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View Full Version : Oil Spill an Oil Volcano that can't be contained?


Gardener972
06-24-2010, 10:46 PM
This was sent to me recently. I can't find anything on the internet that says it's false. It's very scary. A bit long but I think it's an interesting read. What do you all think?

Oil Volcano Pressure Too
Strong For Containment
Dr. James P. Wickstrom
6-9-10

It has been estimated by experts that the pressure which blows the oil into the Gulf waters is estimated to be between 20,000 and 70,000 PSI (pounds per square inch). Impossible to control.
What US Scientists Are Forbidden To Tell The Public About The Gulf
What you are about to read, is what the scientists in the United States are not allowed to tell you in great fear of the administration.
They are under the threat of severe repercussions to the max. Scientists confirming these findings cannot be named due to the above, but what they believe, they want to be known by all.
Take a U. S. map, lay it flat and measure inland just the minimum 50 miles of total destruction all around the Gulf of Mexico as to what you will read below.
The carnage to the United States is so staggering, it will take your breathe away.
Should what the scientists who are trying to warn everyone about be even close to being true... all of Florida will be completely destroyed as will everyone and everything on it.
You decide!! Everyone has the right to read what I have just written in this article, as well as to what is written below by the scientists who the administration and BP are trying to shut up.
Please share with as many as you can.
--Dr. James P. Wickstrom
SUMMARY OF WHAT IS HAPPENING
The estimated super high pressure release of oil from under the earth's crust is between 80,000 to 100,000 barrels per day.
The flow of oil and toxic gases is bringing up with it... rocks and sand which causes the flow to create a sandblasting effect on the remaining well head device currently somewhat restricting the flow, as well as the drilled hole itself.
As the well head becomes worn it enlarges the passageway allowing an ever-increasing flow. Even if some device could be placed onto the existing wellhead, it would not be able to shut off the flow, because what remains of the existing wellhead would not be able to contain the pressure.
The well head piping is originally about 2 inches thick. It is now likely to be less than 1 inch thick, and thinning by each passing moment. The oil has now reached the Gulf Stream and is entering the Oceanic current which is at least four times stronger than the current in the Gulf, which will carry it throughout the world within 18 months.
The oil along with the gasses, including benzene and many other toxins, is deleting the oxygen in the water. This is killing all life in the ocean. Along with the oil along the shores, there will be many dead fish, etc. that will have to be gathered and disposed of.
SUMMARY OF EXPECTATIONS
At some point the drilled hole in the earth will enlarge itself beneath the wellhead to weaken the area the wellhead rests upon. The intense pressure will then push the wellhead off the hole allowing a direct unrestricted flow of oil, etc.
The hole will continue to increase in size allowing more and more oil to rise into the Gulf. After several billion barrels of oil have been released, the pressure within the massive cavity five miles beneath the ocean floor will begin to normalize.
This will allow the water, under the intense pressure at 1 mile deep, to be forced into the hole and the cavity where the oil was. The temperature at that depth is near 400 degrees, possibly more.
The water will be vaporized and turned into steam, creating an enormous amount of force, lifting the Gulf floor. It is difficult to know how much water will go down to the core and therefore, its not possible to fully calculate the rise of the floor.
The tsunami wave this will create will be anywhere from 20 to 80 feet high, possibly more. Then the floor will fall into the now vacant chamber. This is how nature will seal the hole.
Depending on the height of the tsunami, the ocean debris, oil, and existing structures that will be washed away on shore and inland, will leave the area from 50 to 200 miles inland devoid of life. Even if the debris is cleaned up, the contaminants that will be in the ground and water supply will prohibit re-population of these areas for an unknown number of years.
(End of scientists information release.)
From Tom Buyea FL News Service

sunfish
06-24-2010, 10:54 PM
Oil Volcano Pressure Too Strong For Containment (http://www.rense.com/general91/oilor.htm)

YouTube - Lindsey Williams Talks with Alex Jones About Deadly Gases Leaking from BP Spill 1/9 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYhugmaAL3A)

sunfish
06-24-2010, 11:07 PM
YouTube - Lindsey Williams Talks with Alex Jones About Deadly Gases Leaking from BP Spill 8/9 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Woc2oPt0Byk)

Jack Daw
06-25-2010, 02:18 AM
Some pretty hard stuff.

jeffreyp
06-25-2010, 09:06 AM
sounds like a bunch of crap coming from a white supremacist. James Wickstrom - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Wickstrom)

CoryS
06-25-2010, 09:56 AM
sounds like a bunch of crap coming from a white supremacist. James Wickstrom - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Wickstrom)

If the wikipedia story is true, Dr. Wickstrom is a racist. But I don't see any connection between racism and environmental disasters. Are Lindsey Williams, the BP informants, and Alex Jones racists? If Wickstrom and the others stories prove to be right, it won't matter what they are. This thing is very scary and I think we will learn more about it by talking about "it" instead of religeon or racism... imo, racism/Wickstrom could be better focused on in a new thread. :)

jeffreyp
06-25-2010, 10:27 AM
smells alot like urban legend/hysteria..

CoryS
06-25-2010, 10:38 AM
smells alot like urban legend/hysteria..

I see a lot of hype in the stories and there's definitely plenty of hysteria. It's like trying to find facts in a TV commercial. But I'm just scared enough to try. I hope the disaster isn't as bad as they say but we won't know much very soon... I don't think.
For example, they said that oil is coming down with the rain. We are going to put a clean glass punch bowl out the next time it rains. I decided it should be up off the ground about 5 feet. That will make certain that nothing can splash into the bowl. Then we can check it and see if there's any oil or anything like that in it. What I can learn myself is still more important than anything I hear.

hammer
06-25-2010, 11:22 AM
If the wikipedia story is true, Dr. Wickstrom is a racist. But I don't see any connection between racism and environmental disasters. Are Lindsey Williams, the BP informants, and Alex Jones racists? If Wickstrom and the others stories prove to be right, it won't matter what they are. This thing is very scary and I think we will learn more about it by talking about "it" instead of religeon or racism... imo, racism/Wickstrom could be better focused on in a new thread. :) Why is averything racism. I think hes right about this bp has not told the truth about any thing.

1aday
06-25-2010, 09:37 PM
Usually any email that has comments like "scientists forbidden to tell you" and
"What you are about to read, is what the scientists in the United States are not allowed to tell you in great fear of the administration.
They are under the threat of severe repercussions to the max."

Are a HUGE sign that might as well say URBAN LEGEND (or, LIE).

Can you imagine being some scientist and having someone tell you "there will be severe repercussions TO THE MAX"????:ha::ha::ha::ha: What a silly comment!

the second sign that this is junk and a lie is the "please forward to as many people as you can".

The oil leak in the Gulf is a real environmental horror and an enormous tragedy, to be sure, but junk like this doesn't need to be passed around.

(Can you tell that I hate all these types of emails that get passed around forever??)

Abnshrek
06-25-2010, 10:14 PM
Why is everything racism. I think hes right about this bp has not told the truth about any thing.

Good Question.. He might be, but that's that guys' problem.. has nothing to do with the story. :^)

CoryS
06-25-2010, 11:01 PM
Usually any email that has comments like "scientists forbidden to tell you" and
"What you are about to read, is what the scientists in the United States are not allowed to tell you in great fear of the administration.
They are under the threat of severe repercussions to the max."

Are a HUGE sign that might as well say URBAN LEGEND (or, LIE).

Can you imagine being some scientist and having someone tell you "there will be severe repercussions TO THE MAX"????:ha::ha::ha::ha: What a silly comment!

the second sign that this is junk and a lie is the "please forward to as many people as you can".

The oil leak in the Gulf is a real environmental horror and an enormous tragedy, to be sure, but junk like this doesn't need to be passed around.

(Can you tell that I hate all these types of emails that get passed around forever??)

That's why I said "hype/hysteria". I've heard about the "pass around" emails and I'm real happy I don't get them in my email! I'll "spam" them if I ever do. I'm scared... I won't lie... but I think the only things we will really know are things that are happening that people can easily see themselves. I'm also a little suspicious of one link I read that used "extinguish all life on earth". :ha:
I also read a link that said that Corexit has been used for 30 years on oil spills. It sounds really nasty but I still haven't read about any major disasters from using it. But maybe I just haven't read enough yet. I don't know.

Good Question.. He might be, but that's that guys' problem.. has nothing to do with the story. :^)

True. I don't like many of my teachers but if I don't listen, I won't get any good grades. :ha: Maybe there's some truth to what he's saying or maybe not. But since most people are hyping about almost everything, I like to listen to everyone... then try to figure out what makes sense.:confused:
For now, I think I'll just do brains-off and listen to some hot tunes, lol. :D

Abnshrek
06-26-2010, 12:37 AM
Corexit.. maybe why bears don't get enough fish in Alaska and Fish & Game have to keep them out of the towns. Maybe limited fish could be a result of fish not being able to reproduce.? What will it all be in the gulf?

sbl
06-27-2010, 01:44 PM
I am not an engineer--I am a scientist and I know chemistry and physics, we can probably get the info to make an estimate of the pressure--at the end of the pipe--based on the flow estimates (2.5 million gallons a day) and the diameter of the pipe--21 inches I think--I will see what I can find.

The pressure in the formation can also be estimated from flow resistance factors and the distance.

I doubt the suggestion of temps of 400 degrees and the possibility of explosion if water were to penetrate the well--as long as there is any pressure, water cannot go upstream against the pressure.

I do have serious concerns about what it will do to the environment and ecology of the Gulf. There could be fisheries that will be permanently destroyed. There will be added carcinogens in our food for decades. I am seriously disappointed with EPA for allowing the use of corexit to hide the spill--that is it's only function here. It is the reason there are huge underwater plumes that we can never remove--that will get into our food chain--that will suck the oxygen out of large masses of water in the Gulf--shame on EPA.


EDIT: I found an online calculator for pressure and flow--I also heard the the actual pipe diameter is only 8 inches--the casing is 21 inches. Plugging in the flow of 100,000 gal/hr in a 8 inch pipe 10,000 ft long shows a pressure drop of just about 300 psi. I seriously doubt that formation pressures are in the range of 20,000 to 70,000 psi.

RobG7aChattTN
06-30-2010, 07:35 AM
Oil wells eventually run dry. There has never been an oil well found that just kept on gushing forever or else we'd have unlimited fuel forever. An oil well taps into a pocket of oil. It doesn't come close to the molten core and won't cause a volcano...otherwise we'd have caused volcanoes before. Even if it did, the huge amount of cold water would quickly cool any lava flow. Worst case scenario is an island. Scientists are only pressured to be silent if they keep putting out grossly inaccurate information year after year. Any scientist that came up with correct information in the public's interest that was being stifled would make him/herself a word hero overnight. All this stuff stinks like all the other bad internet spam that get's passed around. When was the last time you got one of these emails that turned out to be true? Usually you can check out snopes.com and get the low-down on this stuff.

momoese
06-30-2010, 08:31 AM
Oil wells eventually run dry.

Many people think this is Abiotic oil.

YouTube - origin_of_oil.wmv (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bJdNqYeVwX4&feature=related)

CoryS
06-30-2010, 09:25 AM
RobG7aChattTN said:
All this stuff stinks like all the other bad internet spam that get's passed around. When was the last time you got one of these emails that turned out to be true?

"Get this out to as many people as you can...", "extinction of all life on earth...", and "It's worse than anyone could imagine..." are some of the best leads into total bull#$%# that I've seen. And you are right about "Oil wells run dry". Thanks for that! I can't believe I didn't remember that.
As for "abiotic" oil, I still don't get. Oil is made up of the same things animals are so I don't see how it could be "abiotic". But I have heard that oil [like animals] can form just from chemicals instead of dead animals. Thanks for the youtube. :)
What I haven't heard yet: They have a machine that can xray the earth to look for dinosaur fossils. Have they used one to see how big the oil pocket is?

Jack Daw
06-30-2010, 09:48 AM
Very interesting video, thanks momo. We already have the non-oil based technology and everyone's just waiting for someone to release it into the public. These wells and everything about the oil industry has been obsolete since the first thermonuclear fusion made by Andrei Sakharov (1950s).

The more you look at it, the worse it looks. And I wonder what the situation will look like, when the hurricanes come. Alex turned away, but other hurricanes might not.

CoryS
06-30-2010, 01:11 PM
Very interesting video, thanks momo. We already have the non-oil based technology and everyone's just waiting for someone to release it into the public. These wells and everything about the oil industry has been obsolete since the first thermonuclear fusion made by Andrei Sakharov (1950s).

The more you look at it, the worse it looks. And I wonder what the situation will look like, when the hurricanes come. Alex turned away, but other hurricanes might not.

Good! :) This would be a great time to release it and shut down the oil businesses. Alex probably turned away because of the stink in the gulf. :ha: Maybe if enough people have to smell it all the time, they might turn away from using oil too. :D

momoese
06-30-2010, 04:49 PM
The more you look at it, the worse it looks. And I wonder what the situation will look like, when the hurricanes come. Alex turned away, but other hurricanes might not.

And they are predicting a very active hurricane season. Even this one that is missing the oil slick is still pushing oil north and east. The gulf is like a giant bathtub, one disturbance causes waves on all sides of it.

Pretty soon the gulf coast bananas will look something like this. :0520:

aupoet
06-30-2010, 05:07 PM
I have to say these claims seem a little over the top to me. Of course petroleum is a biotic compound and totally "natural" but that does not mean it is not toxic. I don't want it or some man-made "get it out of the public's sight" chemical dispersant in my food chain or environment. One hole in his theory that I can think of, is where he states that once the oil has all gushed out, ocean water will flow under the seabed and super heat causing a massive eruption. The oil will only gush out on its own until the pressure pushing it up equals the pressure of the seawater surrounding it. At a depth of 1 mile the seawater pressure is just over 1 ton per square inch. Now because of oil's bouyancy it may still seep out and rise into the gulf waters but that means the water can only replace it slowly not rapidly. I hope and pray we don't ever find out if this is what will happen. In my opinion we should ban all offshore drilling.

momoese
06-30-2010, 06:57 PM
Abiotic

Abiotic Oil and Gas: A Theory That Refuses To Vanish - Vinod Dar -- Seeking Alpha (http://seekingalpha.com/instablog/400230-vinod-dar/47079-abiotic-oil-and-gas-a-theory-that-refuses-to-vanish)

Abnshrek
06-30-2010, 10:52 PM
News said, they are 16 feet from completing the first relief well so almost have 2 gushers... :2725:

sbl
07-01-2010, 05:06 PM
News said, they are 16 feet from completing the first relief well so almost have 2 gushers... :2725:

I certainly hope not--this is bad enough. I haven't been to the beach, but I talked to someone that had. They said the sand where they walked lookled white, but when they got back to the car, their feet were black. He looked at the sand and said it looked like little specks of pepper in the sand--but when you walk on it, it ends up coating you feetand takes mineral spirits to remove it.

It will take months to get theis stuff off the surface of the Gulf, yrs to get this stuff out of the sand on the beach, decades to get it buried in the marshes and sediments of our bays. Even then it will get resuspended every time we get a hurricane. In reality it will probably be with us for over a century.

CoryS
07-01-2010, 05:24 PM
In my opinion we should ban all offshore drilling.

Somebody read my mind.

Jack Daw
07-01-2010, 06:22 PM
Somebody read my mind.
Agreed. When Iraqis blew the oil wells, nobody could've stopped them for 2 months. And this was all ground drilling. How did they want to do it 1500 feet below the water surface. Well, maybe they didn't want to remedy it at all.

Gardener972
07-06-2010, 03:24 PM
As of today, Texas now has tar balls washing ashore. Now we're watching another potential hurricane.

Has anyone wondered if this is an act of terrorism?

Abnshrek
07-06-2010, 05:23 PM
As of today, Texas now has tar balls washing ashore. Now we're watching another potential hurricane.
Has anyone wondered if this is an act of terrorism?

An act of stupidity and greed? Almost the same thing when it involves killing & ruining all that it will in time. Environmental Terrorism..

sbl
07-07-2010, 10:52 PM
I was just watching a report on CNN --they went out to the oyster beds and dredged up a bunch--they were all dead from the freshwater being diverted to keep the oil away. New spat cannot settle until next spring if it even can then. Then it will take 3 yrs to grow to harvest size--4 yrs gone at a minimum.

Gardener972
07-08-2010, 09:46 AM
And even then, the floor of the ocean will be contaminated. Who would want to eat those oysters or shrimp, etc.? It IS environmental terrorism.

sbl
07-08-2010, 11:10 AM
And even then, the floor of the ocean will be contaminated. Who would want to eat those oysters or shrimp, etc.? It IS environmental terrorism.

True--and that will apply for decades until the oil is buried--then it will be resuspended every time there is a hurricane--just like the PCB spill here in Pensacola Bay--released in the 60s --buried by the 80s--resuspended by Ivan--Our fish are again too contaminated with PCB to eat.

The next shrimp I buy will be farm raised on well water by a friend of mine in Port St Joe, FL--Wood's Fisheries--they should be ready in Sept/Oct.

mckoinld
07-08-2010, 12:49 PM
The environmental disaster that is occurring in the gulf is horrendous and will be with us for decades. If it weren't for that sad fact this thread would almost be comical. Some of it reads like bad science fiction! Not logical-Not possible. What happened on that rig was nothing more than a perfect storm of catastrophic events. Any one of which would have been controllable but combined led to a series of events that cost 11 lives and much heartache and financial ruin for many families. The well was under control up to the time that BP started taking short cuts. Shortcuts that they were emboldened to take because there was no enforcement of regulations and safeguards.

They were in the final stages of getting off the well which means they had been at total depth for some time. The well was under control.

There were indications that the primary cement job was not holding. Which would have meant that it would have to be re done. Not unusual or catastrophic by its self. Just costly and time consuming. After multiple failed tests one passed so it must be good.....Shortcut

The BOP had problems. Multiple problems that were not addressed no real problem as long as the cement plugs held....Shortcut

Under normal conditions there is a waiting period with the BOP closed while the cement is allowed to set. Then the BOP is opened to test the cement plug and make sure the cement is holding. The drilling mud in the well bore is then displaced with lighter saltwater, the well is capped, and the rig moved. The mud above the BOP was displaced during the waiting period to save time and money........Shortcut.

Combine all these Shortcuts with some we probably don't know about and add it to the fact that the rig emergency release from the drill pipe did not work thus causing the rig to eventually sink and carry the drill pipe to the bottom with it...... Catastrophe!!

No political Agenda
No conspiracy
Just arrogance, greed and disregard for life and the environment.

Now as to the "Oil Volcano"

Law of Logical Argument - Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about. And nothing is impossible if you don't have to do it yourself.

If you learn just a little bit about Specific Gravity, the dynamics of fluid, and the fluids that an oil well produces you would understand why this oil volcano-Tsunami-mass destruction is fiction.

The most damage done by this is through the use of dispersant. It hides the oil and won't allow it to collect and form "tar balls" that could be easily cleaned up. And by the government not allowing local interests to create temporary sand barriers to limit where the oil can be deposited. IMHO the best remedy for the marshes is to do what has been done for decades by nature and by man. Let fire cleanse and renew. BURN THE COASTAL MARSHES. Do not allow the oil to sit there and soak in.

momoese
07-08-2010, 12:57 PM
Shortcuts that they were emboldened to take because there was no enforcement of regulations and safeguards.



YouTube - The REAL REASON Behind the BP Oil Spill in the Gulf of Mexico - 2010 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77pBcf0o444&feature=related)

momoese
07-08-2010, 01:16 PM
A little more in depth, pardon the pun.

Cheney?s Culture of Deregulation and Corruption (http://www.americanprogress.org/issues/2010/06/cheney_deregulation.html)

Abnshrek
07-08-2010, 01:48 PM
What measures will they resort to.. :^)
http://www.bananas.org/gallery/watermark.php?file=33836&size=1 (http://www.bananas.org/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=33836)

mckoinld
07-08-2010, 02:03 PM
Its just as much this administrations failings as any. All the blame cannot be laid as the feet of any one administration. They have all taken money from the large oil interests. It is the oilfield culture that is the main problem. The people making the decision to push their subordinates into shortcuts are immune to repercussion of those actions. MMS agents are more interested in coffee and a news paper than what is happening on the rig. Just paperwork! No real inspection. And many cases no real world experience to know if something is not as it should be.

I'll get off my soap box now.

sbl
07-08-2010, 04:26 PM
Lonie, I agree with your earlier post about the dispersant. It is just to help BP hide how much oil was/is really being released. I don't know that much about the drilling process, but it is clear that they were cutting corners to save time and money with no concern for the risk. What I know about is the chemistry of the oil. And I know that some components of the oil--the PAHs-- are carcinogens and are very resistant to degradation. They will be with us for a long time.

What I am most worried about is the fisheries--which ones will be wiped out--will they ever recover?

momoese
07-08-2010, 04:55 PM
Lonnie the thing I'm pointing out is that due to de-regulation the acoustic switch was not installed on this well. If the company had been required to install the switch we probably would not even be talking about this now. So now we have all these other wells, some very deep like the Horizon that also have no acoustic switch on them. What now?

CoryS
07-08-2010, 10:52 PM
I agree with "arrogance, greed and disregard for life and the environment" as being what led to the disaster. Obama keeps pushing the 6 month halt to offshore drilling but if one or more existing Horizon-depth wells fails, that really won't mean much. So I too would like to know if anyone, on Capital hill or elsewhere, is considering acoustic switches to prevent new disasters.

mckoinld
07-08-2010, 11:17 PM
Mitchel the BOP failed. It did not close and seal the well. An acoustic switch is not a not a wellhead valve. It is a communications device to actuate the wellhead valve. It is used in tandem with or instead of a dead man switch. To simplify-it is a wireless switch. If you want to learn a little about it check this site
"Acoustic Switch" Would Not Have Saved BP Well - The Daily Hurricane (http://dailyhurricane.com/2010/05/acoustic-switch-would-not-have-saved-bp-well.html)

It also has some interesting comments.

On producing wells there is no BOP. There are surface safety valves and sub surface safety valves valves. These valves do not have to shear drill stem. They are fail close valves that automatically close when control pressure is lost. Totally different setup.

BP has an abysmal safety record. They and companies like them should not receive permits to drill in American waters. If BP had not cut corners...If they had operated according to industry standards this would not have happened. I am for offshore drilling. Drill baby drill. But do it by the rules and responsibly. Make safety performance a key requirement. Put teeth in the laws for those who intentionally violate the rules. And remove the cap on liability limits. It adds incentive for safe environmentally sound operation if a company stands to loose everything if they are found negligent.

Sbl I agree there is some nasty stuff that comes to the surface with hydrocarbons. The fisheries will be decimated. They will recover maybe in our lifetime if we are lucky.

momoese
07-09-2010, 12:10 AM
What say you about this?

All offshore rigs have one main switch to shut off the flow of oil by closing a valve located on the ocean floor. There is also supposed to be a backup called a “dead man,” that will shut down the well in the event of a catastrophe on the rig.

Apparently neither of these devices worked on the Deepwater Horizon rig operated by British Petroleum (BP). The crew members who would have been closest to the shutoff switch are among those missing and presumed dead. If the rig was equipped with an acoustic trigger, it would have been a last resort option and could have been activated from a remote location.

$500K device may have prevented oil spill (http://www.examiner.com/x-38220-Orlando-Independent-Examiner~y2010m5d2-500K-device-may-have-prevented-oil-spill)

I certainly am no expert, just sorting through tons of info. This seems pretty logical to me.

momoese
07-09-2010, 12:19 AM
Lonie in the link you provide they say this:

In this particular incident, something clearly jammed the shear rams in the BOP

How do they know?

mckoinld
07-09-2010, 11:03 AM
Let me see if I can explain this more clearly. A BOP is a series of valves. Some of the valves are suppose to seal around the drill stem and some have shear rams. The shear rams are the shut down device of last resort. They are suppose to cut the drill stem completely and seal the well. How do they know something jammed the shear ram? It did not seal the well.
Why it did not seal the well is something we may never know. The bottom line is BP knew there were problems with the BOP and did not correct the problems.

An acoustic switch is like a remote control. It is the thing that tells the shear rams to close. Having an acoustic switch does not change anything other than the method of signal delivery.

It does not make up for negligence.

It is not a substitute for responsible operations.

If it were placed on all wells in the GOM it would be a nice tool to have available but in some cases would not make any difference.

Let me put it this way. If you put a remote start on your car it in nice to have but if you don't maintain your car eventually it wont start.

I don't want any one to be led on by false hope. There is no quick fix that will make everything safe.

There are oil companies operating in the Gulf that are scrupulously contentious and there are companies that are totally unscrupulous.

What I'm saying is that we need more than any devices is a move to only doing business (issuing drilling permits) to companies that have demonstrated global environmental responsibility and commitment to safety.

Jack Daw
07-09-2010, 12:19 PM
Guys, it's no good discussing, you'd better discuss your future and present in that area. It has to be stopped and cleaned. Arguing baout what would have been if that hadn't happened won't change the present.
:waving:

momoese
07-09-2010, 12:19 PM
Well after reading and watching videos I get the idea how a BOP and an acoustic switch work, what I don't understand is why the BOP didn't work. Was it because it was never triggered in the first place, possibly because the crew had already been killed or was unable to activate it? If that the case then a remote acoustic switch would have worked.

I still think this whole thing sounds fishy. I'm just not buying that the shear was jammed without solid proof.

Guys, it's no good discussing, you'd better discuss your future and present in that area. It has to be stopped and cleaned. Arguing baout what would have been if that hadn't happened won't change the present.
:waving:

I disagree Jack. If this happened on one it can on others too. Things need to be looked at and fixed asap before we have another disaster on our hands.

Jack Daw
07-09-2010, 01:38 PM
I disagree Jack. If this happened on one it can on others too. Things need to be looked at and fixed asap before we have another disaster on our hands.
Since the BP Gulf of Mexico problems, 3 separate drilling wells collapsed. One in Northern Ocean (oil), one in Venezuela (gas, article maybe here (http://www.boston.com/news/world/latinamerica/articles/2010/05/14/chvez_reports_gas_platform_has_sunk_off_venezuela_coast/)) and one in the Pacific (oil). In all of these cases, regulated by the same international standards, preemptive systems and people managed to close everything so that no damage of those proportions has been caused (except the platforms collapsed, nothing really happened).

What happened in Gulf of Mexico is a tragedy, but not a problem of norms or technology, apparently. It would seem that it was either deliberate "solution" (I don't know to which end, yet), or absolute and utter ignorance of any rules, in which case it doesn't really matter, what mechanism wasn't present/didn't work, if it simply wasn't present only because nobody really cared about the regulations. As we've seen in the past months, similar platform problems were dealt with (even without broader public finding out) and no damage to the enviroment has been done in those cases either.

momoese
07-09-2010, 01:43 PM
Interesting. Did they have acoustic switches on them?

Jack Daw
07-09-2010, 01:55 PM
Interesting. Did they have acoustic switches on them?
I don't really know that, try browsing on the net, but I doubt that any platform is actually secured only by one fail-safe mechanism, there's always even a reserve of a reserve. Just like in electrodistribution network.

mckoinld
07-09-2010, 03:20 PM
My intent was not to argue a point but to educate. Either you didn't read my explanation or just simply don't under stand. Oil field control systems are simple if you understand them and unfathomable if you have no experience with them. A rig and a platform are totally different structures with totally different safety shut down systems.

Either way I'm done. Back to planting things and petting horses.

momoese
07-09-2010, 04:26 PM
Same here, not trying to argue with you, just trying to understand and compare notes from what your saying to what's being said elsewhere. Thanks for trying Lonie! :)

Jack Daw
07-10-2010, 07:35 AM
Maybe I couldn't find the proper word. Sorry guys, cheer up. Oil spill how people see it...

YouTube - BP Spills Coffee (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AAa0gd7ClM)

Jack Daw
07-16-2010, 03:30 PM
In celebration of what seems to be a succesful leak test, I give you...
The Real News. :ha:

http://de.trinixy.ru/pics4/20100716/podborka_24.jpg

Gardener972
07-16-2010, 06:08 PM
Great picture! We do have a warped society focusing on the wrong thing, don't we? Meanwhile, how many people are out of work and for how long? How many animals, birds, fish, etc. have died and will be dying? All to feed our addiction to oil and to fill our giant gas-guzzlers.

momoese
07-16-2010, 10:31 PM
You want to talk about warped, I heard an interview with a man that was unemployed until he was hired to perform clean up on the beach. He said "this oil spill is a god send"

Jack Daw
07-17-2010, 06:28 AM
You want to talk about warped, I heard an interview with a man that was unemployed until he was hired to perform clean up on the beach. He said "this oil oil spill is a god send"
I wonder how he will be talking about it 20 years from now. I've read that there are not many survivors of Exxon Valdez cleaning party. They have a nice expactancy age of 56. ;) About 20 years less than our average.

momoese
07-17-2010, 09:25 AM
I wonder how he will be talking about it 20 years from now. I've read that there are not many survivors of Exxon Valdez cleaning party. They have a nice expactancy age of 56. ;) About 20 years less than our average.

I heard it was 52. They never gave them safety equipment that could deal with the toxic oil dispersant "Corexit" Some things never change!

aupoet
07-17-2010, 03:56 PM
As we've seen in the past months, similar platform problems were dealt with (even without broader public finding out) and no damage to the enviroment has been done in those cases either.

And just what proof do you have that no enviromental damage was done in those cases? The words of the party/parties responsible maybe or the reports being put out by some government reporting agency. Yeah, there are no motives for either one of them to push lies off onto the public are there? I live along the Gulf Coast and all I keep hearing are the lies about how everyone should come on down to the beach, the water is fine and the seafood is safe. Yet the beach cleaners are still wearing hazmat suits and the fish kills are increasing. One of our local news stations conducted water tests for the levels of petroleum hydrocarbons in several area Gulf waters. They collected water samples right along the beach fronts in Orange Beach, Gulf Shores, and Dauphin Island. They then collected water samples up the beach some 20 yards from the surf, after digging down into the sand and letting the water seep into the hole. They also collected sand samples and finally they collected a sample farther out near one of the oil booms. All the samples looked clean without any noticeable cloudyness or oil droplets. The chemist found levels of petroleum hydrocarbons in the water samples from 16 to over 200 parts per million and said normally they should be undectable or under 5 parts per million. The sample taken off the boom could not be tested because it exploded in his lab when he added a solvent to it to get the hydrocarbons to parcipitate out. The government and media keep telling the public that the beaches are safe yet they post signs telling those with weakened immune systems, who might be pregnant, or young children should stay out of the water. Oh yes, the beach sand samples and waters taken higher on the beach had the highest levels of contaminants. I have yet to hear anything about any government tests being conducted. It was just reported yesterday that sand is being hauled in from New Jersey to cover up the oil soaked beach sand rather than cleaning it up and guess what they are doing with all the oily sand and tar balls they are collecting -it is all going to our local landfills to leach out and pollute our ground water. The government and its bedfellow the big oil companies are both white washing this disaster and trying to hide everything from the publics eye as fast as possible. People such as yourself are only helping them by believing them when they say that "No damage has been done".

Jack Daw
07-17-2010, 05:17 PM
And just what proof do you have that no enviromental damage was done in those cases? The words of the party/parties responsible maybe or the reports being put out by some government reporting agency. Yeah, there are no motives for either one of them to push lies off onto the public are there? I live along the Gulf Coast and all I keep hearing are the lies about how everyone should come on down to the beach, the water is fine and the seafood is safe. Yet the beach cleaners are still wearing hazmat suits and the fish kills are increasing. One of our local news stations conducted water tests for the levels of petroleum hydrocarbons in several area Gulf waters. They collected water samples right along the beach fronts in Orange Beach, Gulf Shores, and Dauphin Island. They then collected water samples up the beach some 20 yards from the surf, after digging down into the sand and letting the water seep into the hole. They also collected sand samples and finally they collected a sample farther out near one of the oil booms. All the samples looked clean without any noticeable cloudyness or oil droplets. The chemist found levels of petroleum hydrocarbons in the water samples from 16 to over 200 parts per million and said normally they should be undectable or under 5 parts per million. The sample taken off the boom could not be tested because it exploded in his lab when he added a solvent to it to get the hydrocarbons to parcipitate out. The government and media keep telling the public that the beaches are safe yet they post signs telling those with weakened immune systems, who might be pregnant, or young children should stay out of the water. Oh yes, the beach sand samples and waters taken higher on the beach had the highest levels of contaminants. I have yet to hear anything about any government tests being conducted. It was just reported yesterday that sand is being hauled in from New Jersey to cover up the oil soaked beach sand rather than cleaning it up and guess what they are doing with all the oily sand and tar balls they are collecting -it is all going to our local landfills to leach out and pollute our ground water. The government and its bedfellow the big oil companies are both white washing this disaster and trying to hide everything from the publics eye as fast as possible. People such as yourself are only helping them by believing them when they say that "No damage has been done".
I haven't read about dead fauna and flora covered in oil lying all over the beaches or floating on the water. That's why I assumed it wasn't that big of deal.

Blogs and other form of alternative media would be all over these types of things (like they were in the case of BP spill and other envirocatastrophes).

sbl
07-17-2010, 05:41 PM
What kind of pictures would you like to see---oil covered birds, dead sea turtles, dead dolphins, dead whales, dead oysters--they are all out there.

jeffreyp
07-27-2010, 06:55 AM
Video - Breaking News Videos from CNN.com (http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2010/07/26/mattingly.oil.spill.flyover.cnn)