View Full Version : Ice Cream: The real deal?
caliboy1994
09-16-2011, 07:53 PM
So venturabananas told me that my plant that I bought from a local nursery might not be a real Ice Cream. I want to get a second opinion, and if it's not an Ice Cream, then what is it?
Pictures:
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=45740&size=1
Here's a pic of the entire plant. I planted it about two months ago.
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=45741&size=1
Here's a close-up of one of the petioles. It has a nice pink edge to it. The petiole is open, not closed like how the real Ice Cream is supposed to be.
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=45742&size=1
Here are some more of the petioles at the top of the main p-stem.
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=45743&size=1
Here's the base of the main p-stem.
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=45746&size=1
Here's a close up of the leaf midrib. All of the leaves have pink on the midrib.
An identification would be appreciated. I hope it's a good variety if it's really not an Ice Cream. Thanks! :D
sunfish
09-16-2011, 07:59 PM
http://www.bananas.org/f12/not-ice-cream-13977.html#post166419
Yours looks different than my Not Ice Cream,more like a plantain type,only a guess
caliboy1994
09-16-2011, 08:07 PM
Ok then, that's 3 people who said it isn't an Ice Cream. I'm going to leave it in the ground and see how it does and try and get a hold of the REAL Ice Cream next season.
sunfish
09-16-2011, 08:18 PM
Ok then, that's 3 people who said it isn't an Ice Cream. I'm going to leave it in the ground and see how it does and try and get a hold of the REAL Ice Cream next season.
I think most,not all,the Ice Cream plants in CA. are not the real deal.Looking at the wiki I see two different plants.The one with the all green p-stem and leaves is the real Ice Cream'
Musa Blue Java (Ice Cream) - Bananas Wiki (http://www.bananas.org/wiki/Musa_Blue_Java_%28Ice_Cream%29)
caliboy1994
09-16-2011, 08:20 PM
Yeah, I saw that picture too. The petioles are also closed in that pic too. In that case I need to get my hands on a real one, but I think I should wait until spring.
caliboy1994
09-16-2011, 09:15 PM
Is it possible that it's an HD Ice Cream?
sunfish
09-16-2011, 09:22 PM
Is it possible that it's an HD Ice Cream?
HD is just the name I used for the plant I got at Home Depot that was labeled Ice Cream but is a Namwah type ,
caliboy1994
09-16-2011, 09:27 PM
Does this look anything like a Namwah to you? From what I heard Namwah still makes great fruit.
sunfish
09-16-2011, 09:28 PM
Does this look anything like a Namwah to you? From what I heard Namwah still makes great fruit.
Any thing I say is just a guess
http://www.bananas.org/f12/not-ice-cream-13977-2.html#post169887
shot3837
09-16-2011, 09:45 PM
I think that I have that one too. I bought mine from Wellspring Gardens. After reading some posts on here I am pretty sure that it is not an Ice Cream. I contacted the company and told them that I thought that maybe there was a mix up and I got the wrong plant. They assured me that what they had given me was an Ice Cream. I am going to let it fruit but am pissed off that it is not what I thought I was buying.
caliboy1994
09-16-2011, 09:57 PM
I know for a fact that Quail Botanical Gardens has the real one. Does anyone else have an idea what it might be? I'm hoping for a Namwah.
caliboy1994
09-16-2011, 10:05 PM
Look what I just found:
http://pics.davesgarden.com/pics/2007/08/09/HedychiumGuy/02eb29.jpg
This is a pic of a Dwarf Namwah leaf. To me it looks just like the pic of my leaf that I took.
kcj1219
09-18-2011, 10:43 AM
I'm pretty sure that your plant is not a Dwarf Namwah. Dwarf Namwah (ABB - AABB) have closed petioles and does not have a distinct red border on the outer channel of the petiole. You do have a pretty plant though. Like Tony said maybe a plantain or a FHIA type. I seem to have a not ice cream/ice cream and I live in coastal SC.
sunfish
09-18-2011, 11:01 AM
Dwarf Namwah
<a href=http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=45761&ppuser=2868><img src=http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=45761&size=1 border=0></a>
caliboy1994
09-18-2011, 12:23 PM
Yeah, I can see that the petioles are closed on the Dwarf Namwah. I guess that's not it then. It'll be interesting to find out what I have though. The attractive coloration definitely looks good in my yard.
venturabananas
09-18-2011, 05:56 PM
I'd defer to Gabe or other people who study bananas for a living, but at this point, the guesses from Ken and Tony are probably as good as you are going to be able to do. You can eliminate a whole lot of possibilities, like all the ABB cultivars, but that still leaves literally hundreds of possibilities. You can also eliminate the Mysore subgroup (and probably many others too, that I don't know enough to eliminate), but there's still so many possibilities. Gabe's usual response is that you probably won't have a shot at a positive ID until it flowers and maybe not even then. It is a pretty plant. Grow it and see what you get! Like Pitangadiego, Sunfish, and others say, "I don't really care what it is provided it grows well and makes good fruit." Call it Fred until you know better.
caliboy1994
09-18-2011, 06:08 PM
Ok, I guess I'll just have to wait and see :D
kcj1219
09-18-2011, 06:33 PM
Ok, I guess I'll just have to wait and see :D
Musa Gump's mamma once said, "Banana plants are like a box of chocolates. You never know what you're going to get...lol
caliboy1994
09-18-2011, 07:40 PM
Hah I guess so! :P
caliboy1994
11-21-2011, 04:22 PM
I think I found the best candidate yet as to what my plant might be, and I'm actually happy with it. I think it might be Dwarf Brazilian. I found these photos on We Be Bananas of Dwarf Brazilian, and they look a lot like my plant.
http://webebananas.com/bpix/BP910-04.jpg
This especially looks like my second plant, the one that isn't doing so well but is recovering.
http://webebananas.com/bpix/BP910-03.jpg
The petioles on this plant look a lot like mine. They are open, waxy, and have red edges.
Tell me what you think! Appreciated!
Richard
11-21-2011, 05:02 PM
In the Misi Luki (http://www.bananas.org/f12/misi-luki-11834.html) thread, Gabe (http://www.bananas.org/member-gabe15.html) has been instructing us that the Agristarts Dwarf Namwah and Misi Luki are forms of Pisang Awak.
This 'Misi Luki' still appears to be a type of Pisang Awak (Namwah). I have recently seen some full grown field plants from Agri-Starts of it and so can definitely confirm. There seems to be have been some kind of mix-up in the names some time ago (as is always common with plants) as the original 'Misi Luki' of Samoa is a Mysore, not a Pisang Awak.
venturabananas
11-21-2011, 06:15 PM
Could be Dwarf Brazilian. Also, Rajapuri is a good possibility, given that I can't distinguish my D Braz from my Rajapuri by their appearance. Both are readily available from nurseries in So Cal. My FHIA 18 and FHIA 2 also look very similar, though their leaves are not as erect as D Braz or Rajapuri. Or it could be 800 other ones! Not really, but I'm sure there are several others that look very similar. You won't know until it makes an inflorescence, but D Braz or Rajapuri is a good guess at this point.
caliboy1994
11-21-2011, 06:22 PM
I can't wait! :woohoonaner:
caliboy1994
05-15-2012, 12:04 PM
And the mystery deepens...The pups on one of my plants are beginning to show wine splotches.
venturabananas
05-15-2012, 01:30 PM
And the mystery deepens...The pups on one of my plants are beginning to show wine splotches.
Post some pictures. If the wine splotches are dark, it's probably an AAA cultivar or AAAB. If they are light, it's probably an AAB, like Dwarf Brazilian or Rajapuri.
caliboy1994
05-15-2012, 09:01 PM
They're not much, but they're still wine splotches.
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=48859&size=1
palmtree
05-15-2012, 11:04 PM
It definitely seems like Dwarf Brazilian and Raja Puri are possible ID's! They are both great bananas and so are Ice cream bananas. Whatever it is, it looks great and at least it's not a cavendish!
caliboy1994
05-15-2012, 11:12 PM
The odd thing is is that these two pups appeared to start out as sword pups. They put out one or two really thin leaves before putting out wider leaves. Anyways, I'll keep you guys updated with pictures and the like.
Iunepeace
05-16-2012, 10:29 AM
The same thing happened to my Maybe Dwarf Orinoco, it put out a pup that had sword leaves at first and then put out wider leaves. Maybe because the mat isn't too established yet?
caliboy1994
05-16-2012, 11:02 AM
That's probably the case. The p-stem of the mother plant is only about three and a half feet tall.
Iunepeace
05-16-2012, 11:04 AM
It's weird though; I also have a Super Dwarf Cavendish that's barely a foot tall, if that, and it has a pup that has about ten leaves now, all sword leaves. Bananas are mysterious lol
caliboy1994
05-16-2012, 12:35 PM
Yes they are. :D
Now I have a banana plant that is supposed to be a real Ice Cream, but based on the coloration I think it's a Pisang Awak of some sort. Still a great plant though, and now at least I know what to expect when it decides to throw a bud :ha: I will eventually get my hands on the real one though.
Iunepeace
05-16-2012, 01:31 PM
I feel you on that note. The only variety of all my bananas that I have that I'm reasonably sure about are the Super Dwarf Cavendishes, and even those I'm beginning to suspect were just suckers of stunted Dwarf Cavendish lol. Yep it does help to know what sort of fruit to expect; I have one myself that I'm thinking and hoping is a Mysore since they have great large amounts of tasty fruit :D
One of my friends has a fruiting banana with blueish fruits, so I'm thinking that one might be an Ice Cream. I think she call those ones Cuban bananas :)
caliboy1994
05-16-2012, 03:08 PM
Or it could be Pisang Awak, which can have bluish fruits (but not as blue as Ice Cream). Anyways, one way to tell if your plant is Mysore (or at least in the Mysore subgroup) is to look at the underside of newly emerged leaves. They should be a nice reddish color, like this:
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=4974&size=1&filefix=.jpg
hybridpower
05-16-2012, 06:07 PM
None of my raja have ever had spots, or been anything other then green. Of the plants I have, I've only seen wine spots on the DC and Goldfinger pups. Be interesting to see what the plant ends up looking like.
caliboy1994
05-16-2012, 10:00 PM
I believe there are lots of different varieties that can have wine spots. As well as Cavendish and GF, a lot of varieties in the AAA group have prominent wine spots, as well as plantains. Some AAB bananas (like my Mysore) can have wine spots too. Generally I think the rule is the more A genes a plant has, the more wine spots.
caliboy1994
09-15-2012, 02:42 AM
Updated pics:
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/77a04ecf.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/443adcab.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/b305362b.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/8f495756.jpg
At this point, my best guess is DB or Rajapuri.
those last pics show for anyone else?
first pic on this page sure looks like my DB
Iunepeace
09-15-2012, 07:21 AM
Looks AWESOME! :D
Updated pics:
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/77a04ecf.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/443adcab.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/b305362b.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/8f495756.jpg
At this point, my best guess is DB or Rajapuri.
caliboy1994
09-15-2012, 02:23 PM
Another pic.
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/04d45b75.jpg
caliboy1994
09-15-2012, 02:26 PM
Here are some pics of my other plant that is supposed to be Ice Cream. It has gotten huge, and is clearly not a dwarf of some sort like my other plant. I'm thinking it's a Namwah.
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/a16d6985.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/2e8f4c3d.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/3eb962b2.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/cccc987a.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/b4cccd1f.jpg
venturabananas
09-15-2012, 07:31 PM
Andreas, yes, I agree, that one definitely looks like Namwah (Pisang Awak). You won't know for sure until it blooms, but I'd be willing to bet on it. The other, hard to say. Not Pisang Awak or true Ice Cream. I still think Dwarf Brazilian is the most likely possibility.
Iunepeace
09-16-2012, 05:11 PM
Oh wow; magnificent! Keep 'em coming :)
caliboy1994
09-16-2012, 09:30 PM
This plant is growing like crazy. It has literally tripled in height since I got it and the p-stem has doubled. The largest pup on it is now larger than the original plant when I got it. Here are some comparison pics:
March 1, 2012
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=48026
September 14, 2012
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/8e1bf24a.jpg
I'll be heading back to Granada Hills in October at the latest, and I'll make sure to get more pics. We still have a full month and a half of growing season to go, and my plants are showing no signs of stopping.
bananadan25
09-16-2012, 10:20 PM
http://i1243.photobucket.com/albums/gg545/dvaldez1286/9d7a79a2.jpg Does this look like it may be a true ice cream banana? I got it from lowe's who got it from laverne growers in so cal...
caliboy1994
09-16-2012, 10:26 PM
It's hard to tell, but based on the fact that you got it from Lowe's it's probably a Namwah. Still a great plant with great fruit and cold hardiness to boot.
bananadan25
09-17-2012, 12:09 AM
I forgot to mention the pictured plant is a pup of the mother plant...It's grown so fast.. planted it last summer at 1.5 feet and it's now between 14-16 feet tall... I will be a little let down if it's namwah... but I guess like you said, it's still a good cultivar.. lol
caliboy1994
10-21-2012, 10:05 PM
It's the tail end of the growing season down in SoCal, so here are all of my Not Ice Creams.
Mystery plants as of yesterday:
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/2012-10-20103913_zpse4b2d539.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/2012-10-20103932_zpsda771bfe.jpg
With wine splotches on the pups:
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/2012-10-20103938_zps6181c03d.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/2012-10-20103944_zpsc3f8061e.jpg
What is probably Namwah as of yesterday:
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/2012-10-20140852_zpsc7fe3caa.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/2012-10-20103731_zps49d50959.jpg
We had 50+ mph winds not too long ago, and the leaves got shredded pretty good on what might be Namwah. Unknown has about 5 feet of p-stem, Namwah has about 6 and a half.
LilRaverBoi
10-21-2012, 11:10 PM
Why has dwarf Namwah been ruled out at this point? Doesn't seem tall enough to say it isn't a dwarf variety. Looks a lot like the 'ice cream' I had in the past. Same pink on the pseudostem, midrib, leaf edges, but mine never had any wine spots. Pretty sure mine wasn't an actual ice cream either, but never had any other identification (and this was before the 'not ice cream' fiasco).
caliboy1994
10-21-2012, 11:12 PM
These are two separate varieties that were both labeled Ice Cream. One is a dwarf for sure, and the other one doesn't seem to be a dwarf. One has wine splotches, the other doesn't.
venturabananas
10-21-2012, 11:19 PM
Can't have wine splotches and be Dwarf Namwah. Petioles on the other look a bit too long and the leaves too narrow for Dwarf Namwah.
caliboy1994
11-17-2012, 08:35 PM
Surprise surprise! My mystery plant is throwing an untimely bud (my first flower ever!)! It has 5 feet of p-stem, and so far the bud has measured out at 21 inches. We're due to have a little spell of warm weather in a few days, so that should help the flower come out a bit more. Here are some pics so far.
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/20121117_151934_zps9ed24af8.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/20121117_151918_zps4fad5f50.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/20121117_151918_zps4fad5f50.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/20121117_152918_zps67d06c14.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/20121117_153055_zps3a34800b.jpg
pushak513
11-17-2012, 10:11 PM
I think Im going to have to go with some dwarf types if I ever want fruit flowering at 5 ft of p stem is nice. hope it works out and you get some ediable fruit
caliboy1994
11-21-2012, 07:05 PM
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/20121121_153444_zps4ad28aa7.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/20121121_153453_zpsbea08734.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/20121121_153809_zps40578297.jpg
:woohoonaner:
JodoGarden
11-21-2012, 07:18 PM
Awesome pics! Really healthy looking plant.. can't wait to see what it turns out to be!
caliboy1994
11-27-2012, 04:07 PM
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/IMG_4549_zps4dec94d7.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/IMG_709d_zps1aabd673.jpg
I vote Rajapuri.
venturabananas
11-27-2012, 04:57 PM
I vote Rajapuri.
Yep.
caliboy1994
11-27-2012, 05:30 PM
The mystery is finally solved! And better yet, I have the real thing now. I got it from Jon on Saturday. It's all potted up, and I plan on growing it up here in Santa Clara. I should have pups available eventually.
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t464/musamaniac/Musa/IMG_9110_zpsb6769e52.jpg
kaczercat
12-26-2012, 12:09 AM
remembering I took a picture a couple years back when I was in Cuba, I do believe this is the real ice cream?
<a href="http://s665.beta.photobucket.com/user/Kaczerm/media/Cuba2011046_zps637ca9c9.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i665.photobucket.com/albums/vv17/Kaczerm/Cuba2011046_zps637ca9c9.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"/></a>
kaczercat
12-26-2012, 12:10 AM
and congrats Andreas on the bloom!!
caliboy1994
12-26-2012, 02:00 AM
Thank you! That one looks like it might be given the spacing and the bunch and the length of the pedicels.
robguz24
12-26-2012, 03:55 AM
remembering I took a picture a couple years back when I was in Cuba, I do believe this is the real ice cream?
<a href="http://s665.beta.photobucket.com/user/Kaczerm/media/Cuba2011046_zps637ca9c9.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i665.photobucket.com/albums/vv17/Kaczerm/Cuba2011046_zps637ca9c9.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"/></a>
I don't think it is. The fruit don't seem the right shape and they aren't blue enough.
blownz281
12-26-2012, 05:54 PM
Cb 1994 looks just like my ice cream.
vBulletin® v3.6.8, Copyright ©2000-2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.