has a N of 46 %.
My third ingredient is 18-46, it has 18%N and 46% 'Fosfor`.
So When I use two bags of Ormin-K I have 15 kg net K, when I use 5,4 kg 18-46 I have about 1,5 kg P,
Whats left is the N I need 10 kg, with the 18-46 I have already 972 gr, to complete the amount I have to add 9kg and 28gr,
I get this from the urea, I have to add about 19,6 kg to the mix to get my formula.
So I have 10 kg of Nitrat, 2,5kg of Phosfor and 15 kg of Kalium.
I give this mix to my plants in one watering every 21 days.
When I have 450 bananas every banana gets 33 gr K, 22g N and 5,5gr with every watering every 21days.
I am using this mix for about six weeks.
What do you thing about this amount and the mix? Any suggestions, any ideas ?
Over my head but sounds good to me
oakshadows
05-01-2012, 05:19 PM
Good luck, we use all organic and sometimes it isn't what we want but we still know what is in the mix. Nice thing about organic that if it is mixed right one cannot over fertilize. Here the soil is very sandy, actually we live on a 160 foot sand dune, so in the garden area we use worm composted cow manure and pine needle compost.
This puts in most of the needed nutrients and the carbon, and some room to breathe. When a plant is ready to go into the ground we add microrhizal fungi to the roots and water in good. Many use Thrive or an equivilent to improve the root system and its ability to absorb nutrients from the soil. Wish you luck and post results please.
Richard
05-01-2012, 07:58 PM
I give this mix to my plants in one watering every 21 days.
When I have 450 bananas every banana gets 33 gr K, 22g N and 5,5gr P with every watering every 21days.
I am using this mix for about six weeks.
:08:
Your computations are excellent.
Here is something to compare to: If each plant receives about 57 gallons (216 liters) water total every three weeks, then the amount of N-P-K is nearly ideal. It would be equivalent to 100ppm Nitrogen, 25ppm Phosphate, 150ppm Potash concentration in water.
To calculate ppm concentration in water, for example of Nitrogen:
[Total lbs] • [% N] • (1600 / 135) • (100 / Gallons) • (100 / IR) = [ppm N]
where
[Total lbs] = total pounds of fertilizer mix
[% N] = percentage of Nitrogen in the fertilizer mix
Gallons = gallons of water being used with the mix
IR = injection ratio. If you are not using a fertilizer injector, then IR = 1.
It appears you are only supplying your bananas with raw N-P-K. They would both perform better and taste better with a micronutrients supplement. An inexpensive way to do this is with Liquid Seaweed Extract. It is not balanced for plants, but is better than none.
Happy Growing!
a1nipper
05-01-2012, 08:11 PM
I have much to learn! I was just going to use MG.
Nicolas Naranja
05-01-2012, 10:56 PM
You've got the big 3 covered, Don't shortchange your plants on the other macro and micronutrients. If your pH is high(>7) you might run short on Mn, Zn an B.
bananafarmer
05-02-2012, 12:02 AM
:08:
Your computations are excellent.
Here is something to compare to: If each plant receives about 57 gallons (216 liters) water total every three weeks, then the amount of N-P-K is nearly ideal. It would be equivalent to 100ppm Nitrogen, 25ppm Phosphate, 150ppm Potash concentration in water.
To calculate ppm concentration in water, for example of Nitrogen:
[Total lbs] • [% N] • (1600 / 135) • (100 / Gallons) • (100 / IR) = [ppm N]
where
[Total lbs] = total pounds of fertilizer mix
[% N] = percentage of Nitrogen in the fertilizer mix
Gallons = gallons of water being used with the mix
IR = injection ratio. If you are not using a fertilizer injector, then IR = 1.
It appears you are only supplying your bananas with raw N-P-K. They would both perform better and taste better with a micronutrients supplement. An inexpensive way to do this is with Liquid Seaweed Extract. It is not balanced for plants, but is better than none.
Happy Growing!
The ppm-aspect is really interesting, never did it this way, I suppose also it is difficult for me to make according to ppm-ratio.
I have sprinkler-system, before feeding the plants with fert I water about fifteen minutes to prepare the plants and the soil,
then I give the fert in a 220 liter barrel, not at one time, giving some amount to the barrell mix it with water and do this a few times again.
This is because for better distrubuting the fert, also I do not want to burn the bananas, suppose urea can burn , when high ppm in water.
After giving fert I go on with watering for about 15 minutes, I check visually and sometimes I am digging the soil a little .
The micro-nutrients-aspect is a aspect that I have to care more about.
A few days ago I bought an american product called Rally, from the Nutri Phites series, produced by Biagro Western Sales INC., looks like a very good product for me.
I give it once a week now to the plants , the amount is 300 g evry use. Hope this is a good amount.
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=48679&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=48679&ppuser=12430)
Nutri Phite Rally has 0,4% Bor ,1,5% Copper, 12% Iron ,3,5% Mangan, 4% Zinc, 2% Magnesium, and 14% S (sulfur).
I also give Humic Acid to the plants, about 1,5 liters every week, I could buy some canister with 20 liters for a very good price.
According to the company the product is usable for organic farming, the product itself is called organic.
The product is called Toromol, from a turkish companya called Makrotarim.
bananafarmer
05-02-2012, 12:08 AM
You've got the big 3 covered, Don't shortchange your plants on the other macro and micronutrients. If your pH is high(>7) you might run short on Mn, Zn an B.
In the next time I will buy a ph-analyzer, really have to check the value of my soil and water.
The aspect of the macro and micronutrients seems to be very important, I also believe its difficult to make it perfect.
Some reasons, I leave the leafs and all the banana-stuff inside the greenhouse, it is becoming compost and surely has a lot of nutrients inside, this is good , but the truth is I don not know in which amounts , and I do knot know which elements may be too little.
I never made a soil-analysis, so I do not know my soil-condition.
Richard
05-02-2012, 12:15 AM
I also give Humic Acid to the plants, about 1,5 liters every week, I could buy some canister with 20 liters for a very good price.
Humic acid is a soil conditioner and not a plant nutrient. 1/4 teaspoon per gallon of water 3 times per year is plenty. Do not spray it on the plants, it can clog pores and provide a substrate for fungi to grow in. If you did spray it on your plants and it is not going to rain for awhile I would rinse them off.
bananafarmer
05-02-2012, 12:22 AM
Humic acid is a soil conditioner and not a plant nutrient. 1/4 teaspoon per gallon of water 3 times per year is plenty. Do not spray it on the plants, it can clog pores and provide a substrate for fungi to grow in. If you did spray it on your plants and it is not going to rain for awhile I would rinse them off.
I give the Humic acid with the sprinkler-system, all the soil gets it, the leafs do not come in contact with it, my sprinkler-system is about 40 cm above the ground.
I realize maybe I am giving Humic Acid much to much. Can it harm the soil?
Many people here use Humic Acid once a week, 500 ml for one hectare. I heard it helps the plant to take the nutritients and creates a better soil.I do not have bad experince with it.
The Humic acid also comprises organic material, suppose bananas like this.
I give this one
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=48681&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=48681&ppuser=12430)
Richard
05-02-2012, 12:43 AM
I give the Humic acid with the sprinkler-system, all the soil gets it, the leafs do not come in contact with it, my sprinkler-system is about 40 cm above the ground.
Good
I realize maybe I am giving Humic Acid much to much. Can it harm the soil?
At some point too much carbon and electrolytes will slow down other processes.
Further, you are wasting money.
The Humic acid also comprises organic material.
In terms of carbon chemistry, it is an organic compound. With the exception of CO2, N, and plant hormones, plants uptake inorganic minerals -- not organic material.
Relative to your fertilizer mixture, here are the proportions of secondary and micronutrients I would suggest -- and especially in these ratios to each other. Of course, if your soil already contains some of these, then the individual values need to be changed so that the overall ratios to each other are maintained.
0.8% S
1.6% Mg
3.2% Ca
0.1% Fe
0.01% Cu
0.02% Mn
0.01% Zn
0.02% B
0.001% Co
0.001% Mo
bananafarmer
05-02-2012, 01:07 AM
Good
0.8% S
1.6% Mg
3.2% Ca
0.1% Fe
0.01% Cu
0.02% Mn
0.01% Zn
0.02% B
0.001% Co
0.001% Mo
I understand this, when I have all thes elements separated in liquid form, I could make my own mix.
What is the amount for one plant per year, how often should I give micronutrients?
I know it is difficult to answer this exactly, but any information can help me to create bench marks.
And thank you for your infos Richard.
Richard
05-02-2012, 11:03 AM
This might help you ...
Suppose you were to supply micronutrients every time you watered. I would use this concentration in the total amount of water, including your pre-soak.
The amounts are in ppm:
S 28.5
Mg 57
Ca 114
Fe 2.67
Cu 0.2
Mn 0.75
Zn 0.3
B 0.67
Co 0.0357
Mo 0.0475
It's not an easy set of ratios to get. The main problem is that common sources of Magnesium include equal parts of Sulfur. You might also find it helpful to look for EDHA chelates.
bananafarmer
05-07-2012, 08:20 AM
This might help you ...
Suppose you were to supply micronutrients every time you watered. I would use this concentration in the total amount of water, including your pre-soak.
The amounts are in ppm:
S 28.5
Mg 57
Ca 114
Fe 2.67
Cu 0.2
Mn 0.75
Zn 0.3
B 0.67
Co 0.0357
Mo 0.0475
It's not an easy set of ratios to get. The main problem is that common sources of Magnesium include equal parts of Sulfur. You might also find it helpful to look for EDHA chelates.
Thank you for your advise, at the moment I am not able to water according to ppm.
But I am creatig a nutri-mix according to the amounts you wrote.
I went shopping today,
I bought: Bor(5Liter) liquid form with 5%
, Mangan 5Liter with 3%
, Calcium 5 Liter with 10%
, Cu 5Liter with 5 % ,
Zn 25 kg with 22%,
FE 25 kg with 17 % ,
Magnesium 25 kg with 16% (also has 32 %Sulfur)
Also Sulfur 50 kg with 98%,
When I mix the amounts within water(complete 10 Liter) I add:
100 gr Mg, 320 gr Ca, 6gr Fe, 2 gr Cu, 6,6gr Mn , 0,5 gr Zn, 4gr Bor.
I get your numbers , the pure amount I get is : 16 gr Mg, 32 gr Ca, 1gr Fe, 0,1 gr Cu, 0,2 gr Mn, 0,1 gr Zn, 0,2 gr Bor. I also get 32gr Sulfur ,which is 24 gr too much.
As you mentioned before many Magnesium-supplements inhibit too much Sulfur, mine inhibits 32%, means when I use 100 gr Mg, I also give 32 gr Sulfur, which is 24 gr too much.
What do you think is it very important?
I can try to find a source with pure Mg, without Sulfur.
What do you think about this mix?
I could not find Co and Mo yet, just in mixed-form, not pure. I spent about 200 bucks for all this stuff. Hope it will suffice for a few years.
jmoore
05-07-2012, 09:59 AM
You could try magnesium nitrate, this has no Sulphur and gives you nitrogen.
nannerfunboi
05-07-2012, 10:28 AM
i know richard wont say..but ive read many places that he sells/makes
a good banana fertilizer..with all our herbaceaous friends love..
i think im going to buy from him.. other sellers of "banana fuel"
are much more..especially shipping..
just a thought..
bananafarmer
05-07-2012, 10:51 AM
i know richard wont say..but ive read many places that he sells/makes
a good banana fertilizer..with all our herbaceaous friends love..
i think im going to buy from him.. other sellers of "banana fuel"
are much more..especially shipping..
just a thought..
I would be in America, as a hobby-banana-farmer, I would buy from Richard.
He has really good products and is supporting the customers really good, that is as important as the product itself,
I know many distributors here in Turkey who sell the hell to customers, the customers are forced to use dozens of products in gigantic amounts, what the plants never need.
But I am in Turkey, far away, need big amounts of fuel, I buy my products at the local governmental distributor, the prices are really good there, it is for supporting agriculture.
I do not want to interfere in something.
nannerfunboi
05-07-2012, 10:59 AM
my bad bananafarmer..i should have read earlier u r in turkey..
ya..shipping would kill ya..LOL
ive learned alot on my ferilizing routine,correct balances,plus' and minus'
of organic/inorganic materials..
2 yrs ago..my poor babies were starving out there..i was going on
thinking..frequent fertilizing at low dosages was good.. my tropicals
did ok..but poor things needed much more than i was giving them..
lesson learned..:)
alot of good people here.. ive learned alot !!!
:woohoonaner:
good luck to ya on your confirguration of fertilizing !!!!!
Richard
05-07-2012, 11:31 AM
... As you mentioned before many Magnesium-supplements inhibit too much Sulfur, mine inhibits 32%, means when I use 100 gr Mg, I also give 32 gr Sulfur, which is 24 gr too much.
What do you think is it very important?
I can try to find a source with pure Mg, without Sulfur.
What do you think about this mix?
Well, you have too much sulfur because the wrong set of oxides were chosen. To put the puzzle together correctly requires a lot of work with pencil and paper (or keyboard and spreadsheet!) to find a combination of minerals that will achieve the desired proportions.
Good luck! :08:
bananafarmer
05-07-2012, 11:52 AM
Well, you have too much sulfur because the wrong set of oxides were chosen. To put the puzzle together correctly requires a lot of work with pencil and paper (or keyboard and spreadsheet!) to find a combination of minerals that will achieve the desired proportions.
Good luck! :08:
I will add magnesium without sulfur, I suppose at least my proportions of the nutritions are good. I suppose I am on a good way.
I suppose the products I use are also not bad, two of them have EDTA , chelat-proportion.
One product I was trying to use is not possible to be used with water , its not dissolving in water,it is my powder sulfur (98 %).I have to find a fluid one.
It is good for spreading per hand, and I suppose it is good for killing ants and vermin, but just to be applied on the soil not the plants, suppose it is too strong.
I will learn more and more about nutritions, but at this stage I think my mix will develop and is not that bad.
Richard
05-12-2012, 08:35 PM
This might be of some help:
Guide to Micronutrients (http://plantsthatproduce.com/guides/Micronutrients.htm)
bananafarmer
06-07-2012, 02:33 PM
Mixing my own Fert is my newest idea.
After reading the forum, realizing that the best ratio of giving fert ist 4-1-6 NPK is I decided to create my own fert.
Another reason is, this way its cheaper than buying ready-fert, that has also not the perfect NPK-ratio for bananas.
The Fert I am feeding the bananas is 10-2,5-15, for creating this I use Ormin-k a organic-potas fert, with 30% K2O it has a ph of 5-7,
My second ingredient ist Urea (here its called Üre) has a N of 46 %.
My third ingredient is 18-46, it has 18%N and 46% 'Fosfor`.
So When I use two bags of Ormin-K I have 15 kg net K, when I use 5,4 kg 18-46 I have about 2,5 kg P,
Whats left is the N I need 10 kg, with the 18-46 I have already 972 gr, to complete the amount I have to add 9kg and 28gr,
I went out of Urea and bought amonyum sulfat today, in my next mix I will replace urea with amonyum sulfat,
amonyum sulfat has a content of 21% N, so I have to almost double the amount.
Richard, I heard amonyum sulfat has an acidic character drops the ph-value.
Do you recommend using amonyum sulfat?
Richard
06-08-2012, 02:09 AM
I went out of Urea and bought amonyum sulfat today, in my next mix I will replace urea with amonyum sulfat,
amonyum sulfat has a content of 21% N, so I have to almost double the amount.
Richard, I heard amonyum sulfat has an acidic character drops the ph-value.
Do you recommend using amonyum sulfat?
It depends on what else is being used (and in what quantities) to provide P, K, Mg, Ca, Fe, Cu, Mn, Zn, B.
Worm_Farmer
06-08-2012, 05:38 AM
Have you considered Rock Dust for you minor and macro's? IDK if Azomite is available over there but you should be able to find something similar. Also I see Humic acid is mention but have you tried to use mycorrhizae as well? This will def help your plants and soil.
Richard
06-08-2012, 02:20 PM
Rock dust is not a viable source of micronutrients, but it is a very lucrative product for rock quarries that would otherwise have to pay to dispose of crusher dust.
Mycorrhizae are not beneficial to all plants; for example Brassicas. Further, some families of plants require special strains which are not commonly available; for example Rhododendrons, including Blueberries.
Azomite contains exceedingly high values of Aluminum Oxide, Silicon DiOxide, and Florine (Azomite Certificate Of Analysis (http://www.azomite.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=66&Itemid=11)). It is disingenuous for a knowledgeable farmer to apply this product to food crops.
bananafarmer
06-09-2012, 01:03 PM
It depends on what else is being used (and in what quantities) to provide P, K, Mg, Ca, Fe, Cu, Mn, Zn, B.
I would like to use it with 18-46 and K20 (potasyum),the K2O contains about 25%Sulfur.
It would be a N-P-K Formula, would be 10-2,5-15.
The other micro-nutrients I give once a week according to your recommendations.
Greetings.
bananafarmer
06-09-2012, 01:05 PM
Have you considered Rock Dust for you minor and macro's? IDK if Azomite is available over there but you should be able to find something similar. Also I see Humic acid is mention but have you tried to use mycorrhizae as well? This will def help your plants and soil.
Thanks,
today I used Mikoriza the first time, I used about 500 gr for 3 hectare, gave it through the sprinkler-system.
I am very curious about results, does it take a long time to take effect?
Any experiences with Mikoriza?
Greetings
Richard
06-09-2012, 01:20 PM
Go ahead and make a relatively small dry test mixture. Be sure to wear protective gloves and eye wear in case some reaction occurs. :)
After mixing well, add 1 level teaspoon to 1 gallon of clean water; or about 15.6 cc to 4 liters. Be careful of fumes. Mix, let sit for several hours, and mix again. Check the pH.
The desired pH range is 6 to 6.5. If it is between 5 and 6, then adding small amounts of Calcium Carbonate will raise the pH without significantly altering the nutrient properties.
If the pH is below 5 or above 7 (doubtful) then you'll need to rethink your mixture.
Mycorrhizae (Mikoriza) are fungal spores. They must come in contact with roots within a few hours of mix with water or soils. Application above ground by water or cultivator is not effective. Application to bare roots is the best method.
bananafarmer
06-09-2012, 01:32 PM
Go ahead and make a relatively small dry test mixture. Be sure to wear protective gloves and eye wear in case some reaction occurs. :)
After mixing well, add 1 level teaspoon to 1 gallon of clean water; or about 15.6 cc to 4 liters. Be careful of fumes. Mix, let sit for several hours, and mix again. Check the pH.
The desired pH range is 6 to 6.5. If it is between 5 and 6, then adding small amounts of Calcium Carbonate will raise the pH without significantly altering the nutrient properties.
If the pH is below 5 or above 7 (doubtful) then you'll need to rethink your mixture.
Mycorrhizae (Mikoriza) are fungal spores. They must come in contact with roots within a few hours of mix with water or soils. Application above ground by water or cultivator is not effective. Application to bare roots is the best method.
Thank you Richard, I will use your method and check the ph-level,
about the Mikoriza-app, I am using mini-sprinklers that cover all the ground, there are many of them.
The roots are very close to the surface, I watered a lot and I suppose the application directly got to the roots. None of the watering-water gets lost.
Greetings
Richard
06-09-2012, 03:49 PM
Thank you Richard, I will use your method and check the ph-level,
about the Mikoriza-app, I am using mini-sprinklers that cover all the ground, there are many of them.
The roots are very close to the surface, I watered a lot and I suppose the application directly got to the roots. None of the watering-water gets lost.
Greetings
That method does not work, regardless of what the advertisers will claim. The manufacturer of the powdered Mycorrhizae product I sell has run field tests and advises customers that application by soil drench is a waste of product. Mycorrhizae is not a fertilizer. It is a symbiotic organism that has to come in direct contact with the roots of host plants in order to survive.
bananafarmer
06-09-2012, 04:09 PM
That method does not work, regardless of what the advertisers will claim. The manufacturer of the powdered Mycorrhizae product I sell has run field tests and advises customers that application by soil drench is a waste of product. Mycorrhizae is not a fertilizer. It is a symbiotic organism that has to come in direct contact with the roots of host plants in order to survive.
So the best method would be to put the plant into a bucket with mikoriza and then plant it into the soil?
I just can hope these tests are not valid for me, otherwise I wasted 500 g of Mikoriza, my hope is that I have many roots on the surface, just 1 cm under soil.
Yes you are right, the manufacturer of the powdered product says it is usable via sprinkler-system, as you said when it is not working they are lying.
So the Mikoriza dies before it gets to the roots, on the soil? Can it not get through it?
Another question would be , how long can Mikoriza live on a root, what happens after one year when there is new plant born from the old one, is Mikoriza spreading?
Richard
06-09-2012, 11:10 PM
What is sold are spores. To germinate they need to be in contact with the root of a compatible plant type and in favorable soil conditions. Once they propagate, they will grow a colony.
I apply the powder to bare roots prior to planting. You only need a sprinkle -- not a coating. For example when I was potting up bareroot fruit trees this winter, I used 1 tablespoon (15 mL) of powder to cover 10 root balls at a time. I treated 150 root balls with about 1/2 lb (225 grams).
*dim*
06-10-2012, 10:22 AM
if you want to fertilize proper, and grow organically, try growing in the High Brix method (lots of info on google)
this is what I do ...
when planting out, use a decent compost ... visit your nearest hydroponic store, or buy online ... I use plagron bat mix ...
quote from the internet:
If you are looking for a top quality soil to cultivate your plants with, look no further. Plagron Bat Mix is the finest highly fertilised soil that contains a generous amount of Bat Guano.
Plagron Bat Mix is a blend of the finest, carefully selected types of peat that contains various types of fibre and perlite which results in a light and airy mix. The abundant presence of unique Plagron worm compost ensures vigorous plant growth and increased water retention.
Plagron Bat Mix contains slow release nutrients that are released as and when the plant needs them and the main nutrient in Bat Mix is Bat Guano, which is naturally rich in phosphorus and potassium, making it the perfect formula for plants that bear flowers or fruits.
add a handful of volcanic rock dust (which supplies over 70 micronutrients), a bit extra worm humis (the best compost that you can ever use) , and I use rootgrow on the roots (Mycorrhizal Fungi)
after 2 weeks, start fertilizing .... I use advanced nutrients iguana juice grow, aswell as advanced biobizz fish mix ...
I use these as a soil drench and as a foliar feed ... I dont mix the 2, but apply one time with one, and the next watering with the other .... they dilute at 4ml per litre of water, so 1 litre of product makes 200 litres of organic fertilizer
The iguana juice grow has an NPK of 3-1-3 and the biobizz fish mix has an NPK of 6-3-4
I apply bat guano fertilizer (a tablespoon sprinkled around the base once in a while) ... I buy a 5kg bucket for under £20, and the one that I buy has an npk of 3-15-4 ... there are other types of bat guano with different NPK's
I brew my own actively aerated compost tea ... I use a 5 gallon bucket, rainwater, a strong aquarium airpump and an aquarium heater
I add worm humis, forest topsoil, home made compost, volcanic rock dust, seaweed extract and bat guano .... I then apply this with a watering can to all my plants and shrubs ...
I grow normal garden plants that grow twice in size to the same ones which are fertilized with synthetic fertilizers such as miracle grow etc
this year is the 1st time that I have planted musa basjoo, but it will be interesting to see the outcome with my fertilizing methods
watch this video:
The Secret is in the Soil - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXGqJbFZzCo)
bananafarmer
06-10-2012, 11:10 AM
Are you the guy in the video?
*dim*
06-10-2012, 11:56 AM
Are you the guy in the video?
LOL .... no, but I can be anything or anyone you want me to ....
take my advice and research further ... I'm not selling anything ... am just giving good advice
*dim*
06-10-2012, 12:17 PM
here's a quick summary of high brix methods as taken off the internet:
There are four bases to achieving high brix soil:
1.)Foundational minerals. These are your rock powders, Limestone, Soft Rock Phosphate, Gypsum. Other things could conceivably be used as well, but those are cheap, reliable and available. The single most important mineral for High Brix is Calcium, followed by Phosphorus.
2.)Soil Energy. ERGS (Energy Released per Gram per Second). No energy in the soil, no growth of the plant. Fertilizers, organic material, salts....all increase ERGS.
3.)Soil Biology. These are the microbes, nematodes and fungi that inhabit the root zone and break down all the organic material and present it to the plant. We accomplish proper soil biology with humus and we boost it with microbial teas and root inoculates.
4.)Trace Elements. The "micro's." Magnesium, zinc, boron, iron, manganese, copper, molybdenum, sulfur, etc.
We don't put these things in the soil in the typical NPK ratio's that you see on plant food bottles. These things go into the soil in order to make the soil biology happy. For example, most of the phosphorus isn't available to the plant at all. Same with the calcium. But the microbes love it.
The plants, courtesy of the soil life, get anything they want, as much as they want. They never burn, they never lack.
That's the soil.
You supercharge the Brix in the plant tissue via Foliar Feeding. Phosphorus is the "shipping specialist" in the plant. Most things the plant needs come piggy backed as a phosphate, so increasing the phosphorus and calcium levels in the plant increases the sugar content in the leaves, which the plant sends down to the roots in the form of "root exudates." These root exudates feed and signal microbes and fungi that live on the roots, and they take the sugar and use it to form humic/fulvic acids so they can digest minerals and organic matter and feed the plant.
The foliar sprays act like a supercharger, while the soil acts like a gas tank. The microbes are the engine.....and the plants are the passengers who enjoy the ride.
That's High Brix.
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very important ... understand that, and you are on the road to success
Richard
06-10-2012, 06:20 PM
if you want to fertilize proper, and grow organically, try growing in the High Brix method (lots of info on google)
I'm outta here.
bananafarmer
06-10-2012, 06:41 PM
I'm outta here.
I would be happy if you stay,
this thread is stil about fertilizer that is not organics, and your opinion is really leading the way here, you have a lot of experience in fertilizers and plants.
I learned a lot from you about fert. and its really great to have someone that can give good advise.
*dim*
06-11-2012, 12:52 AM
I'm outta here.
it's hard to teach old dogs new tricks
*dim*
06-11-2012, 05:20 AM
Rock dust is not a viable source of micronutrients, but it is a very lucrative product for rock quarries that would otherwise have to pay to dispose of crusher dust. .
rockdust contains over 70 different minerals and trace elements...:
SEER Rockdust (http://www.selfsufficientish.com/seers.htm)
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Mycorrhizae are not beneficial to all plants; for example Brassicas. Further, some families of plants require special strains which are not commonly available; for example Rhododendrons, including Blueberries. .
FAQs (http://rootgrow.co.uk/index.php/faqs.html)
snip:
There are a number of other plant groups that we do not recommend using rootgrow on. If you do use rootgrow on these plants it will not harm then in any way, the fungi just will not colonise and break down in the soil. These plants are
Edible Brassica’s (Cabbage, Cauliflower, Broccoli, Turnip, Radishes and Brussel Sprouts) all have a natural anti-fungal compound present in their roots. This is a disease resistance mechanism that unfortunately prevents mycorrhizal fungi colonisation. It also offers no protection against the Brasica’s worst disease Club Root which is no longer considered part of the fungal kingdom, it is now considered a slime mould (Plasmodiophorids)
Another group of plants which we do not recommend you use rootgrow on is fast growing salad crops such as ‘cut and come again’ lettuce and salad leaves and spinach. Due to rootgrow taking 2-4 weeks to colonise plants these salad leave can germinate and be harvested in 4 weeks so the plant does not really have time to derive any benefit from the treatment.
for Rhododendrons use Ericoid mycorrhizal fungi ...
here is a list of some products giving the counts:
http://www.treebuzz.com/forum/images/upload/114726-RhizofuelComparison.pdf
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There are several powdered forms of mycorrhizal fungi aswell as liquid forms ... old teachings said that the powdered form only workes if it was used at the time of planting and dusted on the roots of the plant
then, there was the method of 'injecting' it into the soil of established plants/trees so as to try and get it to make contact with the roots
another method is where you plant a host plant at the base of the target plant, and use rootgrow etc with that ... eventually, the fungi will target the roots of the target plant
however, there are newer liquid products on the market such as advanced nutrients voodoo juice:
FAQ on Voodoo Juice (http://www.advancednutrients.com/hydroponics/products/voodoo_juice/voodoo_juice_faq_nutrient_facts.php#nutrientGA)
advanced nutrients Piranha:
Piranha Beneficial Fungi | Piranha Beneficial Fungi Nutrint |Hydroponic Nutrient Piranha Beneficial Fungi (http://www.advancednutrients.com/hydroponics/products/piranha/piranha_faq_nutrient_facts.php#nutrientGA)
advanced nutrients Tarantula
Tarantula Beneficial Bacteria | Tarantula hydroponics Nutrients | Tarantula by Advanced Nutrients | Tarantula Nutrients (http://www.advancednutrients.com/hydroponics/products/tarantula/tarantula_faq_nutrient_facts.php#nutrientGA)
these products are diluted with water (preferably unchlorinated water) and used as a soil drench ... the fungi/bacteria seep into the soil and make contact with the roots
I emailed rootgrow to ask them if their product can be used in actively aerated compost tea ... I received a reply saying yes, however, it is added to the compost tea at the end of the brewing and just prior to applying it to the plants
I have tested this method on 2 alocasia Mayan Mask plants recently which were planted in 3 litre airpots ... I had amazing results
something else which I have learned, is that one should not use rootgrow (mycorrhizal fungi ) in combination with bone meal
another product which is exceptional, and which is said by many to be the very best is Roots Excelurator:
Products - Stimulators - Roots Excelurator : Premium Quality Dutch Plant Nutrients & Stimulants - House & Garden (http://www.house-garden.com.au/products_stimulators_roots_excelurator.php)
I have not tried this (yet), but some people claim that the roots even grow out of the top of the pots when this is used
here is a link to different mycorrhizal fungi that were tested on musa (also using volcanic rock dust in the growing medium)
http://www.musalit.org/pdf/IN120019_en.pdf
Richard
06-23-2012, 02:17 AM
Some folks might find this document of interest:
Guide To Fertilizer Dosages (http://www.plantsthatproduce.com/guides/Guide_Fertilizer_Dosages.html)
Snookie
06-24-2012, 10:56 AM
Whewwwwww Doggie
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I read all of the post about fertilizer and now I have a hell of a headache lol
Looks like I'll stick with rabbit poop to fertilize with till I get a feel for growing nana's:nanadrink:
Kostas
06-24-2012, 11:31 AM
I have watered in a granular Mycorrhizae product on many of my plants without digging holes or doing anything special and i did see extensive colonization in some areas of the garden and crazy growth compared to the uncolonized area just next to the colonized one. So i think that your sprinkler application may have worked bananafarmer,especially as some of the banana roots are very shallow and the spores can be carried there by water. Bananas do have symbiotic relations with mycorrhizae so there does is a benefit from using them. A more efficient way for applying the mycorrhizae in your mature plantation would be to dig a little hole down to the corm of the new pup you are going to leave grow and bear fruit,add a little mycorrhizae there touching the corm and cover the hole again. The new roots that will grow from the corm of that pup,will be colonized and the colonization of the whole mat will follow in the next months.
The Mycorrhizae spores can live a long time in the soil so they can even wait till a root reaches them or till they get washed lower in the soil and find a root. When they find a root,they germinate and begin colonizing the whole root system of the plant. As long as they are happy and no fungicides are used(unfortunately chemical fertilizers also negatively affect them),they never need to be reapplied and bananas grow faster,bigger and remain healthier with them.
As for humic acid,it helps a lot in chelating the minerals found in the soil and in the fertilizers you add and thus not let them get washed away and retain them in a form that is usable to the plants. The use of humic acid certainly mediates somewhat the negative effects in soil life of using chemical fertilizers and improves the soil :)
Richard
06-24-2012, 06:22 PM
At equal doses, chemical and organic fertilizers kill Mycorrhizae equally well.
Richard
06-25-2012, 09:49 PM
rockdust contains over 70 different minerals and trace elements...
That's very true, although they are in the covalent (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Covalent_bond) form. Just putting them in the soil will not get them into the ionic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ionic_bond) form that plants require, nor will they break down in a time frame that is relevant to you or the plant. You'll need to either dissolve them in a high-molar acid or utilize plasma chemistry -- neither of which are worth the expense.
On the other hand, having small gravels and gravel dust in a soil mix can be a good thing in terms of physical and catalytic properties. Most of my soil mixes are anywhere from 1/8 to 1/5 parts "3/32 minus" gravel and dust from the local quarry. The amount in each mix depends on the plant type.
For micronutrients, I either use a complete fertilizer or in the case of some plants, a water-soluble mix chelated in wood sugars.
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